1 (edited by mindburner 2021-07-14 18:10:36)

Topic: adding a 2nd RME digiface to increase ADAT channels

hi all
I currently have a RME Digi face 32 input ADAT to USB interface. I use all the channels due to having too many vintage synths and would like a further 8 ADAT channels. IS there a way to add these to my existing setup or do I need to get a bigger interface. I know it 'can' be possible to add another audio interface in a DAW with a bit of messing but I would rather have everything running straight without bodges


Can I just add a 2nd RME digiface and the DAW will see it all as a single interface? (windows 10)
or..
If replace one of my current 8 ch ADAT front ends (Behringer Ultragain) and I get a 2nd hand MOTU 2408 Expansion rack unit, will the RME see all the channels or just 8

many thanks

2 (edited by MetalHeadKeys 2021-07-15 00:38:57)

Re: adding a 2nd RME digiface to increase ADAT channels

Hello!

Quote from the manual, Chapter 10, page 20:

The current driver supports up to three RME USB devices. All units have to be in sync, i.e. have to receive valid digital sync information.


x   If one of the units is set to clock mode Master, all others have to be set to clock mode Slave,  and  have  to  be  synced  from  the  master  by  feeding  ADAT  or  SPDIF.  The  clock modes of all units have to be set up correctly in their Settings dialog.

x   If all units are fed with a synchronous clock, i.e. all units show Sync in their Settings dialog, all channels can be used at once. This is especially easy to use under ASIO, as the ASIO driver presents all units as one.


Note: TotalMix is part of the hardware of each RME unit. Up to three mixers are available, but these  are  separated  and  can't  interchange  data.  Therefore  a  global  mixer  for  all  units  is  not possible.


Using more than one Digiface USB the USB bus might get overloaded. To prevent this connect all units to different USB busses. See chapter 26.2 for details.

About exchanging the Behringer with the MOTU, there will be no difference in channel count. An ADAT stream carries 8 channels.

I 've no experience with the MOTU, but if it has any internal routing capabilities, the only difference it could make is
to have your extra synths connected all the time, but being able to use only 8 specific Inputs to one of the ADAT Out ports, and changing them depending on your needs!

RME Gear: Digiface USB, HDSP 9632

3 (edited by ramses 2021-07-15 06:03:20)

Re: adding a 2nd RME digiface to increase ADAT channels

If your PC/Laptop has no issues with USB, then you could try to add a 2nd RME Digiface USB (usually up to 3 RME interfaces are  possible per driver, more than that not tested) and use one ADAT channel for clock synchronization (as there is no WC).

That would be the best solution and it gives you additionally a backup device, here a cabling example, only the ADAT IN and clocking, you might need one or more TOSLINK connections for the D/A:

                                 +-ADAT1 IN-+- D/A Converter #1 
Digiface USB #2------+-ADAT2 IN-+- D/A Converter #2
   | ADAT4 OUT          +-ADAT3 IN-+- D/A Converter #3 
   |                            + ADAT4 IN-+- D/A Converter #4
   | ADAT4 IN
Digiface USB #2------+-ADAT1 IN-+- D/A Converter #5
                                 +-ADAT2 IN-+- D/A Converter #6 
                                 +-ADAT3 IN-+- D/A Converter #7

7 * 8    = 56ch for Synthies at single speed (44.1/48)

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

4 (edited by vinark 2021-07-15 08:08:42)

Re: adding a 2nd RME digiface to increase ADAT channels

No one ever mentions this but if you can sync 2 of your adat converters, for example by wordclock you don't need to sacrafice adat channels. Just one master adat converter to digiface one and the slaved adat converter to digiface 2. The rest of the adat converters can now be slaved to the digifaces.
The digifaces are slaved to the first 2 mentioned converters.
Hope this helps

Vincent, Amsterdam
https://soundcloud.com/thesecretworld
Babyface pro fs, HDSP9652+ADI-8AE, HDSP9632

5 (edited by mindburner 2021-07-15 14:42:31)

Re: adding a 2nd RME digiface to increase ADAT channels

Thanks for all the great feedback. I wne ahead and ordered a 2nd RME digiface. It's has not arrived yest but will experiment and report back.

I currently have a Digiface and then 4x ADAT converters. 2 focusrite octopre/18i20, with wordclock and 2x Behringer ADA8200
It's a bit confusing working with the focusrite software and the digiface. I would be better getting new ADATs here but I have them and so they will have to do.



this is my current setup

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8ka1pj06dly4n9q/digiface%20sync.jpg?raw=1

This syncs well, any other combo seems to loose sync, especially input 2
ADAT convertor 1 (18i20) &2 (octopre) are connected together by word clock, and by 2x optical cables each to the RME digiface
3 & 4 by optical cables to the RME digiface

to be honest i'm a bit out of my league with this but it has all worked so far.

