• Chi
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Topic: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

I'm about to put a new PC together and have some confusion about the state of affairs regarding PCI slots on newer Mobos.

As I understand it neither LGA 1151, 1150, or onward support native PCI despite having PCI slots and that they require bridging chips in order to facilitate PCI cards.  These bridging chips can vary somewhat in their performance along with swtiching and other things that I don't quite understand.

I have read some reports of PCI cards working fine bridged and others where cards are not even recognized. 

Ultimately I would really like to be sure before making the decision about which Mobo to go for.

I would dearly love to continue using my Hammerfall PCI card - i'm a poor student and cannot currently afford to upgrade to a newer RME solution (one day though for sure).  Ideally I would like to run with a Haswell build and a i74790 CPU.  Can anyone be so kind as to tell me a board which will be good for this?  big_smile

2 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2016-06-25 19:24:08)

  • ramses
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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

This is the only one I found with also M.2, USB 3.1 and Thunderbolt.
Its for the CPU you mentioned, socket 1150.
It has 2x PCI

And I think this is a very good equipped board for this price.
You should read tests / reviews and user comments, I only looked it up for you.

http://geizhals.de/?cat=mbp4_1150&v … p-A#xf_top

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14
  • Chi
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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

Thank you very much ramses - I shall try to find out about it.   

I would really like to know if anyone has had success with this or any other 1150 board and the PCI HSDP from first hand experience though - especially on this forum.

It's very hard to tell just from the specs given for the board if it will be good to build an audio system around.

  • ramses
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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

But you can also build a system up if you buy from a seller which gives you 1 month for cash back ....
If it doesnt work, give it back ... easy like that.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14
  • mr.r
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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

Cha, you search a bit here in the forum. There are at least two threads with mainboards for 1150 and 1151 that works.

  • Chi
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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

mr.r wrote:

Cha, you search a bit here in the forum. There are at least two threads with mainboards for 1150 and 1151 that works.

I did a search and found a thread about the same board that ramses found - Z97-A.  This is confirmed to be working well by two people in that thread which is very good news.  I noticed that you posted in the same thread asking about the board too.  Did you ever go with the Z97-A? If so, how do you find it?

Cheers :-D

7 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2016-06-26 05:44:54)

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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

Please note there are 3 different versions of the Z97-A. I mean the version which offers USB 3.1 and Thunderbolt.

ASUS Z97-A/USB 3.1 (90MB0L60-M0EAY0)
http://geizhals.de/asus-z97-a-usb-3-1-9 … mp;hloc=uk

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14

8 Reply by Chi (edited by Chi 2016-06-26 11:32:12)

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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

ramses wrote:

Please note there are 3 different versions of the Z97-A. I mean the version which offers USB 3.1 and Thunderbolt.

ASUS Z97-A/USB 3.1 (90MB0L60-M0EAY0)
http://geizhals.de/asus-z97-a-usb-3-1-9 … mp;hloc=uk

Wow, thanks - I would have not noticed that - I had the USB 3.0 version selected.  big_smile

Aside from the USB transfer rate being much faster, was there any other reason why the USB3.0 version of the board is not a good choice??

9 Reply by mr.r (edited by mr.r 2016-06-26 11:37:09)

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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

Chai, no. I'm still with my old machine because I can't decide at the moment what to get and my old machione still gets the job done. I'm still in the planing process for a complete new DAW environment.

10 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2016-06-26 12:04:38)

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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

Chi wrote:
ramses wrote:

Please note there are 3 different versions of the Z97-A. I mean the version which offers USB 3.1 and Thunderbolt.

ASUS Z97-A/USB 3.1 (90MB0L60-M0EAY0)
http://geizhals.de/asus-z97-a-usb-3-1-9 … mp;hloc=uk

Wow, thanks - I would have not noticed that - I had the USB 3.0 version selected.  big_smile

Aside from the USB transfer rate being much faster, was there any other reason why the USB3.0 version of the board is not a good choice??

If you spend money now for a new board, then you have it for around 3-4y ...
Who knows what demand you will have in 3-4y.
It will not pay out now to save maybe 20 bucks (didnt calculate that).

You might argue, that you might buy an USB 3.1 PCIe card later if you need it.

Answer:

1. in most cases you get much better performance if the communication chip is directly integrated into the mainboard design, compared to PCIe add-on cards. I had this issue with an old board where I wanted USB3 and Sata6. Only crap performance with the add-on combo cards.

2. Thunderbolt, shall you require it in the futute, can not simply be added to a mainboard. It needs preparation on the mainboard (AIC header). So either your board supports it or not.

