• Registered: 2017-03-22
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Topic: Migrate to RME hardware

Hi,

I am currently using a MOTU 8A and I was considering obtaining another one to use via AVB, but I am wondering about RME, since I am also considering a custom PC.

The MOTU has an internal 48 channel mixer, with 128 internal "computer channels", so does any RME device function in the same way, that is I do not need external I/O, I just need as large as is possible internal channel count, even using 44.1KHz @ 24bit.

I only really need compression, since all of my sounds are VST based so is this possible in DSP, since I use UAD to mix and need transparent recording.

Thank you for any replies.

2 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2026-09-01 08:15:05)

  • ramses
  • ramses
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Re: Migrate to RME hardware

I am not sure whether I fully understand your requirements and your workflow (the signal chain).

Can you detail the signal chain? Do you have a diagram of such a setup?

Usually you mix in the DAW, and you do not have such a high channel count on the recording interface.
The recording interface's mixer only has to handle the number of channels based on its own I/O ports.
You need a DAW anyway because TotalMix FX does not have any audio tracks, nor does it load any VST or VSTi.

You can send every DAW channel to TotalMix FX, and then this audio would show up in the middle row
which is called "Software Playbacks". This is audio that originates on the computer. Be it from the OS, the DAW, or any other application.

Regarding FX (e.g. compressor), you would need an RME recording interface with a DSP chip for FX.
All interfaces mentioned below have such a DSP and offer, besides FX, also RoomEQ and Crossfeed.
You have only one FX channel in TotalMix and you can decide how many FX you want per channel.
So if you would like to work with FX on a track basis, then you better do this in the DAW.

If you need 128 channels in the DAW and you want to send all those channels to TotalMix FX,
then you need a 128-channel interface; otherwise you wouldn't have 128 channels in SW playbacks.
The number of SW playback channels equals the number of HW outputs.
Normally you send only certain DAW groups of instruments to TotalMix if you would like to use TotalMix FX
as a monitoring mixer to give more versatility in creating headphone / monitoring mixes.

From there you can route those channels to any real HW output (TM FX bottom row) for whatever purpose
- monitoring
- send audio to an external device
- loopback recording.

RME has recording interfaces with such a high channel count.
But then those interfaces also have a high channel count in terms of I/O port.

A few examples (USB, PCIe based recording interfaces, except network interfaces for AVB, Dante)

UFX III (USB3  based) with 94 I/O ports in and out (not exactly 128)
HDSPe MADI FX (PCIe based) with 194 I/O ports in and out
MADIface XT II (USB3 based) with 198 I/O ports in and out

you say> I use UAD to mix

This is what I also do not understand about your concept.
- Usually you have a DAW to mix, master, export audio
- The recording interface for I/O (recording, monitoring, external hardware/FX, stereo sum, connecting external mastering chain, recording from external mastering chain).

What is now "I use UAD to mix" in your setup?

BR Ramses - HDSPe MADI FX, M-1620 Pro D, 12Mic, UFX III, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, Nuendo 15, Win10 IoT Ent

3 Reply by compositor1 (edited by compositor1 2026-09-01 07:35:29)

  • Registered: 2017-03-22
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Re: Migrate to RME hardware

Thank you for writing.

It has been some time since I have looked into RME interfaces but while my MOTU is running fine, I would be happy to change.

Basically, I don't need hardware i/o, since I don't record externally, I only record the output of VSTi's to audio tracks so there are no microphones at all, which is where the interface I have works really well.

The reason I am asking about RME, is I read about a Loopback function, but I believe it is only for routing audio between applications, not within the same application, e.g., Nuendo.

I was under the impression that RME interfaces allowed you to use either internal or external hardware i/o so I am hoping I am not wrong in this regard, since if RME interfaces allow such a configuration, then RME is what I will buy next and not be concerned about networked audio.

I was thinking about UAD but many of their interfaces only have digital inputs, of which I need an output as well, to feed into a TC Electronic BMC-2, and Avantone monitors.

