1 (edited by hriwi 2021-09-24 08:35:52)

Topic: Play music from an Android phone?

Hi everyone
Im thinking of buying a ADI-2 DAC FS but im not sure that it works to stream music (tidal, spotify) from an Android(9) phone.
The manual only says Iphone.

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

CC mode works with android. I use Neutron player, comes recomended by RME.

ADI-2 DAC, ADI-2 PRO, DigifaceUSB, UCXII, ARC, HEGEL.h80, KEF.ls50, HD650, ie400pro _,.\''/.,_

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

Im sorry but what is cc mode?

4 (edited by ramses 2021-09-24 10:14:24)

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

CC is USB "Class Compliant" mode, I found some information for you on the old RME "archive" webspace:
https://archiv.rme-audio.de/en/support/ … c_mode.php
https://archiv.rme-audio.de/support/tec … c_mode.php

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

Its a plug and play protocol. Just connect your phone into the ADI and it just works right away. You could plug a mouse and keyboard right into your phone.  https://www.sweetwater.com/insync/class-compliant/

ADI-2 DAC, ADI-2 PRO, DigifaceUSB, UCXII, ARC, HEGEL.h80, KEF.ls50, HD650, ie400pro _,.\''/.,_

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

Yes, it works without problem. I use USB Audio Player Pro. But the sound quality is not the same as playback by Foobar from PC. I don't know why but it is not - even if bitperfect or DSD playback skipping Android mixer.

ADI-2 DAC, Digiface USB, Fireface UCXII, ARC USB, Neumann MA1 aligned monitors

7 (edited by KaiS 2021-09-26 06:52:47)

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

audafreak wrote:

I use USB Audio Player Pro. But the sound quality is not the same as playback by Foobar from PC. I don't know why but it is not - even if bitperfect or DSD playback skipping Android mixer.

You mean you get BitTest confirmation on ADI-2 for both PC and Android?
But still it sounds different for the exact same audiofile?

Otherwise (no BitTest confirmation) it might well be that Windows changes the sound, it‘s notorious for using low quality Sample Rate Conversion in default setups.
The resulting extra treble, in fact distortions, might sound like an “improvement” on superficial listening.
Only when listening closer the treble smearing becomes obvious.
Or it’s simply different loudness levels.


If feed with the same files I can’t hear the slightest difference between various sources, PC, iDevice, CD/DVD-Player, AppleTV, ... USB, AppleCCK-USB, SPDIF optical, coax.

ADI-2 eats it all in the same ultimate quality.

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

audafreak wrote:

Yes, it works without problem. I use USB Audio Player Pro. But the sound quality is not the same as playback by Foobar from PC. I don't know why but it is not - even if bitperfect or DSD playback skipping Android mixer.

Bitperfect means no change of original audio signal (no volume changes or other sound degradations of "Windows audio").

If it sounds different then it can only be for these reasons:
- you are using different volume levels, louder sounds better to our ears
- too much time between A/B comparisons

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

9 (edited by Curt962 2021-09-25 21:00:52)

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

Audafreak,

Interesting.   Are you saying that you downloaded the RME Bit Test files to your Android, and when played via the RME, you received the big, white, "Bit Test Passed" confirmation screen?

If you didn't...we're only guessing here.  "Bit-Test" is unforgiving of even the slightest alteration of the data,  and if the bit test file data received by your RME does not precisely match the imbedded bit test Template...Bork!!  Nothing happens.  No White Screen of Success. There is no "Fail" Screen (It has to be done like this else every Song we played would have the RME Screaming "Fail"  because the Audio Data does not match the Test Template)

Ok..

Take another look at this!  Be certain you're actually PASSING the test...not merely "running" the test.

Bit Test is Cool!   

Curt

To give you an example, this is what a Bit Test Pass Screen looks like:

https://i.ibb.co/bNMycVD/20210702-153244.jpg

Vintage 2018 ADI-2 DAC. "Classic AKM4490 Edition"
Cables:  Red, and White Ones.
Speakers:  Yes

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

Happy_amateur wrote:

CC mode works with android. I use Neutron player, comes recomended by RME.

Just tried neutron, it’s crap on iPad, freezing up  laggy
Absolutely useless. £7 down the drain.

God knows why I bought it,
Thank god for volumio and my beloved pi 4

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

Well excuse me! Bought the app from recomendation in this forum. Works on Android...

ADI-2 DAC, ADI-2 PRO, DigifaceUSB, UCXII, ARC, HEGEL.h80, KEF.ls50, HD650, ie400pro _,.\''/.,_

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

Check this out: https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.ph … 19#p149819

ADI-2 DAC, ADI-2 PRO, DigifaceUSB, UCXII, ARC, HEGEL.h80, KEF.ls50, HD650, ie400pro _,.\''/.,_

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

Sad U couldnt make it work. Neutron is featured specked ++ and very capable. Lots of DSP functions.

ADI-2 DAC, ADI-2 PRO, DigifaceUSB, UCXII, ARC, HEGEL.h80, KEF.ls50, HD650, ie400pro _,.\''/.,_

14

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

Don't worry, works on iOS as well. Neutron has a BIG user base, for many years, on both Android and iOS.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

I was talking about playback:
- PC via ASIO - no change in volume
- Android phone via direct USB outside mixer - USB Audio Player Pro, similar to Neutron, it has more functions like Tidal...
Both bitperfect and in case of DSD in native mode on Android DoP in Foobar. The same files, of course. From data content point of view no problem. But in case of Android not so clean sound.

