• Registered: 2021-06-09
  • Posts: 7

Topic: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

Hello,

I've been using the lovely DAC2 FS and recently noticed that playing via USB directly to the DAC2 the sound quality is much better than when I stream content via my Allo Digione Signature connected to the DAC2 via coax. So I decided to run the bit perfect test and noticed the following.

All bit test pass if I connect Audirvana (on Mac) -> USB -> ADI2 DAC FS.

The following don't work

1. Audirvana (on Mac) -> stream to Allo Digione Signature over Wifi -> Coax -> ADI2 DAC FS
2. Allo Digione Signature (files played via attached USB stick) -> Coax -> ADI2 DAC FS

The Allo is running Volumio which is the latest version. DAC2 is also updated to latest firmware.

Is this supposed to work or am I making a mistake?

Thank you in advance.

  • ramses
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Re: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

Is somewhere a volume knob turned down ? Only with volumes at 100% a bit perfect test can pass.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13
  • Registered: 2021-06-09
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Re: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

Volume knob is not turned down. I can hear the clicking sound via the speakers. But it is not at 100%. Whose volume should be at 100%? The software volume control on the MAC or the DAC?

4 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2021-06-09 14:54:16)

  • ramses
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Re: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

atharva wrote:

Volume knob is not turned down. I can hear the clicking sound via the speakers. But it is not at 100%. Whose volume should be at 100%? The software volume control on the MAC or the DAC?

I mean the volume of the player on your mac/pc/raspberry pi (whatever you use).
Maybe there is also smth like a software mixer in the signal path that also might change the original audio signal...

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13
  • Registered: 2019-01-07
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Re: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

Atharva,

Let's have you begin by looking at Volumio's documentation re: Volume Control.

https://volumio.github.io/docs/User_Man … ality.html

Ramses Hypothesis seems Spot-On, and the above link may be helpful to you.

Curt

Vintage 2018 ADI-2 DAC. "Classic AKM4490 Edition"
Cables:  Red, and White Ones.
Speakers:  Yes
  • Registered: 2021-06-09
  • Posts: 7

Re: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

Thank you ramses and Curt.

I was able to make some progress. Software volume in Volumio (on Allo) is set to either 100% or disabled.

- Directly via Allo via attached USB 44.1K and 96K files are bit perfect but 192K files just won't play. Not that I don't get bit perfect confirmation, the files don't play at all. Allo is supposed to be able to play these.

- Via Audirvana (on Mac) works if I set volume to 100%. Again only 44.1 and 96K files play.

If I try to play via ITunes, then only one of 44.1K files play bit perfect. Even if I've set volume to 100%.

Does this mean that the software being used matters?

If one uses software volume I suppose the bits are altered but it seems there is a lot of debate on whether or not it is audible.

  • ning
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Re: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

that is caused by sample rate conversion. ideally your software should be able to set the sample rate automatically based on the content you are playing. unfortunately most players don't and you have to manually change the output via "Audio Midi Setup".

sample rate conversion is usually audible to a trained ear for certain audio clips.

8 Reply by Curt962 (edited by Curt962 2021-06-11 02:07:50)

  • Registered: 2019-01-07
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Re: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

Atharva,

It seems that something is possibly askew in your Allo, but more likely your Volumio, or a perhaps combination of both.   

Perhaps best for you to consult with Allo CS regarding your issue, as these problems are in no way related to your ADI-2 DAC.  Setting SR manually for each individual track is for me, a level of inconvenience that I will have nothing to do with.   My Sftwr (LMS) has long done this (ie: SR set to mirror the file) and now LMS/Picore Player continues to do it all for me quietly, and without any user involvement.

Good Luck, and Best Regards,

Curt

Vintage 2018 ADI-2 DAC. "Classic AKM4490 Edition"
Cables:  Red, and White Ones.
Speakers:  Yes
  • Registered: 2021-06-09
  • Posts: 7

Re: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

Hi Curt,

I connected a different DAC (Topping D50s) to the Allo and the 192K files play fine via that. I forgot to mention that I had sent over the RME DAC to local RME support and they were able to play 192K files via it. So there seems to be some mismatch between the Allo and the RME. I have no clue what that could be.

Is PicorePlayer similar to Volumio? Does it require LMS or can I just stream to it like Volumio?

10 Reply by Curt962 (edited by Curt962 2021-06-16 13:21:52)

  • Registered: 2019-01-07
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Re: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

Hi Atharva,

I remain puzzled why the Allo (FrankenPi) refuses to Play well with Others. We have a number of users with Pi/Volumio and not having any difficulties interfacing or passing Bit Test with their RMEs.  Are you REALLY certain that Volumio is not changing Volume?  Changing Volume in Player Software is a Time-Tested way to ensure that Bit-Test will not Pass.  Vol is 100%, or Phhhht.