Best

4 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2026-09-01 08:41:39)

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Re: Migrate to RME hardware

> The reason I am asking about RME, is I read about a Loopback function, but I believe it is only
> for routing audio between applications, not within the same application, e.g., Nuendo.

Loopback function is easily explained.

You activate loopback on an HW output, and then you can record audio on the corresponding input.
So if you enable loopback on HW Output AN 1/2 you can record it on HW Input AN 1/2 using your DAW.
Depending on the interface, the loopback function is implemented either pre-fader or post-fader.

Only as a hint: the input signal of HW Input AN 1/2 in the example above is not lost when using
the loopback function. It still can be routed to other outputs.

It can be an advantage to have more I/O than needed, because then you can use e.g. digital output channels
like ADAT or MADI, which might be free, for such loopback purposes without blocking the I/O ports from/to the outside, where devices are connected.

> I was under the impression that RME interfaces allowed you to use either internal or external hardware i/o
> so I am hoping I am not wrong in this regard, since if RME interfaces allow such a configuration,
> then RME is what I will buy next and not be concerned about networked audio.`

Can you detail what you mean?
SPDIF, ADAT, MADI I/O for connecting preamps, ad/da converters, monitor controllers, digital monitors?

So it looks like, at the end, you might just need a normal recording interface with the I/O and features that you need.

What is your budget for a recording interface and what type of interface do you need?
USB based or PCIe based?

BR Ramses - HDSPe MADI FX, M-1620 Pro D, 12Mic, UFX III, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, Nuendo 15, Win10 IoT Ent

5 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2026-09-01 09:33:54)

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Re: Migrate to RME hardware

Your TC BMC-2 has digital inputs and analog outputs for connecting active monitors

1) Digiface USB - a minimum setup...
==========================

...might look like this if ADAT or optical SPDIF can be used as protocol.

PC/Apple
|
| USB2
|
Digiface USB---ADAT1 OUT----[ADAT or SPDIF(o)]---->ADAT IN---TC BMC-2---Analog Out--->Avalone Monitors

Digiface USB - https://www.thomann.de/de/rme_digiface_usb.htm     415 €


Options

I think you do not require the TC, you could let the recording interface to perform D/A, as it will most likely have more modern converters anyway.


2) Using UCX II
===========

Another valid approach would be to use an UCX II to get more useful features in, like
- FX, RoomEQ, Crossfeed
- 2 mic inputs with 75 dB gain
- Autoset
- DURec (for standalone recordings or as a backup to DAW recording)
- MIDI support
- WC support

PC/Apple---USB2---ARC USB (optional)
|
| USB2
|
UCX II---Analog Out--->Avalone Monitors
                \----Phones Out---Headphone

UCX II - https://www.thomann.de/de/rme_fireface_ucx_ii.htm 1239 €


3) Digiface USB and RME reference converter
================================

Also a very nice solution, the combination of recording interface and RME reference converter.
The reference converter deliver excellent conversion quality and offer uniq features.
The first of the new series of reference converters is the ADI-2 Pro EX.
General information about reference converters capabilities and use cases you find in their manual
and also in my blog article.
https://www.rme-audio.de/downloads/adi2proex_e.pdf
https://www.tonstudio-forum.de/blog/Ent … ses-EN-DE/
https://www.tonstudio-forum.de/blog/Ent … our-Setup/


PC/Apple---USB2----------------------------------------------------+ for firmware updates and
|                                                                                           | remote control using ADI-2 remote
| USB2                                                                                  | or for playing DSD via USB
|                                                                                           |
Digiface USB---ADAT1 OUT----[SPDIF(o)]----ADAT IN---ADI-2 Pro EX---AN1/2 OUT---Avalone act. Monitors
                   \---ADAT1 IN<----[SPDIF(o)]---ADAT OUT---/                  \---AN3/4 OUT---Headphone


A combination of a recording interface and RME reference converter is the best solution.
The reference converter would fully substitute the demand for a monitor controller
and would offer many more very useful features for monitoring or also headphone linearization.