There are lot of things which can affect playback, even different usb ports in the same pc - see page 61 in ADI2 DAC manual or page 113 in UCX2 manual. Also number of installed sw running in background, installed usb drivers for each port (which devices were already plugged in).
Especially in Android number of installed programs is important because many are running in background and I have lot of them - around user 300 software packages. Normal user has over 100. Some are sleeping, but all are hanged on different events like touch, display on, off, network on off, there are tens of such events which start lot of sw in background what you usually don't know. Most Android apps are very aggressive and selfish in taking CPU time.
Shortly said there is lot of sw running in background which user does not know about. If you switch on display then 8 cores processor is running 20-70 % for very long time.  Try for instance CPU Stats - you will see. This is how Android is designed - very different philosophy then Windows.
On PC there is not unusual that usb controller has not only available usb ports but also for instance integrated card reader, bluetooth transmitter maybe also others. How it is in Android I don't know but it wont be much better because of limited size.
Another chapter can be noise generated by the phone.
As a sw developer (35 years of developing of many different kind of applications including device drivers) I can imagine many problematic SW things.

But this is not what I wanted to talk about. Just wanted to share my own experience with my own PC and my Android phone.
Maybe on clean Windows installation and empty powerful Android phone situation is different but this is only laboratory case. Real world is usually different.

ADI-2 DAC, Digiface USB, Fireface UCXII, ARC USB, Neumann MA1 aligned monitors

16 (edited by Curt962 2021-09-26 14:49:03)

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

Audafreak,

Hi again!

I'm really struggling to make this mysterious sq difference compute.   Two (2) Level-Matched, Verified Bit Perfect data streams should by definition be indistinguishable from one another.

We don't do well here with Audio Voodoo, so as others have pointed out, I think the most plausible explanation is perhaps related to a dis-continuity in the method of comparison.

I am amongst those who have been completely fooled by MASSIVE, Paradigm Shifting "differences" that Vanished when subjected to a True, Blind Test.

Long Story short, when I'm pushing the buttons, I hear HUGE differences.  When my Wife pushes the Buttons?   I sit bewildered, as my Golden-Ear Certification is placed in serious jeapordy. wink

We begin to get into "Bias", and other forms of Psychacoustic phenomenon to which we Humanoids are extremely vulnerable. 

Perhaps review your Test Methodology, and enlist the help of another devious Soul to assist with the Test.   Expect to be surprised (if not Humbled)  at the outcome.

Best,

Curt

Vintage 2018 ADI-2 DAC. "Classic AKM4490 Edition"
Cables:  Red, and White Ones.
Speakers:  Yes

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

Yes, of course it was not blind test, I know arguments like this, I also use them sometimes. I just connected DAC to phone and sound was not as I was used to. So I played it via Foobar and it was again as I was used to.
I did some blind testing in the past but to say the truth after some time I was not able to distinguish anything - I forgot even what is my name.

So take it only as my personal feeling. Anybody can try with his own phone and have his own experience. I tried it with 3 different DACs with similar results - but I agree my bias can be against mobile phones. But idea "no difference" can be also bias.

Does anybody use some old cheap Android phone as quality music server/DLNA server/renderer for instance with another phone as a controller? It would be good replacement for special PCs with special USB cards.

ADI-2 DAC, Digiface USB, Fireface UCXII, ARC USB, Neumann MA1 aligned monitors

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

Auda,

I think we're inching closer to the truth here.  Take Heart! 

*Note:  Forgetting your own Name is a very real phenomenon that occurs when your Audiophile credibility is being put to the test such as that which occurs in a Blind, Level-Matched, A/B/X test.

I love my Android.  I travel a LOT, and it's my Pocket-Sized HIFI at those times.  At home, the 'Droid serves as a Remote for my Raspberry Pi, and does extra duty as a portal for SPAM email, and Robo-Callers. But that's about it.

Back on Topic...

Let's have you subject yourself to the aforementioned challenges, and see if there really IS a significant difference.

Most importantly, have fun, and enjoy listening!

Curt

Vintage 2018 ADI-2 DAC. "Classic AKM4490 Edition"
Cables:  Red, and White Ones.
Speakers:  Yes

Re: Play music from an Android phone?

Yes, Android with portable dac is realy good traveling device, I have 512GB card in the phone, small Fiio BTR5 dac connected via USB and wired small balanced IEMs. Great for music outside home, mostly during walks. Plays any pcm or dsd file or stream Tidal mqa unfolded via UAPP with different portable dacs for years.
Thats why I tried it also with bigger home dac.
RPi is used often in audio, I know. But not good for me, I need more powerfull cpu for work with audio and video and many connections. I have NUC with 6 cores/12 threads@4GHz and everything (display,net,disks,mouse,keyboard,tv stick,BD drive) connected via thunderbolt dock not to interfere with USB. DAC is the only device on usb. BT and SD card disabled.

ADI-2 DAC, Digiface USB, Fireface UCXII, ARC USB, Neumann MA1 aligned monitors