1 (edited by TAV 2017-03-07 15:11:52)

Topic: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

Hi.
I play the guitar.
However latency is felt. In usb mode.
Preamp Mode is no latency.
Usb mode no latency. Is it possible?

2 (edited by vinark 2017-03-07 15:55:56)

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

Did you set the buffersize at lowest possible (settings on computer)? 128 should play fine. (This is on windows)

Vincent, Amsterdam
https://soundcloud.com/thesecretworld
HDSP9652+ADI-8AE  2X HDSP9632
Cubase pro10

3 (edited by TAV 2017-03-07 16:02:02)

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

Buffersize 32.
Also latency is felt.
My OS Win10.

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

And what do you use to process on PC? Maybe that adds latency? I can not feel latency up to 128. But I use a hdsp PCI card, so I can't be 100% that our latencies are the same. But the ADI2 experts do know!

Vincent, Amsterdam
https://soundcloud.com/thesecretworld
HDSP9652+ADI-8AE  2X HDSP9632
Cubase pro10

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

Please be more specific. How is the guitar connected, where exactly do you "feel latency"?


Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

6 (edited by TAV 2017-03-07 17:37:30)

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

Guitar -> POD XT -> ADI-2 Pro Input.

My PC CPU Skylake 6700K. OS Win10.

Preamp Mode is no latency.

USB Mode i feel fine latency.

And I'm not use midi programs. No pulgin and vst.

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

But where does it go from the ADI2 input? How do you listen? What do you use usb mode for?

Vincent, Amsterdam
https://soundcloud.com/thesecretworld
HDSP9652+ADI-8AE  2X HDSP9632
Cubase pro10

8 (edited by ramses 2017-03-08 08:02:21)

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

For a situation like this its important to get a complete and clear description about everything which might be important:
OS version, patchlevel.
Firmware version of ADI-2 Pro.
In what mode the different devices operate (POD, ADI-2 Pro).
Whats your mainboard.
To which USB ports do you connect the ADI-2 Pro. Did you try all other ports.
Which output do you use on the Pod XT (analog or digital ...), on what port does it come in on the ADI-2 Pro.

EDIT: sorry forgot about preamp mode, was confused about this
<deleted>

BR
Ramses
X10SRi-F, E5-1650v4, Win10Pro20H2, Cub11Pro, UFX+ (v0.9734), XTC, 12Mic, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

"I can not feel latency up to 128" - same here.

Do you have the "delay compensation" feature ON in your DAW?

10 (edited by TAV 2017-03-08 17:18:40)

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

I'm English is difficult.
My system CPU skylake 6700k, Mainborad Asus z170 hero alpha, Ram 32G, OS Win10,
I formatted it yesterday. However, it was not improved.
Test in cubase, also felt latency.
Device setup is very good.
Input Latency : 3.016ms  Output Latency 4.172ms.
That's no problem.
Just Preamp mode, USB mode different.
Adi2 pro is disappointing in the interface function.

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

I do not think this is a problem of the ADI-2. You are still not being specific about the latency you "feel"... How do you determine this latency, where exactly does it occur? Have you tested this with other software? Are you using the ASIO driver in Cubase or something else? Many questions, no clear picture so far...

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

12 (edited by TAV 2017-03-08 17:48:04)

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

It is really micro.
I do not know how to measure.

Preamp mode guitar sound speaker sound are one.
but Usb mode I'm listen speaker sound.

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

Sorry, it is very hard to help with so little information... Please try to be more specific.


Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

14 (edited by TAV 2017-03-09 08:46:34)

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

In Preamp mode.
Phones Out 3/4 different.
Setting usb 1/2,3/4 or analog.
Symptoms are the same.

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

Sorry, I can't help like this. Please contact local support.
Since the ADI-2 Pro has the same kind of low-latency ASIO driver as other RME devices, I can only assume there is some configuration error or the like.

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

16

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

Just for the record - roundtrip latencies @ 44.1 kHz (Windows ASIO):

ASIO Buffer Size     RTL
128 samples          7.3 ms (used in the upper Cubase test)
64 samples            4.4 ms
32 samples            2.9 ms

Everything as expected and no way to have a latency problem.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

Adi-2 pro allows for latency even lower than my older ff800 so it's by no means a latency problem with the adi-2 pro as an interface.