I maybe don't need the RME optical out connected to the ADAT convertor 2 (octopre) as I already have the wordclock

6 (edited by mindburner 2021-07-16 20:58:51)

Re: adding a 2nd RME digiface to increase ADAT channels

so I have received my 2nd RME digiface and got it synced to the 1st and  it all shows sync on the RME control panel. I can see signal in the second instance of totalmix FX but I cannot get any audio on my main monitors, just the phones on the 2nd digiface. Is there some sort of combine audio option of something

7 (edited by mindburner 2021-07-19 12:25:24)

Re: adding a 2nd RME digiface to increase ADAT channels

The RME driver should be able to handle 3 instances of hardware on the PC. I managed to make some progress yesterday. This may be of help to others.

Essentially breaking one of the ADAT front ends into two and moving them across the 2x RME's.

  • 2x RME's connected with USB to host PC, separate USB ports
    The first 2 ADAT's are locked with wordclock.
    One Windows WDM device set up (speakers) on DIGIFACE 1 only
    RME 2 set up to sync on 'input1'

I have yet to try my 2nd hand MOTU 828 as I haven't got it yet but I hope it will just plug into the 2nd RME  and work like a charm. I should still have 2x8 ADATS for future use.

Some images:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
RME setup:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/tr0t26ty8bm31bt/RME%20screens.jpg?raw=1

physical RME's:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/jl3cz3l5h3c7bfo/ADAT%20WIRING.jpg?raw=1

Re: adding a 2nd RME digiface to increase ADAT channels

Great

Vincent, Amsterdam
https://soundcloud.com/thesecretworld
Babyface pro fs, HDSP9652+ADI-8AE, HDSP9632

Re: adding a 2nd RME digiface to increase ADAT channels

unfortunately not as there is no way to combine audio from the 2nd digiface to the main monitors. SO effectively it's not possible to use 2 digifaces on 1 pc. as there is no audio from the 2nd one, only from it's hardware headphone out

10 (edited by ramses 2021-07-28 18:28:41)

Re: adding a 2nd RME digiface to increase ADAT channels

This is a known thing and has been mentioned by Metalheadkeys by quoting the manual, see post #2 in this thread:

"Note: TotalMix is part of the hardware of each RME unit. Up to three mixers are available, but these  are  separated  and  can't  interchange  data.  Therefore  a  global  mixer  for  all  units  is  not possible."

A solution to solve this is to use "DAW mode" and to route in the DAW.

One of the reasons why I tend to recommend to pick the next higher interface, so that its possible to use TM FX in full mode and to be able to route any HW input / SW playback to any HW output.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: adding a 2nd RME digiface to increase ADAT channels

ramses wrote:

This is a known thing and has been mentioned by Metalheadkeys by quoting the manual, see post #2 in this thread:

"Note: TotalMix is part of the hardware of each RME unit. Up to three mixers are available, but these  are  separated  and  can't  interchange  data.  Therefore  a  global  mixer  for  all  units  is  not possible."

A solution to solve this is to use "DAW mode" and to route in the DAW.

One of the reasons why I tend to recommend to pick the next higher interface, so that its possible to use TM FX in full mode and to be able to route any HW input / SW playback to any HW output.

ah right I see. I though it was still possible to route audio from RME 2 to the same monitors as RME 1, although they had separate totalmix windows.

In Cubase Pro I can set up RME 2 and see the input channels. Also record, although I cannot hear the incoming audio when recording, only when playing back (through RME 1 I guess)

it isn't really that useful for me so I think I will have to get a bigger single interface

12 (edited by rme_user 2021-10-01 18:53:45)

Re: adding a 2nd RME digiface to increase ADAT channels

mindburner wrote:
ramses wrote:

This is a known thing and has been mentioned by Metalheadkeys by quoting the manual, see post #2 in this thread:

"Note: TotalMix is part of the hardware of each RME unit. Up to three mixers are available, but these  are  separated  and  can't  interchange  data.  Therefore  a  global  mixer  for  all  units  is  not possible."

A solution to solve this is to use "DAW mode" and to route in the DAW.

One of the reasons why I tend to recommend to pick the next higher interface, so that its possible to use TM FX in full mode and to be able to route any HW input / SW playback to any HW output.

ah right I see. I though it was still possible to route audio from RME 2 to the same monitors as RME 1, although they had separate totalmix windows.

In Cubase Pro I can set up RME 2 and see the input channels. Also record, although I cannot hear the incoming audio when recording, only when playing back (through RME 1 I guess)

it isn't really that useful for me so I think I will have to get a bigger single interface

You still can, The "link cable" still transfer audio so you can send whatever you want from the first card link output to the second card link input and from there directly to your monitor out (like you will link two analog mixers).
you will only need two outputs so maybe better use spdif to support higher sample rates.