For this reason "don't be silly" and get the stuff into the board as the price is still not much impacted by this choice.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14

11 Reply by Chi

  • Chi
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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

ramses wrote:
Chi wrote:
ramses wrote:

Please note there are 3 different versions of the Z97-A. I mean the version which offers USB 3.1 and Thunderbolt.

ASUS Z97-A/USB 3.1 (90MB0L60-M0EAY0)
http://geizhals.de/asus-z97-a-usb-3-1-9 … mp;hloc=uk

Wow, thanks - I would have not noticed that - I had the USB 3.0 version selected.  big_smile

Aside from the USB transfer rate being much faster, was there any other reason why the USB3.0 version of the board is not a good choice??

If you spend money now for a new board, then you have it for around 3-4y ...
Who knows what demand you will have in 3-4y.
It will not pay out now to save maybe 20 bucks (didnt calculate that).

Yes, that does make sense.  Hmm....i've been searching around some more and it seems that a Skylake setup might be even better for a similar outlay.  Specifically the Z170 boards, some of which have PCI, together with an i76700K.

The ASUS Z170-A has one PCI slot which is all I need. I'm now unsure again which build to go with :-D

12 Reply by garry (edited by garry 2016-06-26 22:23:39)

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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

I use the z170-a with i7 6700k and my old trusty pci hdsp9652..
Rock solid!

_

RME HDSP9652 | | RME Digiface USB

13 Reply by Chi

  • Chi
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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

garry wrote:

I use the z170-a with i7 6700k and my old trusty pci hdsp9652..
Rock solid!

That's great news - thanks! Do you use the integrated graphics on the CPU or a separate GPU?

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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

Chi wrote:
garry wrote:

I use the z170-a with i7 6700k and my old trusty pci hdsp9652..
Rock solid!

That's great news - thanks! Do you use the integrated graphics on the CPU or a separate GPU?

Integrated graphics driving 2 x 24" dell screens
16gb ram
Windows 10 x64
Cubase 8.5.20x64
Wavelab 9.0.20x64
Reaper 5.21 x64

Been running for a few months now, and zero issues at all.

_

RME HDSP9652 | | RME Digiface USB

15 Reply by Chi

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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

garry wrote:

Been running for a few months now, and zero issues at all.

Wow - that's impressive big_smile Well, I think this is the board I will go with then, thanks for all the info everyone.

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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

even better was that i didnt even need to reinstall windows..
my old board/cpu was intel based ..

after replacing the board, and setting the ssd to boot device, it booted straight to windows... installed the latest intel drivers /chipset/vga and activate windows, and all done. I expected a couple of days to reinstall

Also worth noting is to have a look for XMP profile supported ram, as it then automagically safely overclocks the cpu...
Ive never really bothered with overclocking before, but the biox/ram auto does it for you, so my 4.00ghz is running at 4.20ghz

_

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17 Reply by Chi

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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

garry wrote:

even better was that i didnt even need to reinstall windows..
my old board/cpu was intel based ..

after replacing the board, and setting the ssd to boot device, it booted straight to windows... installed the latest intel drivers /chipset/vga and activate windows, and all done. I expected a couple of days to reinstall

Also worth noting is to have a look for XMP profile supported ram, as it then automagically safely overclocks the cpu...
Ive never really bothered with overclocking before, but the biox/ram auto does it for you, so my 4.00ghz is running at 4.20ghz


Ha, that's pretty amazing! I'm coming from a Q9450 on a asus P5Q-WS board....XP 32bit too so I'm going to need to get Win7 64bit on the new build.  A fresh install will be necessary for that.  I've not done the overclocking thing either but it seems many pro DAW builders say it is actually a bit silly not to do it these days so I will gladly let the BIOS squeeze a few more mhz out.  Such a relief to find out that keeping the RME card is not going to be an issue.

18 Reply by Chi

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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

Thanks for all the help people big_smile

I can happily confirm that the PCI HDSP Card is working brilliantly with the ASUS Z170-A board, 6700K, 32 GB DDR4 2133Mhz, Win7 Pro 64, Cubase 8.5.   As has been mentioned already, the performance gain has been incredible.  On my old Core2Quad Q9540 system I had no chance of running much more than an audio track at a 32 buffer without constant ASIO dropouts. Using a 256 buffer and a piano library in Kontakt would put serious strain on the system and run the ASIO meter up around 70% with the sustain pedal held and many notes.  Now it is easy to play the same piano down to the lowest buffer without any issues and with suprisingly low ASIO impact - not more than 10% with sustain pedal held and all notes pressed using elbows!! At my usual 256 buffer I struggle to make the ASIO meter register more than a couple of percent no matter what.  Night and day!  Perhaps the PCI bridge might struggle with high track counts like MADI is capable of but for the Multiface Hammerfall it is working much much better than my last system with all 8x Multiface analog ins + SPDIF ins + 8x ADAT ins for a total of 18ins and 18outs.  I'm a very happy camper here.  Highly recommended for PCI users looking to continue using the HDSP Hammerfall card.

