1 Topic by jthk (edited by jthk 2020-07-12 17:11:05)

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Topic: ADI-2 DAC WASAPI, 16/24 bit, and Windows Spatial Sound API

The WASAPI driver only lets the user select 32 bit depth options. This is problematic because the Windows 10 spatial sound API requires 16 or 24 bit depth. Consequently, Dolby Atmos for Headphones and DTS Headphone: X cannot be turned on because they are incompatible with 32 bit depth. While the ASIO driver seemingly fixes this problem, ASIO comes with other trade offs, like incompatible bit depth switching in Tidal.

Are there any plans to support 16 or 24 bit depth with WASAPI in Windows sound settings?

In addition, I saw one post where a user asked a somewhat similar question regarding WASAPI bit depth being pinned at 32 bit, and the answer directed the user to consult the manual. Therefore, before making this post, I consulted the manual looking for solutions or an explanation. Nothing in the manual explains why WASAPI only permits 32 bit selection in Windows. Specifically, I looked at pages 40-43 and 65.

Thanks,

John

Edit: Changed "spacial" to "spatial"

  • Registered: 2018-02-02
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Re: ADI-2 DAC WASAPI, 16/24 bit, and Windows Spatial Sound API

Why are you bothering with WASAPI and Windows sound APIs? As soon as you use those, you've let WDM process the audio and there's no longer a reason to use WASAPI or ASIO.

3 Reply by jthk (edited by jthk 2020-07-12 17:10:41)

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Re: ADI-2 DAC WASAPI, 16/24 bit, and Windows Spatial Sound API

Luckbad wrote:

Why are you bothering with WASAPI and Windows sound APIs? As soon as you use those, you've let WDM process the audio and there's no longer a reason to use WASAPI or ASIO.

Yeah, I'm probably not being precise with my language, and I certainly don't grasp a lot of the terminology. I probably don't mean WASAPI but the Windows UAC 2 driver? I was going off this: https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/window … io-drivers which make it seem like WASAPI is always used when using the class compliant driver.

Regardless, if you're asking why I'm "bothering with" programs that use Windows spatial sound API, I'm a bit miffed by your question. Dolby Atmos for Headphones works quite well in certain games, and I'd like to use it in conjunction with my ADI-2. Unfortunately, I can't because I can only select 32 bit depth, not 16 or 24.

I just want to know if it's possible to select something other than 32 bit depth in Windows using the default Windows driver, and if it is not, I'd like to request that it be made possible so we can take advantage of programs that use the Windows spatial sound API.

EDIT: Also, I can't tell if you know what I'm talking about, here is a link: https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/window … tial-sound

4 Reply by MC

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Re: ADI-2 DAC WASAPI, 16/24 bit, and Windows Spatial Sound API

The bit depth in UAC2 mode is hard coded into the hardware (FPGA). Extending it to 24 bit is quite cumbersome and needs a lot of development work (I know it sounds easy but it is not).

> which make it seem like WASAPI is always used when using the class compliant driver.

Then it would be incompatible for many applications.

> I just want to know if it's possible to select something other than 32 bit depth in Windows using the default Windows driver, and if it is not, I'd like to request that it be made possible so we can take advantage of programs that use the Windows spacial sound API.

There is no documentation that says 24 or 16 bit is required as format. Windows Sonic for Headphone not available will most probably have a different reason that we will try to find out.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

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Re: ADI-2 DAC WASAPI, 16/24 bit, and Windows Spatial Sound API

Thank you very much for the response, Mr. Carstens! While I'm fairly certain the spatial API requires 16 or 24 bit @ 48000, I'll be very happy if you all can figure out the what's preventing the ADI-2 DAC from working with it. Again, many thanks.

6 Reply by RPGWiZaRD (edited by RPGWiZaRD 2021-07-20 12:35:42)

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Re: ADI-2 DAC WASAPI, 16/24 bit, and Windows Spatial Sound API

I'm sorry for bumping such an old thread but I also have the exact same question and the thread starter explained the case so well so thought it would be unnecessary to open a new one regarding the same topic. Basically my purchase decision relies pretty much on this as I'm looking for a "do-it-all" solution to my computer audio needs. I'm a hobby music mastering engineer/headphone enthusiast that also uses the PC to game with so I'd like to find a device which can do it all, especially when talking about devices costing about 1000€ which is a lot expensier DAC than I would be used to.

For PC gaming I tend to use 5.1 speaker setting on a soundcard that support it as I find that to deliver better positional cues than setting windows to plain "stereo" (it somehow downmixes into a stereo output but treats it as a 5.1 signal but this is not the point here so let's leave it at that). However that option is unfortunately only available to soundcards usually assumed with gaming and as we all know those typically leaves a bit more for desire when it comes to pure audio deliverance. So the next best thing I was testing all kinds of various "surround sound" APIs to see if there's any good ones available that A) doesn't impact the sound quality too much and B) has a natural sounding surround processing and to me Dolby Atmos for Headphones were the best from this aspect, quite positively suprised with the latest version that allows you to for example adjust EQ (or like I wanted, keep it totally unEQ'd which wasn't the case previously when you were forced to pre-applied EQ settings).

Dolby Atmos for Heaphones USES 24bit 48.000Hz and it MUST be set to this specifically (like it automatically switches to when enabling Dolby Atmos for Headphones), changing either sample-rate or bitrate will automatically force Windows' "Spatial sound"-setting fall back to "off", essentially turning it off. So the question is it today possible to have ADI-2 FS DAC use 24bit 48.000Hz with any Windows driver? I don't care if it's WASAPI, ASIO or even using Windows own "Direct Sound" protocol as long as it's possible. Has there been any development in this regard? Thanks

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Re: ADI-2 DAC WASAPI, 16/24 bit, and Windows Spatial Sound API

On a similar bent, I'm trying to get Dolby Atmos for Headphones to work with the RME ADI-2 DAC FS.

I can right click on the sound icon to select a surround sound mode, but cannot figure out how to get this signal to go through the ADI-2. Am I missing something, or is this impossible?

https://i.imgur.com/bI3g59G.png

8 Reply by MC

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Re: ADI-2 DAC WASAPI, 16/24 bit, and Windows Spatial Sound API

Did you read the first post?

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

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9 Reply by Sproketz (edited by Sproketz 2023-01-21 08:09:39)

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Re: ADI-2 DAC WASAPI, 16/24 bit, and Windows Spatial Sound API

MC wrote:

Did you read the first post?

Yes. It's unclear to me if my question is the same as the one above. I'm using Dolby Atmos for Headphones rather than Window Sonic. I don't understand a lot of what is being said in this thread as it is fairly technical. Just looking for a simple answer. Thank you.

10 Reply by Sproketz (edited by Sproketz 2023-01-28 04:32:14)

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Re: ADI-2 DAC WASAPI, 16/24 bit, and Windows Spatial Sound API

For anyone trying to get Surround Sound working with their ADI-2. I have found a way. And it sounds glorious.

I just bought a SteelSeries Nova Pro Wireless headset for gaming which of course requires you to install their Steelseries GG software with Sonar. Sonar and its surround features are where the magic happens.

The sonar mixing software has a lot of DSP you can do with a parametric EQ etc. But it also has a surround sound processor, and you can set the ADI-2 as the output. So Sonar pre-processes the surround signal and sends it to the ADI-2. Now you can use all of the ADI-2's features, EQ, loudness, B/T, etc with extremely good sounding surround sound while gaming.

I set my Performance/Immersion slider at about -9.0 so I don't over DSP. This gives a really spacious surround feel without introducing audible out of place reverb effects. And I set the "Distance" slider at 50%.

This offers much more spatial sounding headphone audio than Dolby Atmos for Headphones, DTS Headphone:X, and Windows Sonic. All with your ADI-2 or whatever audiophile amp you want to run.

I'm using a Denon D9200 right now through the ADI-2, driven by the Sonar Surround output and it sounds absurdly dimensional and robust. Amazing. Finally.