• Registered: 2022-08-08
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Topic: Spdif connection Line6 Helix

I need help regarding the spdif connection of the babyface pro fs.
I'd like to buy a line6 helix or something similar and try to connect it via spdif to the babyface pro fs(just to prevent further digital-analog conversion) and record the processed signal and the DI track of the guitar(for reamping using vsts) while also be able to play without latency even with high buffer size values(using direct monitoring I imagine).
The problem is that I couldn't find any information about this and I don't know if the spdif connection of the helix (I use that product as a reference) is compatible with the spdif connection of the babyface and I don't know wich cable to buy (first time using a sdpif so I barely know it exists as a connection honestly) because I've read that maybe I need a spdif to optical cable (again I don't know if this is true and if something like that even exists or is needed).
Also I'd like to know if I will be able to also record the DI track by connecting the two devices in that way.

Thanks in advance!

2 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2024-05-31 10:35:32)

  • ramses
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Re: Spdif connection Line6 Helix

SPDIF is a standardized 2ch protocol with sample rates between 44.1 and 192 kHz.
There are two types of connections possible: coaxial or optical (the latter with galvanic isolation between the two devices).

The Helix (I think you mean this)
https://www.thomann.de/de/line6_helix_g … cessor.htm
has two types of digital I/O
- SPDIF (coax) IN and OUT
- AES OUT

The Babyface Pro FS has an ADAT I/O port for digital I/O supporting ADAT protocol and optical SPDIF.
But no coax SPDIF or AES port.
Therefore, it is not possible to connect the Helix digitally via either coax SPDIF or AES.

Then you should better consider the purchase of an UCX II which has different options for digital I/O:
- ADAT I/O (8ch @single speed) with the option to change the format to optical SPDIF (2ch, 44.1 - 192 kHz)
and via breakout cable additionally:
- AES I/O (2ch, 44.1-192 kHz)
- coax SPDIF (2ch, 44.1-192 kHz)

The UCX II has still a very compact format, but can't be operated USB bus powered.
The advantage of the UCX II is, that it has a much richer feature set.
It also got some features of the flagship interface UFX II
- Possibility to use the newly advertized features Room EQ and crossfeed
- Mic preamps with up to 75 dB gain
- DURec (direct USB recording)
- Stand-alone capabilities
- operable via display
- Autoset and full implementation of FX chip

Regarding your question about also recording the dry guitar signal..
Over AES/SPDIF (which is a 2 channel protocol) you transfer the wet/processed guitar signal in stereo to get the best quality for delay/reverb effects. Then all channels of SPDIF are in use.
If you want to record the unprocessed / dry guitar signal, then you need an additional (3rd) mono channel, either via another digital or analog output.
This depends on the routing capabilities of the Helix, there you need to evaluate first, to which channels you can sent the wet and the dry signal.

An alternative to that is to connect the Helix analog.
The wet signal would most likely be sent to the two XLR outputs (I assume this is a balanced connection)
Maybe there is the routing possibility in the helix to send the guitar signal to one of the other analog outputs:
- sends (unbalanced) or
- one of the two outputs labeled with 1/4" Out (unbalanced)
As these outputs are unbalanced (I just read in another thread) the cable should be as short as possible (from gut feeling not longer than ~3-5 m).

On the BBF Pro FS side you could use then:
- the two XLR Mic/Line inputs for the processed (stereo) signal (most likely balanced if Helix allows) and
- one of the analog TS inputs (unbalanced)

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14

3 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2024-05-31 10:17:17)

  • ramses
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Re: Spdif connection Line6 Helix

There are other possibilities.
In my setup, I am connecting my guitar to the UFX III's instrument input.

By this I have several options to further distribute/use the guitar signal

1. send the guitar signal to an external tuner (Korg Pitchblack X Pro)

2. For playing and recording via two Marshall Combo Amps (stereo setup) with external FX (Lexicon PCM81 + PCM91)
- send Guitar signal to an overdrive and further to a Marshal tube amp (preamp) and from there back to the UFX III
- send preamp signal
  - to Marshall combos (power amp) to keep the dynamic and
  - to either Lexicon PCM81 or PCM91 to add FX 100% wet and wet signal back to Marshall Combo (power amp)

3. By using DURec (Direct USB recording to USB Stick) I can use the UFX III as tape deck without DAW
    I can record the backing track, the amps and the dry guitar signal from instrument input

4. I can record the dry guitar signal from instrument input (also with DURec) and use it for reamping

5. I can play guitar through a virtual amp (VSTi) and record again the dry and the wet signal

6. By TM FX routing I can use the external FX (Lexicon PCM 81 and PCM 91) either for guitar, DAW
    or even both (PCM 81 with modulation effectst for guitar, PCM 91 for the DAW)

If I got an external guitar processor like you, then I would keep this setup and send the guitar signal via analog output to an external amp emulation and back to the UFX III for recording or playing.

You can see my setup and also a schematic, pictures and a sound demo (played through VSTi) in this blog article.
https://www.tonstudio-forum.de/blog/ent … iii-en-de/

Another sound demo when playing through the amp, mic'd signal. Really silent recording with only a few peaks at ~80dB:
https://www.tonstudio-forum.de/blog/Ent … -DURec-DE/
This article compares my old "analog setup" of over 20y ago with my later RME based setup and performing silent recording at "bedroom level" but using Mics.

There you also find a sound demo of >20y ago through a completely different environment using a combination of preamp section of combo amp, analog mixer and external FX which heavily colorizes the guitar signal and by this dominates the sound.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14
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Re: Spdif connection Line6 Helix

…or just use a little converter box for about 20€ ^^

https://www.soundonsound.com/forum/view … mp;t=78341

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  • ramses
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Re: Spdif connection Line6 Helix

To sum up, if you want the BBF Pro FS because of mobility, then only an analog connection might be possible, if the Helix has the needed routing options for dry/wet signal.

For more flexibility and to be able to use digital connections, I would definitively recommend using a UCX II here, which is still compact and gives you plenty of useful options more. More future-proof investment.

UFX II / III might be the best alternative if you think about studio setup and growths.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14
  • ramses
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Re: Spdif connection Line6 Helix

maggie33 wrote:

…or just use a little converter box for about 20€ ^^

https://www.soundonsound.com/forum/view … mp;t=78341

Would be another alternative to my presented "fallback" option to use analog :-)

Would even have the advantage to transfer the processed signal via digital link
and for the dry guitar signal he could use the (most likely) balanced XLR outputs.

Nice idea, thanks ;-)

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14
  • Registered: 2022-08-08
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Re: Spdif connection Line6 Helix

Thanks for the replies!
I already have the Babyface Pro Fs so I guess the only way is trying to use on of those converters.
Do you know if those converters,wich as you said are cheap,work in a decent way?

So I guess I should buy a converter, one spid coaxial cable and one toslink spidf cable.

I've just watched a video and I think that I could record the DI track just by using a 1/4 inch cable from the Helix "Send1 Output" to the instrument input of my Babyface.

I hope to get a professional DI guitar track by doing so ( by the way I'm more interested in having a good DI track signal than in having a good wet signal) so that I can reamp with Helix Native Vst or other amp sims.

8 Reply by waedi (edited by waedi 2024-05-31 17:52:09)

  • waedi
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Re: Spdif connection Line6 Helix

The Helix board has coax SPDIF connectors, the Babyface has optical.
Better forget the Helix.
Connect the guitar directly into the babyface and record the pure clean guitar signal.
Plenty of software solutions are out there to manipulate the guitar afterwards.
You can connect the Helix digitally to the Babyface by using two converter units, wich gives you a cable salad.
The Babyface is a perfect partner for every guitarist.

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Re: Spdif connection Line6 Helix

Do you know if those converters,wich as you said are cheap,work in a decent way?

Sorry, i by myself never used these converters. Check before buying, that it supports up to 192kHz and you can choose the direction (from optical to coax or the other way).

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  • Registered: 2024-06-08
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Re: Spdif connection Line6 Helix

Hey there, Babyface pro fs and HX stomp user here! I think that trying to connect the babyface and helix might be over-complicating things unless you need the combined # of inputs and/or need totalmix. Here's some alternate solutions I think might work better:

1. It sounds like you already have helix native already, so you could plug straight into your babyface and record through that.

2. You could record through the helix's USB. Output 7 is a dry di signal, while 1/2 is you affected signal (routing to 1-6 are actually customizable). I would probably just record output 7 and then copy the preset to Helix Native on that track; but I'm sure that some would recommend recording 1/2 and save 7 as a backup.

3. Plug your guitar into a DI box to split your signal to both helix and babyface. Mute the di>babyface signal but record this into your DAW. Plug your helix output to another babyface input and use this for monitoring in totalmix. You'll want to figure out the right gain setting on the DI to match the helix input.

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Re: Spdif connection Line6 Helix

maggie33 wrote:

…or just use a little converter box for about 20€ ^^

https://www.soundonsound.com/forum/view … mp;t=78341

I have two such boxes: one by Lindy which can convert in both ways coax - optical but only either or. The second is an old 'true bidirectional' one by Fostex (2nd hand buy). Both units do what they should absolutely without any issues or quality loss.

UCX - FF 400 - Babyface pro - Digiface USB - ADI-2 (original)
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Re: Spdif connection Line6 Helix

Thx Oli, good to know.

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