Topic: ADI DIY Cap Tuning

Hi, saw this the other day and could not resist to share https://www.head-fi.org/threads/rme-adi … t-15634128

Question to the creators: Is it worth it except for loosing warranty?

2 (edited by KaiS 2020-06-15 17:11:30)

Re: ADI DIY Cap Tuning

The picture says it all:
It's an absolute must and worth it, especially as none of these caps are in the audio chain. smile smile

How could I ever live without it!

"...caps still burning in..." might have to be understood literally:
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/rme-adi … t-15634927

3

Re: ADI DIY Cap Tuning

knatterton wrote:

Hi, saw this the other day and could not resist to share https://www.head-fi.org/threads/rme-adi … t-15634128

Question to the creators: Is it worth it except for loosing warranty?

It doesn't change anything other than your imagination.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: ADI DIY Cap Tuning

The mod possibly can worsen the sound and reduce maximum output level.

The inductance of the much longer leads can limit slew rate and maximum output level on critical positions - like the power supply decoupling caps close to the headphone amps, no longer being close enough to do their job.

5 (edited by N00b 2020-06-15 19:09:04)

Re: ADI DIY Cap Tuning

I thought it was a joke... lol

It was not...

We can read later:

Stock 16 volt Nichicon caps replaced with Mundorf Ecap 70 Capacitors.
Sounds unbelievable, still need to install a top box to house these caps in permanently.
Stock RME presents a flat audio image, this MOD makes it 3D with real organic Depth. Stock sounds very sterile in comparison, this brings emotionality and texture to all instruments. Caps are still burning in.......But I am more satisfied than I could have ever hoped to be.
[...]
Doesn't even sound like the same DAC, emotional engagement, musicality, depth/extension of stage, textures, cohesiveness of the audio image are real standouts, and these capacitors have another 400 plus hours of break in.

After the clear linear PSU, the magical warm USB cable, the vivid fiber cable, here is the magical re-capping of the unit... Is it the International BullShit's Day? big_smile I wasn't aware...

ADI-2 DAC (with stock PSU) - Neumann KH 310 A monitors - Cheap USB and XLR cables

6 (edited by Curt962 2020-06-15 19:29:17)

Re: ADI DIY Cap Tuning

KaiS wrote:

The mod possibly can worsen the sound and reduce maximum output level.

The inductance of the much longer leads can limit slew rate and maximum output level on critical positions - like the power supply decoupling caps close to the headphone amps, no longer being close enough to do their job.

You just have to BELIEVE Kai... smile   Especially the "Organic Depth" part.

Breathtaking!!   How much does this act of Technological Vandalism Cost?   Do I need the FULL 400hrs of Burn In Time?   Would it be better to use an Analog Clock to time the Capacitor Burn In?  So many questions...  big_smile

Vintage 2018 ADI-2 DAC. "Classic AKM4490 Edition"
Cables:  Red, and White Ones.
Speakers:  Yes

7 (edited by KSTR 2020-06-15 19:34:44)

Re: ADI DIY Cap Tuning

Oh shit, I was waiting for some freaks to "tune" one of the ADI-2 models for while now but didn't expect something this bad!

I'm pretty sure this ratsnest is producing a lot of ringing on the power supplies under dynamic load because the inductance of those cap is likely what, 50x than what was present before? Since almost all those caps are paralleled with on-board SMD ceramic caps you get a fine resonant tank circuit where huge L of the new caps+wiring resonates with the onboard C, creating supply impedances of several ohms when measured directly at the load (the various chips) and now at much lower (by a factor of sqrt(50) = 7)  frequencies and with higher Q factors, see https://incompliancemag.com/article/usi … dangerous/

On top of that, any peak current flowing in these caps now will happily find lots of loop area to radiate, as well as pickup electromagnetic field.

What a disaster, no wonder it sounds different...

8 (edited by Curt962 2020-06-16 01:45:29)

Re: ADI DIY Cap Tuning

Ehhh... smile

They had me convinced at "Emotionality, and Texture"!!    ("Emotionality" is not an actual Word in the English Language.  Rather, it appears to be a Word manufactured for use in Audio)   The Cherry on top are the Engaging Organics!!   Very Emotionally Cohesive I'm told.    Sad Music is thus VERY SAD.   No confusing Happy /Sad waffling about.

Vintage 2018 ADI-2 DAC. "Classic AKM4490 Edition"
Cables:  Red, and White Ones.
Speakers:  Yes

Re: ADI DIY Cap Tuning

smile smile smile

N00b wrote:

I thought it was a joke... lol

It was not...

We can read later:

Stock 16 volt Nichicon caps replaced with Mundorf Ecap 70 Capacitors.
Sounds unbelievable, still need to install a top box to house these caps in permanently.
Stock RME presents a flat audio image, this MOD makes it 3D with real organic Depth. Stock sounds very sterile in comparison, this brings emotionality and texture to all instruments. Caps are still burning in.......But I am more satisfied than I could have ever hoped to be.
[...]
Doesn't even sound like the same DAC, emotional engagement, musicality, depth/extension of stage, textures, cohesiveness of the audio image are real standouts, and these capacitors have another 400 plus hours of break in.

After the clear linear PSU, the magical warm USB cable, the vivid fiber cable, here is the magical re-capping of the unit... Is it the International BullShit's Day? big_smile I wasn't aware...

Re: ADI DIY Cap Tuning

What's the point of that? Then rather a switchable stage per tube. That would definitely change the sound (which we don't really want). So stop fiddling and just listen to the music. smile

Re: ADI DIY Cap Tuning

do they have April Fool's day in Germany? because that's what I thought this was...except it's a little too early smile

Re: ADI DIY Cap Tuning

Can he close the cabinet? big_smile

Pacifist, dumb, not stupid
Listen music out from a box which sounds
Reading words on paper/ screen

13 (edited by RME_fan 2022-05-26 23:43:37)

Re: ADI DIY Cap Tuning

Just noticed this, which confirms what was written above:
"The only capacitors in the signal path perform DC protection at the analog input sockets, and have been carefully selected to avoid any sonic impact." (my emphasis)
https://www.rme-audio.com/adi-2-pro-fs-be.html

14 (edited by KaiS 2022-05-27 14:31:33)

Re: ADI DIY Cap Tuning

This can serve as a good example of the two different approaches existing.


The “audiophile” approach:

Someone sees some capacitors, the straight reaction is:
“This can’t be good, I have to mod this with better ones to improve the sound.”
After long fumbling, spending a lot of time and effort mounting a lot of new cap’s, of course the prejustice driven listening result is (if ADI-2 survived the procedure):
The sound turned from dark mud into bright light.
A/B is not possible in this case, because A does not exist anymore.

Would the results ever be: the mod worsened the sound?


The scientific approach:

You analyze the cap’s purposes and possible positions in the audio chain.
You find that only two pairs of cap’s are carrying audio (in case of ADI-2 Pro)
Now by a simple measurement or even A/B listening you check if they have an influence on the audio quality:

You compare between Inplace and Hardwire Bypass (in this case it’s possible, because the cap’s only serve to exclude potential DC), which can be done with a simple mechanical switch temporarily connected to the cap’s.
No extra equipment is needed, ADI-2 Pro’s Out to In, back to back, with any audio measurements software, or just by listening.


Which approach do you think gives the more relevant results?!



Remark about capacitors:
All capacitors cause distortions under certain circumstances.
Electrolytics and ceramics are usually the worst, film cap’s are better, but still.

The important part of this sentence is, not in general, but: under certain circumstances.
With clever circuits design this effect can be completely avoided.


An example:
Almost every tube amplifier has DC decoupling cap’s between it’s several stages.
Do they cause distortions?
Usually not, because they mostly are in high impedance circuits, where almost no current flows through the cap’s.