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

TAV wrote:

In Preamp mode.
Phones Out 3/4 different.
Setting usb 1/2,3/4 or analog.
Symptoms are the same.

Please make a drawing how your cabling between devices is .... and how you setup the devices
in the signal chain. Your description is too terse and missing everything which could be useful
in such a case.

BR
Ramses
X10SRi-F, E5-1650v4, Win10Pro20H2, Cub11Pro, UFX+ (v0.9734), XTC, 12Mic, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

Please check this: http://dawbench.com/audio-int-lowlatency2.htm The cabling is generally Out connected to the In of the device.

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

Hi RME,

I can understand what this guy is saying.

If you want to sing or play guitar,

(1) connect ADI to the computer by USB.

(2) open DAW, where you have the backing track(s)

(3) plug source into ADI (e.g. mic pre)

(4) playback your track on DAW, and press record

this is quite normal use of the ADI-2.

The problem some of us are facing is that the latency in this setup is too much. It is impossible to record this way.

The buffer size in DAW can be as low as 32 samples. The DAW can have all the clever software features like "delay compensation". That is not so important.

What is important is that there is a latency, when the ADI-2 pro is used this way, that makes it impossible to record vocals/guitar in time with a backing track.

My computer is top spec mac.

kind regards,
ian

21

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

Do a simple round trip measurement on your Mac. The ADI-2 Pro uses MacOS Class Compliant drivers, and these have a high basic latency. That is something to fix for Apple.

If you want  zero latency monitoring you can go Windows or choose one of our other audio interfaces - they are all capable to do that. The ADI-2 Pro is not advertized as such and was not designed to do that.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

22 (edited by FIXXXER 2018-04-08 19:38:40)

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

eljf wrote:

Hi RME,

I can understand what this guy is saying.

If you want to sing or play guitar,

(1) connect ADI to the computer by USB.

(2) open DAW, where you have the backing track(s)

(3) plug source into ADI (e.g. mic pre)

(4) playback your track on DAW, and press record

this is quite normal use of the ADI-2.

The problem some of us are facing is that the latency in this setup is too much. It is impossible to record this way.

The buffer size in DAW can be as low as 32 samples. The DAW can have all the clever software features like "delay compensation". That is not so important.

What is important is that there is a latency, when the ADI-2 pro is used this way, that makes it impossible to record vocals/guitar in time with a backing track.

My computer is top spec mac.

kind regards,
ian

Exactly the problem i am having since i have switched to the ADI-2 PRO!

If i set the buffer size to 32 samples the latency is somewhat accceptable
but this will only result in audio dropouts, crackling etc.

I also have a very powerful PC and i have tried everything to minimize the audio dropouts,
but one simple guitar amp sim will aready lead to the drop oputs,
so recording a track with maybe virtual drums, a few guitar tracks and a few synths is pretty much impossible.

I have tried to fix that in any possible way simply because i love how the ADI-2 PRO sounds but at the end,
as MC mentioned here, the ADI-2 PRO is NOT an audio interface, so we have simply have to accept that and move on.

I have asked multiple times if it's in any way possible to add direct monitoring to the ADI-2 PRO,
which would solve a lot of issues especially when recording vocals.

This would make the ADI-2 PRO the perfect hi end 2 channel interface for recording but i guess that's not
possible, so yeah, at this moment i am trying to sell the ADI-2 PRO and get a real audio interface.

Iit's not that easy though, there are so many products out there but none of them seems to do
what the ADI-2 PRO can do, which has a superb sound, superb headphone outputs and even some
sort of a built in monitor controller. IT's perfect, well alomst...

I have also made a thread about a possible "Interface" version of the ADI-2 PRO which would be basically
the unit as we know it but with added "direct monitoring", no officiall response.

I am by no means a tech pro but it should not be so hard to route the input directly to the output and have it play back simultaneously with the USB audio.

Hopes were very high as the ADI DAC was announced but at this point i highly doubt that there will be an ADI-2 PRO
version that is suitable for real time recording.

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

MC wrote:

If you want  zero latency monitoring you can go Windows

Zero latency monitoring is possible within Windows?
Am i missing something?