  • ramses
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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

There are several Z170-A / Z170A boards out there .. can you please link to the product or give the full description of the board like i.e.: ASUS Z170-A (90MB0LS0-M0EAY0), thanks.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14
  • garry
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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

ramses wrote:

There are several Z170-A / Z170A boards out there .. can you please link to the product or give the full description of the board like i.e.: ASUS Z170-A (90MB0LS0-M0EAY0), thanks.

The Asus z170-a is the one I use... "Z170-A Intel Z170 LGA1151 DDR4 USB3.0 ATX Motherboard"
http://www.asus.com/uk/Motherboards/Z17 … k_Download

_

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21 Reply by Chi

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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

ramses wrote:

There are several Z170-A / Z170A boards out there .. can you please link to the product or give the full description of the board like i.e.: ASUS Z170-A (90MB0LS0-M0EAY0), thanks.

Sure, its the ASUS Z170-A, ATX, Z170, DDR4, PCIe-x16, SLI/CFX, DP, HDMI, DVI, M.2, USB3.1 :
Part No. 90MBOLSO-MOEYO

https://www.komplett.no/product/850509/ … rect=true#

22 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2016-07-09 07:30:22)

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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

Chi wrote:
ramses wrote:

There are several Z170-A / Z170A boards out there .. can you please link to the product or give the full description of the board like i.e.: ASUS Z170-A (90MB0LS0-M0EAY0), thanks.

Sure, its the ASUS Z170-A, ATX, Z170, DDR4, PCIe-x16, SLI/CFX, DP, HDMI, DVI, M.2, USB3.1 :
Part No. 90MBOLSO-MOEYO

https://www.komplett.no/product/850509/ … rect=true#

This board I can't find: "90MBOLSO-MOEYO", the one which I found for you is named slightly different:
90MB0LS0-M0EAY0
                        ^!!!

I looked at the link you provided and there I see no information about, whether the board supports thunderbolt.
Does it has Thunderbolt ? Which one ? 2 or 3 ?

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14
  • garry
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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

ramses wrote:
Chi wrote:
ramses wrote:

There are several Z170-A / Z170A boards out there .. can you please link to the product or give the full description of the board like i.e.: ASUS Z170-A (90MB0LS0-M0EAY0), thanks.

Sure, its the ASUS Z170-A, ATX, Z170, DDR4, PCIe-x16, SLI/CFX, DP, HDMI, DVI, M.2, USB3.1 :
Part No. 90MBOLSO-MOEYO

https://www.komplett.no/product/850509/ … rect=true#

This board I can't find: "90MBOLSO-MOEYO", the one which I found for you is named slightly different:
90MB0LS0-M0EAY0
                        ^!!!

I looked at the link you provided and there I see no information about, whether the board supports thunderbolt.
Does it has Thunderbolt ? Which one ? 2 or 3 ?

Says on Asus website ... their z170-a has an internal thunderbolt header. Doesn't say which version though
https://www.asus.com/uk/Motherboards/Z1 … fications/

Some googling may help you.

_

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24 Reply by Chi

  • Chi
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Re: New Motherboard - PCI slot advice

ramses wrote:
Chi wrote:
ramses wrote:

There are several Z170-A / Z170A boards out there .. can you please link to the product or give the full description of the board like i.e.: ASUS Z170-A (90MB0LS0-M0EAY0), thanks.

Sure, its the ASUS Z170-A, ATX, Z170, DDR4, PCIe-x16, SLI/CFX, DP, HDMI, DVI, M.2, USB3.1 :
Part No. 90MBOLSO-MOEYO

https://www.komplett.no/product/850509/ … rect=true#

This board I can't find: "90MBOLSO-MOEYO", the one which I found for you is named slightly different:
90MB0LS0-M0EAY0
                        ^!!!

I looked at the link you provided and there I see no information about, whether the board supports thunderbolt.
Does it has Thunderbolt ? Which one ? 2 or 3 ?


Apologies - I typed the part number incorrectly - it is : 90MB0LS0-M0EAY0 - the same as you found for me.

There is an internal header for Thunderbolt - the manual says it is for ASUS ThunderboltEX series support.  It goes on to explain that the header supports Intel's Thunderbolt Technology allowing you to connect up to 6 enabled devices and a Display-port enabled display in a daisy-chain config.