• Registered: 2011-05-04
  • Posts: 249

Topic: Is thunderbolt-FW a solution for PC laptops?

Hi RME staffs,

I read Apple has released Thunderbolt-firewire adapter, which is $30 or something, and it'll be awesome for people using FW interfaces and want to use iMac or Macbook Pro with TB ports. On the PC side, FW is really vanishing except for desktops with onboard FW chip or PCI/PCIe FW adapters (which could be sometimes crappy). For PC laptop users, it's been really pain, and they need lots of research before buying next rig.

My question is, do the current FW interfaces work as if they are plugged in to the FW port with TI chip? Or, do you need to revise the driver for the Thunderbolt-FW adapter? Have you heard troubles using RME's FW interface, connected to FW port of the Apple TB display?

I'm not looking for interfaces or laptop at the moment (a happy UFX/HDSPeAIO with PC desktop/laptop user), but ASUS said they are going to support TB, and I anticipate some PC laptops will have TB ports soon. So, I just wanted to throw this question, maybe good information for the people who are looking for new laptops (and good matching interface).

Thanks!

  • Registered: 2012-07-15
  • Posts: 32

Re: Is thunderbolt-FW a solution for PC laptops?

Well, I just ordered the adapter (by phone as not everybody -- including me -- can yet see the item on Apple's website), so I'll know by next week whether it works with a UCX.

  • Registered: 2008-01-01
  • Posts: 3,025

Re: Is thunderbolt-FW a solution for PC laptops?

I can tell you that going TB -> ExpressCard adapter -> FireWire ExpressCard -> UFX works. Albeit for the FF800 there may be some limitations when you use several FF800 units concurrently.

  • Registered: 2011-05-04
  • Posts: 249

Re: Is thunderbolt-FW a solution for PC laptops?

Thanks Timur,

It's amazing UFX works via two adapters. Does the FW expresscard have a TI chip?

  • Registered: 2010-02-06
  • Posts: 18

Re: Is thunderbolt-FW a solution for PC laptops?

Hi Timur
Would you please explain what the limitations for FF800 are if I want to use TB adaptor in the future,
And what a bout just one FF800 unit connecting to the TB adaptor. is it going to work?

  • Registered: 2008-01-01
  • Posts: 3,025

Re: Is thunderbolt-FW a solution for PC laptops?

While daisy-chaining works flawlessly on OS X even with 2x FW 800 + 2x FW 400 devices in the chain there are some troubles running the RME Firefaces in chain on Windows (7), but only via TB adapter. To my surprise I found that the Windows (7) native FW drivers generally have troubles daisy-chaining FW 800 with FW 400 devices, even more so the "(Legacy)" drivers that even get into troubles when chaining FW 800 with FW 800. But only in combination with the TB adapter there are audio drop-outs and a considerable drop in low latency performance.

So as long as you are using OS X it should work (didn't test 3 FW800 devices, though), but on (bootcamped) Windows the TB -> ExpressCard -> Firewire connection does not seem to be the best choice for aggregated devices (yet). As far as I can tell there is a considerable increase in CPU load (by interrupts/DPCs) even when only a Fireface 400 is daisy-chained to the Fireface 800. This may or may not depend on the Firewire card being used in combination with TB (I tried a TI based FW800 card).

No idea (yet) how all this translates to Apples TB->FW adapter, sorry.

  • Registered: 2011-05-04
  • Posts: 249

Re: Is thunderbolt-FW a solution for PC laptops?

Thanks. Preliminary, but very good information.
I'm on PC side, and I don't see any manufactures making motherboards with TB ports.
This is out of curiosity.
Best regards,

  • Registered: 2007-08-28
  • Posts: 27

Re: Is thunderbolt-FW a solution for PC laptops?

The max output of a thunderbold port is only 10 w, while I just saw that the future version of USB will provide up to 100 w - one more reason not to believe in bus powering through TB for audio and predict a move towards powerful USB3 audio cards instead.

I would certainly bet on a USB soundcard that would look like a pre-aged, bulletproof 16/4 multicore stagebox, and could be used as one, but would also record 16 tracks of pristine analog, possibly even in standalone/SD card mode thanks to an internal battery transparently recharged by USB. It would work as a USB device (max 5m cable) but also on MADI with the MADIFace, then you could do away with the heavy multicore cable. RME are you listening ? Shall we call it Boxface ? ScarFace ?

  • Registered: 2012-04-15
  • Posts: 90

Re: Is thunderbolt-FW a solution for PC laptops?

Right, like Yamaha's StageBox but with good convertors and USB3.  Linkable for 16/32/48 channels with some returns for FOH/monitors.

Preamp gain/imp/48V controlled via WiFi from iPad.

  • Registered: 2007-08-28
  • Posts: 27

Re: Is thunderbolt-FW a solution for PC laptops?

boz: not only preamp gain, but also the whole totalmix