24

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

This statement refers to the fact that ASIO drivers under Windows run at much lower latency than Apple's Class Compliant driver under macOS. You missed the point a bit it seems as this customer talks about Mac. Latency problems under Windows - not really, these are the same latencies as achieved with other interfaces and software monitoring, and usually acceptable at a 64 sample setting.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

Unfortunately i misunderstood your statement, well, it would have been to good to be true!

I have recently switched from hardware/software modeling to analog gear (tube amp+cab+mic)
thinking that it may be easier to record this way using the ADI-2 PRO but running the amp and
using software monitoring even at 64 samples feels weird even when using headphones.

Listening to the microphone signal through my monitor speakers is worse,
even at 32 samples there is an audible delay which is absolutely distracting.

However i could kind of get used to this but as soon as anything else is involved
like VSTi intruments it's absolutely impossible to record without dropouts, Cubase
actually aborts recording due to massive dropouts.

It's a very tough decision and i really do not want to but i guess that i have to switch to something else sad

26

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

FIXXXER wrote:

Listening to the microphone signal through my monitor speakers is worse,
even at 32 samples there is an audible delay which is absolutely distracting.

The only explanation for that is that you use master FX or plugins that cause a big basic delay in your DAW.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

27 (edited by pianopictures 2018-04-09 19:56:57)

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

I'm a classical pianist here, Pianoteq user. There is a consensus among Pianoteq users that everything below 128 sample latency is virtually unnoticeable, which I totally agree about. I mean for playing it as a VST all day long. I use 128 as a standard on Babyface Pro, so to be always safe, although I could go for the lower ones.

My guess is that you are using relatively heavy background project in Cubase and you have a "delay compensation" feature switched ON. Try switching it OFF. As far as I could remember there may be an option in Cubase to switch it OFF for record/monitoring only. I may be wrong.

No way you can notice a 32 samples delay, if the drivers are actually doing what they should. Any chance you set your playback not as ASIO?

ADDED: I'm speaking strictly about playing a VST live. I have no experience in monitoring an audio signal through the AD stage.

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

MC wrote:
FIXXXER wrote:

Listening to the microphone signal through my monitor speakers is worse,
even at 32 samples there is an audible delay which is absolutely distracting.

The only explanation for that is that you use master FX or plugins that cause a big basic delay in your DAW.

empty Cubase 9.5 project, not a single plugin loaded just one audio track with software monitoring activated.

29 (edited by FIXXXER 2018-04-09 23:07:19)

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

pianopictures wrote:

I'm a classical pianist here, Pianoteq user. There is a consensus among Pianoteq users that everything below 128 sample latency is virtually unnoticeable, which I totally agree about. I mean for playing it as a VST all day long. I use 128 as a standard on Babyface Pro, so to be always safe, although I could go for the lower ones.

My guess is that you are using relatively heavy background project in Cubase and you have a "delay compensation" feature switched ON. Try switching it OFF. As far as I could remember there may be an option in Cubase to switch it OFF for record/monitoring only. I may be wrong.

No way you can notice a 32 samples delay, if the drivers are actually doing what they should. Any chance you set your playback not as ASIO?

ADDED: I'm speaking strictly about playing a VST live. I have no experience in monitoring an audio signal through the AD stage.

I always check if i have the correct Driver selected!

In Cubase it's not a problem, once set it won't change but other software
like FL Studio will change the driver on it's own from time to time.

I also think that 32 samples should not be noticeable, so i assume that something is not working properly,
unfortunately i was not able to find the cause yet.

Monitoring a pure audio signal should be way less of a problem than monitoring a VST btw.

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

im having bad latency issues with my adi 2 pro fs. I also own an hdspe aio, both have increased latency compared to when i purchased them, I believe the drivers must be revisted. When i go under 128, the drivers crash and cause bad digital noise. This is by far a terrible experience compared to what im used to with RME products. my specs, windows 10 workstation edition, threadripper 3990x, 256 gb ram, Dual workstation GPU's.

31

Re: ADI-2 Pro Usb mode Latency.

Wrong thread to post in, wrong accusations, wrong conclusions. Your computer is at fault, nothing else. Search this forum on how to examine performance and DPC problems.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME