Topic: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Hi Guys,

I've just purchased a Fireface UC for live performances.

I'm having a serious problem with it:
On both my Macs, sound quality is totally distorted after waking up from sleep and after hot plugging. A fresh reboot fixes this but not an ideal solution.

The 2 macs:
1.Macbook Pro unibody 2.66 early 2009 with 4gb Ram running 10.6.1

2.Macbook Pro 2.5 early 2007 with 4gb Ram running 10.5.8

I have updated the firmware and software to the latest versions, fw 91 and driver 1.18

Is this the same bug that plagues other USB devices on macs that have over 4gb of RAM?

I've tried hubs, connecting directly & express card devices. All display the same results. The sound is very distorted. I've tried changing the sample rate to no effect.

Thanks


Corn

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Ps. Previous to this I used a fireface400 for 2.5 years that worked perfectly (until I dropped it last month!) and ithought the UC would be a better move.

3 (edited by titirom 2009-10-20 12:14:45)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

hello everybody,

Same problem here but just on hot plugging and some random distortion on record and playback (one short each 5, 10 minutes)

My config is Macbook Pro unibody 2.8 may 2009 with 4gb Ram running 10.6.1 clean install, latence 64 on logic 9,  fw 91 and driver 1.18

ps :(sorry for my poor english)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

I've now tested it on 3 other macs with the same problem. I was hoping that mine was an isolated case, so I could return it for a new one, as mine is faulty. But from the above response, it appears as though it could be a bug in the unit or driver.

Are there people reading this that don't have this problem?

I haven't heard back from support yet - but I will have investigate other units or a refund this week as I have a tour coming up soon, and this is a serious problem for me.

5 (edited by Timur 2009-10-21 00:13:18)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

I do experience the distortion, too. But I could not identify the real reason behind it. It's not just a problem of the UC driver, but OS X' USB driver turns upside down for anything audio until a reboot is done (means a NI Kore is distorted, too, once it happens).

Up to a few days ago I always thought it would be connected to Parallels Desktop, but then I had one incident where Parallels was not running at any time before it happened.

Do you happen to use a Logitech mouse maybe?

Problem is that during Beta I seemed to be the only person experiencing this and it happens somewhat randomly.

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Thanks for the reply.

Well, none of the 5 macs that I've tried it on have Parallels or a Logitech mouse. The last 2 macs I tried it on were Mac Pros. Both with 10.5.8.

For me, it isn't random, it constantly happens everytime.

2 other USB sound cards work totally fine on these computers under these circumstances- emagic emi-2|6 and a mbox mini.

I may see if I can exchange my UC this week from the retailer.

My sneaking suspicion It may actually be the 4gb of ram. Not that it is faulty ram but I've read bizarre circumstances where macs equiped with 4gb of ram or over play up with certain USB products when waking from sleep. I will test this shortly.

More reports are welcome!

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Could you please test if your other USB audio devices still work properly once the distortion thing happens with the UC?

I will try to reproduce your circumstances as well. The first time it happened for me (still in beta) I also woke the Macbook Pro from sleep. But I also had it happen without sleep mode (I don't use sleep very often, I prefer a clean boot-up), and then it happens rather sporadic/unpredictable.

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Hi Timur,

Yes.. I've tested the other 2 soundcards after waking up from sleep once the UC is distorted.. and no, they don't have this problem. It is specific to the UC. I can recreate it many times.

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

I just have the problem of the NI Kore dropping out while the UC does not. It doesn't matter if both run concurrently or not, it doesn't matter into which USB port I plug the Kore.

So I am still not convinced that this is a pure problem of the UC. Maybe both the UC and Kore use similiar mechanisms/system-calls, maybe the part of the OS X USB driver that is responsible for isochronous data transfer is bugged.

Whatever it is, I hope RME can find a solution once they can reproduce it according to your description. Right now they seem to be very busy with Snow Leopard though, so give them some time and don't use Sleep mode meanwhile. wink

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Timur!

You were on to something when you asked if I had Parallels installed. I didn't have Parallels installed... however, it was once installed on all 5 machines i tested. Parallels was unistalled some time ago but, it seemed to have not cleaned up properly after itself. It left an extension in the Computer > System > Library > Extensions folder named: "ConnectUSB.kext" I have removed this from 2 computers and the UC is now working correctly!!!

I haven't had a problem yet!

I'll do extensive testing over the next few days.. but this is great news so far.

Not only an I not getting problems... but I seem to be getting lower latency.

This is fantastic news!

thanks

11 (edited by Timur 2009-10-21 17:34:16)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

*snicker*

Hand me something and I will find the most exotic bugs. It's almost like a curse, but a sometimes a good one. cool

Thanks for checking back on the Parallels thing and for identifying the file. I will forward your finding to the Parallels development team and hopefully it will be fixed anytime soon (I am actively using Parallels).

How did you find and identify the kext?

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

hello guys,
I have parallels too "ver 4.0.3" but the problem of randoms distortions appear even is not runing and it's seem that version do not have the "ConnectUSB.kext" driver
  ( i can't find it on the computer) maybe the name of the driver had change.


sorry again for my poor english

13 (edited by Timur 2009-10-21 18:17:38)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

The "System" directory is hidden, you need to tell Finder to show hidden files via Terminal or via some application like "Mainmenu".

And the problem you describe is different from what we are discussing here anyway. Our kind of "distortion" (better dropouts) is permanent and can only be solved by rebooting. :-P

14 (edited by Timur 2009-10-21 18:35:06)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Forget what I wrote, it's not hidden. I mixed it up with some other folder. fryingpan

Unfortunately I don't find that extension on my system neither. How did you connect this extension to Parallels?

15 (edited by titirom 2009-10-22 16:28:31)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Timur,
Thank you for your reply,

I can't find the "ConnectUSB.kext" too
anyway my problem is for part the same: distortion permanently on some hot plug,   the different problem is shorts randoms dropouts, maybe it's part of same problem.

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Ah, sorry, I thought you only had short distortions every 5 to 10 minutes. It's quite possible that Parallels is the culprit, because a) it tries to catch USB devices from OS X and surely needs some low-level driver/kext for that, and b) is known not to work well with isochronous (aka audio) USB interfaces.

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

I was told by another Parallels user that "ConnectUSB.kext" is a version 3 file. So it seems that version 4 and 5 use different methods.

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Hi guys,

How did you find and identify the kext?

I simply went to the extensions folder and searched for anything with USB in it's name. Then, went to get info to see who the company was that issued the kext file.

I was told by another Parallels user that "ConnectUSB.kext" is a version 3 file. So it seems that version 4 and 5 use different methods.

ah... yes... I had an early version of Parallels.
I am no longer using Windows at all, so it suits me to not have it installed on machine now...  Can you uninstall Parallels and do a test?

I still would like to do more testing before confirming this is the problem but at this early stage, I haven't had an issue since removing this file.

I am a little disappointed RME support haven't answered any email in the past week. However... thanks to an excellent community forum.. I've managed to solve my problem. Now to solve yours!

19 (edited by ovorigin 2009-10-22 05:46:27)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

I have sound problems also, every 10 or 20 min the audio play back level drops with a digital distortion over the top of it for a second or 2, not pleasant and I Imagine it being worse really loud over a PA during a live gig sad

I sometimes get kernel panic if I plug it in when my computer is awake.

System sound regularly stops playing back when using different sound apps at once requiring me to go into prefs and re select it then quite the app, re open it and that usually fixes things, pretty annoying after a while.

Loud crackling when adjusting distortion levels with expression pedal via midi (maybe not RME problem)

latest drivers
snow leopard
ableton 8
santa rosa MBP, 4gig ram

SHOULD I TAKE MY OS BACK TO PRE SNOW LEOPARD? I NEED A STABLE SYSTEM TO START PLAYING LIVE.

I ASKED RME THIS IN AN EMAIL, NO REPLY sad

I'd like to add, this thing sounds amazing when its working, way clearer with a better stereo field than my apogee duet which in retrospect coloured and muted things slightly.

reverbnation.com/ovorigin

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Damn ... sorry to hear this ovorigin.
It's a pity RME support aren't replying to emails. Same here. It's been a week now.
I'd suggest doing what I did and seeing if there is an "unwanted" USB.kext file in your extensions. As to what is "unwanted"... I think that'll be a bit of testing.. this is also quite risky and it is not recommended to go fishing around in system folders. However, anything USB related that is not made by Apple is worth removing and testing without. I don't recommend rolling back to Leopard, as my Leopard machine was having problems too (as described above). It was the Parallels USB extension that was causing my problem.
I'm now working smoothly... for the moment!