Instead of the Digiface USB, you can use any other RME recording interface with other interesting capabilities.

I chose the Digiface USB because the price is low, so that you can better afford the RME reference converter.
Under the assumption that the whole solution should not cost more than ~2400 €.

Digiface USB - https://www.thomann.de/de/rme_digiface_usb.htm     415 €
ADI-2 Pro EX - https://www.thomann.de/de/rme_adi_2_pro_ex.htm 1989 €

BR Ramses - HDSPe MADI FX, M-1620 Pro D, 12Mic, UFX III, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, Nuendo 15, Win10 IoT Ent
  • Kubrak
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Re: Migrate to RME hardware

Side note, Digiface USB does not have DSP effects and OP spoke, that he would need DSP compressor, if I have understood him correctly.

If OP really requires DSP compressor and has rather limited budget, then seconhand Fireface UCX might do the job. UCX II is also good solution, if budget allows.

And sure Digiface USB could do the job, if DSP is not required.

FF UCX II, Digiface USB, Babyface Pro FS

7 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2026-09-02 08:57:36)

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Re: Migrate to RME hardware

Yes Kubrak, correct, I am anyway writing an addition, thanks for the hint!

With my proposals I have addressed your needs for monitoring, but maybe not well enough the requirements
- for plenty of outputs for Loopback Recording and
- "FX" (compressor) - mentioned by Kubrak

FX would work well as "EQ" and "Dynamics" (compressor) are in TM FX implemented on a per channel base.
Only reverb/delay uses a shared effect bus, where you can set the intensity (dry/wet) per channel.

Audio Flow for DAW/loopback recording

Here again the audio flow for the loopback recording from DAW through TM FX Lo recording back to the DAW.

DAW                                                         TotalMix FX                                            DAW
Nuendo                                   SW Playbacks   Routing    HW Output                         Nuendo (recording)
-------------------------------      -------------------             -----------------                   -----------------------
Track 1/2 -> HW Output 1/2      SW Playback 1/2------->  HW Output 1/2    Loopback  HW Input 1/2
Track 3/4 -> HW Output 3/4      SW Playback 3/4-----/
Track 3/4 -> HW Output 5/6      SW Playback 5/6------->  HW Output 5/6    Loopback  HW Input 5/6
Track 3/4 -> HW Output 7/8      SW Playback 7/8------->  HW Output 7/8    Loopback  HW Input 7/8

Ideal Interface

So ideal would be an interface with FX and high channel count, but ideally not too many I/O ports (Mic Inputs, Analog Channels) that would increase the price too much.

PCIe based solution

The ideal solution is the HDSPe MADI FX PCIe card with 3 MADI buses: 3 x 64 = 192 channels at single speed.
The card has 390 channels (194 input and 196 output channels)
Additionally:
- AES I/O
- Phones Output on the card
- Word Clock
- 1x MIDI I/O
- 3x "MIDI over MADI" I/O
and what also could be very interesting:
- Full implementation of FX chip
- RoomEQ and Crossfeed (newer cards)

- HDSPe MADI FX -  https://www.thomann.de/de/rme_hdspe_madi_fx.htm
            390 channels (194 input and 196 output channels) € 1349 / 196 = € 6,88 pro port

If something USB3 based is needed

- UFX III https://www.thomann.de/de/rme_fireface_ufx_iii.htm
          188 channels (94 inputs and 94 outputs)        € 2326 / 94 = € 24,74 pro port
- XT II    https://www.thomann.de/de/rme_madiface_xt_ii.htm
           394 channels (196 inputs and 198 outputs)   € 1949 / 198 = € 9,84 pro port

To sum up

EDIT: The HDSPe MADI FX PCIe card alone with a price of € 1349 has the lowest per (output) port cost of € 6,88.
BUT you will need an DA converter (this card only provides a phones output).
It could be used as line level port, but unbalanced, which I wouldn't propose with such a solution.
Balanced connections are far less susceptible to hum and electrical noise.

See my later posting, it gives you now two options.
https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.ph … 84#p254384

BR Ramses - HDSPe MADI FX, M-1620 Pro D, 12Mic, UFX III, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, Nuendo 15, Win10 IoT Ent

8 Reply by compositor1 (edited by compositor1 2026-09-02 02:43:17)

  • Registered: 2017-03-22
  • Posts: 16

Re: Migrate to RME hardware

I have only researched, over many years even before the days pre-USB so I now have a choice, as to which form factor I use.

Saying that, I appreciate the understanding of the complexities, but I will try to simplify my question since it seems difficult to me, and I thought MOTO routing was difficult so here goes...

...I need an interface that has a massive channel count by todays' standards so I will be happy to pay for that, so long as the processing is all done on the same card and nothing actually leaves the computer, unless it is a stereo mix.

Also, nothing enters the computer, except via the web, that is sample libraries and VST plug-in's.

Google Gemini says that the routing systems of both MOTU and RME use a matrix, so I am up for that say, if for example, a MADIface, or a DIGIface, via USB means I can get something bigger but which is not necessarily equal to what I currently have now, which gives me 128 channels of total IO.

Those channels all have access to inline effects such as parametric equalisation, as well as compression and filtering, also effects on the stereo buss but as for the latter I have no use for, it as I use the DAW purely as a tape machine that I can record with and mix, as well as master stereo mix files at 44.1Khz @24bit.

So, whatever hardware I/O is available, it will be most likely be ignored and I am not interested in Networked Audio in any case, even though I know RME support all 3 standards.

Again, whatever I/O exists physically, I will only consider price at that point since there is the possibility that I will be recording live musicians at some point.

Cheers

  • waedi
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Re: Migrate to RME hardware

What you describe is HDSP PCIe MADI FX or UFX lll

If your computer has PCIe slot I would take the PCIe card and add specific MADI expansion devices.

M1-Tahoe, Madiface Pro, Digiface USB, Babyface silver and blue

10 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2026-09-02 10:14:50)

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Re: Migrate to RME hardware

Sorry, if the previous sounded too complicated. It's difficult to find the right balance.
Some people prefer more detailed information, some less.
I wanted to be sure that I understood your demand well by making it more detailed wink

This is now the condensed form.

  • RME products and TotalMix FX are fine for your work.

  • Loopback recording is implemented in TotalMix FX for all RME recording interfaces.

  • As you need EQ and a compressor, you need a recording interface that supports FX, as it needs a dedicated DSP for FX. Not all models have it. Digiface USB doesn't have it, for example, but it has too few channels anyway.

  • TotalMix FX is the product name of the mixer; it has support for FX, but only if the hardware (recording interface) has support for it. With HDSPe MADI FX, you are fine. BTW this is the only PCIe card with FX, RoomEQ and Crossfeed.

  • The same applies to the latest features, RoomEQ and Crossfeed; it needs this additional DSP for FX. For the HDSPe MADI FX, the newer/latest versions of this card are needed. This is only meant as a hint, if you should intend to buy it from the used market.

If you want to have 128 channels like you did with the MOTU and maybe even more,
I would recommend the HDSPe MADI FX PCIe card.

PC Case requirements

- 1 free PCIe 1.1 x1 socket (every mainboard fulfills this demand, as PCIe is fully backward compatible)
- 1 free socket in the case for the daughter card, which is connected to the main card per ribbon cable.

Final Solution, HW requirements

You need the HDSPe MADI FX, but this card alone has only a phones output.
It can be used as a line-level port for connecting active monitors, but this is only an unbalanced connection.
For such a solution I would prefer/recommend balanced connections.
Balanced connections are far less susceptible to hum and electrical noise.

The best solution would be to use one of the RME reference converter which can be connected by AES.
AES has the additional benefit of providing a galvanic isolation against hum.

Output Ports which you can use for DAW tracks and loopback recording: 196 (minus a few for monitoring)

HDSPe MADI FX - https://www.thomann.de/de/rme_hdspe_madi_fx.htm € 1349
ADI-2 Pro EX     - https://www.thomann.de/de/rme_adi_2_pro_ex.htm   € 1989
SUMM                                                                                                 € 3338
optional:
ARC USB           - https://www.thomann.de/de/rme_arc_usb.htm           €   144
TOTAL                                                                                                € 3482

Per SW Playback port cost (to fulfill your needs) excluding AD/DA converter: 1349 / 196 = €   6,88
Per SW Playback port cost including AD/DA converter and ARC USB:             3482 / 196 = € 17,77

Price Tip: if this additional RME Reference Converter (ADI-2 Pro EX) is too expensive, then look at the used market for the older models which are also excellent and up to now all got the same firmware (programmable features):
- ADI-2 Pro FS
- ADI-2 Pro FS R BE
- ADI-2/4 Pro SE

Connection diagram

   +---USB----optional: ARC USB (Remote Control for TotalMix FX control room)
  /
PC---USB2---------------------------------------------+ optional USB connection for:
|                                                                        | - remote controlling the ADI-2 Pro with a nice GUI
| PCIe 1.1-5                                                        | - firmware upgrades
|                                                                         | - DSD playback
|                                                                         | - alternatively the unit can be connected stand-alone
|                                                                         |
HDSPe MADI FX---AES OUT------------AES IN---ADI-2 Pro EX---Analog 1/2---Active Monitors
                    \---AES IN-------------AES OUT---/                \---Analog 3/4---Headphone


Plan B - MADIface XT II

If the additional reference converter is too expensive, then there is a 2nd option to use the MADIface XT II USB3 interface, which also concentrates on MADI and only a few I/O ports.

You should get the XT II (not the XT) because this device also supports RoomEQ. If you do not have the Reference Converter in your solution, then you can use the 9-band PEQ of RoomEQ to linearize your headphones, if needed.
Or to perform room correction by using the EQ, it can, e.g., import the EQ settings of Sonarworks.

If you want, you can also connect an RME reference converter now or later.
You can connect it easily by using the AES port (through a breakout cable).

Connection diagram:

PC---USB------optional: ARC USB
|
| USB3
|
MADIface XT II---Analog Out---Active Monitors
                    \---Phones Out---Headphones

Price Overview

Output Ports which you can use for DAW tracks and loopback recording: 198 (minus a few for monitoring)

MADIface XT II - https://www.thomann.de/de/rme_madiface_xt_ii.htm   € 1949

optional:
ARC USB           - https://www.thomann.de/de/rme_arc_usb.htm           €   144
TOTAL                                                                                                € 2093

optional:
ADI-2 Pro EX     - https://www.thomann.de/de/rme_adi_2_pro_ex.htm   € 1989
TOTAL                                                                                                € 4082

Per SW Playback port cost (to fulfill your needs) excluding optional components: 2093 / 198 = € 10,57
Per SW Playback port cost including AD/DA converter and ARC USB:                  4082 / 198 = € 20,62

My Conclusions

The best value you will definitively have if you enhance your monitoring by the quality and features of a RME reference converter. If you put all costs together, then the combination of HDSPe MADI FX and reference converter gives you the best price and the best features.

The recording interface (PCIe card) is in the PC case, and you have only the reference converter close to your desk where you can easily connect your headphone.

If the computer is located in a machine room, this poses no problem: AES cable runs of 100 m or more are feasible, depending on the capacitance and attenuation of the cable. Due to AES you have also galvanic isolation which is a perfect solution.

BR Ramses - HDSPe MADI FX, M-1620 Pro D, 12Mic, UFX III, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, Nuendo 15, Win10 IoT Ent