If you like, you Could download Logitech Media Server to your PC.  This is now your Player Sftwr.

Download PiCoreplayer, and Flash that Image to your Allo's SD Card.   PCP uses an extension called "Squeezelite" that works as a Squeezebox emulator.

Following ALL instructions in PCPs documentation, proceed!

At 0600 in the Morning? That's as far as my Coffee-Starved head takes me for the moment.

I'm not an I.T. guy, but I set this up with my Generic Pi4 over a few cups of coffee, and never looked back.  Works better than I ever imagined, and is RME verified Bit Perfect.

Good Luck!

Curt

Have a Look at this YouTube "How To" Video

https://youtu.be/NMaqasfN3w0

Vintage 2018 ADI-2 DAC. "Classic AKM4490 Edition"
Cables:  Red, and White Ones.
Speakers:  Yes
  • Registered: 2021-06-09
  • Posts: 7

Re: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

Forget BitTest, the RME does not recognize any 192K stream from Allo (whether 100% volume or not) but it does with my Topping DAC. After much searching I happened to come across a post on Allo talking about current requirements and am wondering if that could be an issue. I am using the 3A PSU that came with Allo for the dirty side and a generic USB PSU for the clean side. I swapped the two and it still doesn't work. Am hoping to try a higher current PSU for the clean side.

Will try PiCorePlayer when I have some bandwidth.

Thanks!

12 Reply by Curt962 (edited by Curt962 2021-06-21 16:06:49)

  • Registered: 2019-01-07
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Re: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

Atharva,

Have you tried a different Coaxial Cable?   That "could" be a possibility.  What is the Highest SR file that DOES play with your Allo/RME combination?   Possible is it that the HAT itself is bandwidth limited?

At this point, I'm completely suspicious of the Allo "Sandwich" and might even suggest that you simply try another Streaming Device, as a simple, generic Pi4 will dance rings around any device constructed of multiple Pi3 boards with their known USB deficiencies.

Good Heavens. My 12yr old SBTs play wonderfully, and pass Bit Test without any fuss on my behalf.

Try another device.

Curt

Vintage 2018 ADI-2 DAC. "Classic AKM4490 Edition"
Cables:  Red, and White Ones.
Speakers:  Yes

13 Reply by Curt962 (edited by Curt962 2021-06-21 20:13:01)

  • Registered: 2019-01-07
  • Posts: 1,462

Re: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

Atharva,

One more note here, Please take a look at this recent thread.  We had Fun, and People went home satisfied.

https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=33007

Might I suggest that you simply obtain a $99 Pi4 Kit, and spend 30 minutes at your Table setting it up.   Your problems will swiftly disappear! 

Allo can't fix their device, so there's a Less than Zero Chance I will either.

Move forward with this recommendation, as Streamers are indeed the Future, and Pi is the most sustainable of the lot.

Best,

Curt

Vintage 2018 ADI-2 DAC. "Classic AKM4490 Edition"
Cables:  Red, and White Ones.
Speakers:  Yes

14 Reply by MC

  • MC
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Re: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

> Directly via Allo via attached USB 44.1K and 96K files are bit perfect but 192K files just won't play.

> I connected a different DAC (Topping D50s) to the Allo and the 192K files play fine via that.

I wonder if you even noticed how you confused everyone. So the first statement was just wrong, the Allo does play everything, but the DAC won't receive any signal. Well, it does, but can't recognize it correctly. This is a known issue - sometimes the sender's voltage is a bit too low and the receivers sensitivity a bit too high. Will work at standard rates but not anymore at 192 kHz.

We can check your ADI if it works according to spec or not, but for that you need to send it in.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

MC's Website

  • Registered: 2021-06-09
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Re: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

Sorry about that, it was unintentional.

I'm based in India and I did send over the DAC to the local company (Ansata in Bangalore) I bought it from. They tested the DAC with two other sources and said it works fine and that the problem is with the Allo. I'm not sure if they did any other tests. Is there a way to involve RME as well to check if the DAC as per spec?

16 Reply by MC

  • MC
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Re: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

If you send it to Ansata we can help them to check and even fix it if necessary (they should contact us then, of course). Is this a unit with Warranty?

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

MC's Website

  • Registered: 2021-06-09
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Re: ADI2 DAC FS bit test passes via USB but not via streamer

Yes it is. Can I PM you so I can send over the reply I got from Ansata?