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Hi,

Sorry for not replying earlier. I'm afraid I can't provide a solution unless the problem is reproducible. Have you tried the solution posted above?


Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

22 (edited by titirom 2009-10-22 14:38:07)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Hello everybody,

I confirm snow l?o seems to not be the problem I was on leopard before and had the sames problems.

For me the 1.16 driver solved the sleep problem but not the others.
ovorigin, do you have parallels on your mac ?

23 (edited by titirom 2009-10-22 15:57:17)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

I find some AppleUSB* .kext in my computer and:
-BJUSBLoad.kext
-EPSONUSBPrintClass.kext
-IOUSBFamily.kext
-IOUSBMassStorageClass.kext
-LexmarkUSBMerge.kext
-SM56KUSBAudioFamily.kext

Nothing seems connected with parallels.

I tried my uc in play stand alone and it seems to work perfectly,
so i presume it's not a hardware problem.

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Well,

my short lived remedy is over. I'm now experiencing the same issues. I've tried the lot. And still not word back from support (emailed a week ago). Aside form the very short response on this forum, I'm disappointed. All 5 computers are back. displaying the same problem. I've even tested another UC from a retailer- same problem. I can't find an obvious cause.

Well, I have a tour coming up.. and if this isn't resolved in the next few days, I'm going to look elsewhere and seek a refund. Restarting my computer every-time is not an option. I do a soundcheck > close the lid, so my gear can be moved for the other act > open the lid, play and it just should work. Restarting just before playing could happen, it's just a PITA!

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Talk about strange,
Going back into my extensions folder.. I found a Logitech USB mouse kext file on ALL computers I have tested this on. To my knowledge - These computers have never had a Logitech Mouse. I have never installed any Logitech software on my 2 laptops.So, I've removed it and the UC is working fine again. But why was it working earlier after removing the parallels usb kext file (and the logitech driver was still there)? Hmmm... I'm confused. I think all I'm doing is just guessing now and maybe my problem is quite random. Time will tell over the next few days.

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

OK.. after an hour of further testing.. I can say the problem is back. I wont speak so soon again.

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

corneliusw you don't have also the random dropout problem ?  just the sleep/hot plug problem ?

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

yes... just the sleep/hot plugin I'm sorry.

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

The strange thing is i have the hot plug problem too but not at all the sleep problem and for me the hot plug problem is random...

Very unattractive solution but what do you think about clean reinstall of one of yours mac ?

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Never had a crash with the hot-plug of the UC here, but the Kore kernel paniced my Leopard installation this week when hot-plugging it in.

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Very unattractive solution but what do you think about clean reinstall of one of yours mac ?

hmm... that would seriously suck at this point before a tour. Everything on all my machines is running perfectly - except for this. Other sound cards seem to be fine. I may just give up on the UC and see a refund or swap it for a FF400 - which is what I originally had and was working perfectly, until I dropped it!

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

hmm... that would seriously suck at this point before a tour.

I perfectly understand what you say :-)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Well, I've had a weekend of constant use over multiple machines and I can confirm things are still running quite bad. Now, after around 1 hour of constant use, it now develops the distortion problem that a few have described. I even created a new partition and installed a clean 10.6.1 with the basic audio software I use - same problem. I don't understand why things are now getting worse? This is feeling way more random than I expected and I definitely can't rely on this for gigs.

Is support ever going to answer my email? Or is the very simple feedback on this thread our only response?
HeadScratch

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

I've tried hard to find a logic for reproduce the hot plug problem and the distortion problem  but they are always random.
Maybe it's cyclic for the distortion problem but i'm not sure.

35 (edited by titirom 2009-10-27 16:51:00)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

forget what i told before. After more testing it's seems it's not cyclic, just random.

RME team, no ideas for us ?

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Hi,
Just to let you know that I'm using a UC interface since early August with a MacbookPro unibody(May 2009) 2.66Ghz/OS 10.5.8/4Go RAM and I've never had the problems you're having.
Using it daily with NI Kore as a host for VIs.I don't have any mouse or trackball connected.The UC is connected to one port and on the other one I have a hub for the Kore controller and dongles.
My external Hard drives are connected on the express card slot (eSATA).

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Hi,

I haven't posted for a while.. as I wanted to be as sure as possible and do many tests. Also thanks Watercolours for your feedback.

I've been concentrating on the two laptops, Macbook Pros. One Macbook Pro (2.4 Santa Rosa, June 07 running 10.5.8) is now working perfectly after reseting the SMC. Since resetting the SMC, all problems concerning the Fireface UC have disappeared! A relief.

However, my other computer- a Macbook Pro, (2.66 unibody with removable battery April 09 10.6.1) is not working perfectly, but much better and very usable with the UC. After resetting the SMC on this machine, I no longer have the distortion after waking up from sleep. This is brilliant! However, random distortion happens after it has been playing for a while... longer than 2-3 hours or when hot plugging USB peripherals. When I say random - I really mean random. I have been keeping a good record of all actions up until the point it distort. I will continue to test over the next week and provide feedback.

For the other guys experiencing problems.. definitely try the SMC reset:

http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1411

Good luck!

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

I can try the SMC reset, but since I've always been at the point where you are now it likely wont help much. wink

39 (edited by titirom 2009-11-05 17:53:08)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Hello everybody,

Thanks for the informations, i tried to reset the smc but some 2009 macbook pro like mine seems to have a problem with that...
for exemple:http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jsp … ;#10475004

i try to find more infos.

40 (edited by titirom 2010-01-04 00:12:59)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

one information more
when the plug-in/distortion problem come, i can have a perfect clean sound input with this setup for example :

http://img710.imageshack.us/img710/3307/reglageentreeexterne.jpg


mixed with the playback totally distorted sound, HeadScratch

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Hey,

when the plug-in/distortion problem come, i can have a perfect clean sound input with this setup for example :

titirom... same here. It's definitely not coming from the inputs.

After more use and a clean install on a new partition, I can confirm that the Macbook Pro early 2009, unibody with removable Battery, has issues and my other computers don't. I don't seem to have a hardware problem according to the hardware test cd, however there seems to be some incompatibility. I'm not sure what to do now... may just go back to a Fireface 400 if i can.

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

well guys,
for me the most worse problem is the dropout problem in recordings, impossible to record one shot without at less one or two small dropouts even with a 1024 samples buffer !
I had buy a mac and a fireface for make music with serenity, I'm not in heaven :-)
Corneliusw, if it's a new macbook incompatibility it's sad but Watercolours said "no problems" with is may 2009 macbook, very confusing.

ps: sorry if my english is a little bit strange, i don't speak very well.

43 (edited by titirom 2009-11-09 10:44:29)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

hi,
Some news: I tried with bootcamp/win xp, it's worse. For example in record, take a look at the error counter, after 15/20 sec :

     http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/5048/rmexp512.jpg


Same problem on playback.
Tried also without usb hub and with a new usb cable
I'm totally lost.
Corneliusw do you have a possibility to test with bootcamp ?

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Hm, it seems that Titirom's dropout problems are different from what we originally spoke about.

By the end of the week I will get a 2009 Macbook Pro (17") and report back how it things work on that one.

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Hi timur,

Thank you for future report on Macbook pro 2009.
Like i said before, i have also the hot plug distortion problem, and i though, maybe it's a part of same problem.
But maybe it's two different problems.
Do you think i can have two different problems ?

46 (edited by Timur 2009-11-09 21:23:44)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

The 2009 models use the same integrated NVidia chipset as my 2008 Unibody model. So your Windows error problems and OS X dropouts (apart from the original permanent distortion problem) shouldn't be happening due to the chipset. This sounds like a unique problem of your setup.

Did you follow all my advices on how to setup Bootcamp on a Macbook for troublefree audio (force video to fixed power state, unload KBDMGR, exchange WLAN driver etc)?

The hot-plug/sleep/whatever originating isochronous audio transfer breakup/distortion happening on OS X with both the UC and the NI Kore is something we all seem to share.

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Timur,
Thank you for your comments. Maybe i have a hardware problem and the shared hot-plug/sleep problem.
tomorrow if i have time i'm try your advices on bootcamp and see.

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Hi titirom,
I haven't tried with Basecamp... but to be honest.. I'm not really keen to install Windows. I managed to buy a second hand FF400 very cheap. It works perfectly, like my old one. Hopefully, my problems with the UC will eventually be addressed and solved. But for now, I can't rely on it and I have too much work and a tour and will use my FF400 for the tour. I hope one day the UC will work, but for now, it is too problematic.

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Hi Corneliusw,
Have a very good tour :-)

Re: UC problem on mac after wake up from sleep

Thanks!:-)