Topic: Question coming from Focusrite Clarett USB 18x20 to Fireface II

On the Clarett there are analog pots on the front for all the inputs. I am considering a Fireface II USB and understand there are no gain levels available for inputs 1-8 other than a couple of fixed settings for each channel. Has anyone else made a similar switch? Did you miss the gain pots on the Clarett or is it not a significant issue? Thanks for your thoughts.

2 (edited by ramses 2018-08-23 21:43:37)

Re: Question coming from Focusrite Clarett USB 18x20 to Fireface II

Its controller digitally via TotalMix FX.
By this you can store and recall settings in so called snapshots.
You have 8 Snapshots per Workspace.
You can save/recall as many workspaces as you like on your PCs filesystem.
Additionally TM FX offers 30 Workspace Quick Select Slots which are easily to recall.

The input sensitivity of the rear inputs can be changed in TotalMix (Input Channel Settings, LoGain / +4 dBu and Gain), assuring the highest signal to noise ratio will be achieved. Also try to achieve an optimum input level by adjusting the source itself. You won't miss the gain knobs. Is much nicer to be able to save and recall the settings as well as the routing.

IMHO the RME product offering is much better / advanced compared to the competition (TotalMix, ARC USB, Durec, Digicheck Tools). There is nothing comparable.

If you need an even more scalable solution, get UFX+ and add up to 8 Octamic XTC via MADI.
Remote control works via MIDI over MADI (no additional MIDI cables required).
And all up to 8 XTC can run as so called AUX device in the same TM FX instance of the UFX+.
Then you can store the settings of UFX+ and the 8 Octamic digitally.

Only to put examples whats all possible.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: Question coming from Focusrite Clarett USB 18x20 to Fireface II

Thanks, that is helpful. I guess I am used to using the Gain pots on the front of the Clarett to adjust the level that goes to my DAW. I know the sensitivity of inputs 1-8 can be adjusted in TotalMix. Do most folks with the Fireface fine tune the DAW input by adjusting  the original source? Just trying to figure out the work flow. Thanks again.

Re: Question coming from Focusrite Clarett USB 18x20 to Fireface II

Another thing. I had approx 5y ago the Focusrite Liquid Saffire 56 and the Octopre Mk II. The Poti quality was very bad. On the 1st ~75% of Poti doesn't have any effect, the real gain adjustment then happens on the last 25%.

On the RME you choose between 2 Reference Levels, LoGain and +4 dBu depending what input sensitivity is required depending what type of signal the source delivers, more consumer levels or studio levels which are higher.

The additional Gain knob is additionally to the reference level setting to fine tune line inputs 1 to 8 from 0 dB to +12 dB.

Regard the 1st as a general settings for consumer or studio level and then additional fine tuning to add some gain if required to find an optimum level.

The TotalMix faders are simply for creating the submix for each output.
Every output is a submix of its own.

The concept of operations in TM FX is very logic and structured, the best I ever seen from operations and feature wise.
In submix mode you click to an output, phones or main monitors for example, and then you simply adjust the faders of HW inputs (what comes from the inputs of the recording device directly - top row of faders) and the SW playback channels, whats comes from either DAW (RME ASIO driver) or OS/Applications (RME WDM driver), this is the middle row of faders.
As you can easily see where a signal is, you can very quickly create the routing / submix for each of the output channels.

Another things .. With the introduction of the Scarlett Series the Focusrite drivers do not support loopback operation anymore, bummer !

With RME Loopback operation is easy .. you route something to an output of your choice, i.e. ADAT1/2, press Loopback there and you have the desired submix on the corresponding HW input ADAT1/2 and can record it with either DAW or another PC application, if you created the WDM device for ADAT1/2. In the driver settings dialog you can choose for which channels you wish to have WDM devices, so that non-ASIO aware applications can make use of those channels. If you have Speakers conntected behind a channel, i.e. Analog 1/2, then there is a second Tab in the drivers settings dialog, where you choose Speaker channels. This creates then an ouput in the Windows Sound settings.

Everything very flexible, reliable, logic. Never saw something better. Try both you will see and find out yourself.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: Question coming from Focusrite Clarett USB 18x20 to Fireface II

JM,

I also came from Focusrite Liquid Saffire 56 to a Fireface UFX.  While Focusrite makes some great products (and I really enjoy their mic preamp sound), their low and mid tier product lines (that I have used) just don't work as well on the digital front (driver et al).  For me it was all about clean, low latency sound from interface, thru diver, to DAW and in this regard, there are simply no better devices than RME (I've been a customer since multiface mkI). 

I agree with Ramses that the gain knobs are not a big "miss" for me on the Fireface.  Of course everyone is different but as I have gotten older, I find I use less gain in the analog domain with less risk of a hard clip.  The audio interfaces of today are so good and low noise, that pushing gain on the preamp is a little bit unnecessary.  So in this way, I kind of do a course set and forget of the gain setting.  After a quick check I may bump it once but I'm not a gain knob rider at all.

Regarding the other feature sets of RME devices, I think they are also second to none.  I have had my Liquid Saffire for a very long time now and I still struggle to figure out the software mixer thing.  For me, Totalmix is simply the best (maybe because that's what I started on) and Digicheck is a MUST HAVE tool.

Ramses, I was glad to read your comment about the gain knobs on the Saffire.  I thought perhaps I was a little goofy thinking that they were odd.  Very true that the gain adjustment on the Saffire is very non-intuitive (non-linear).  I never believed it was pot quality but more to do with the way Focusrite wanted to setup the gain adjustment.  And funny, I have had microphones that overloaded the channel with a zero gain adjustment (needing an external pad) and other microphones that I just couldn't get enough gain. 

R

Rob

Re: Question coming from Focusrite Clarett USB 18x20 to Fireface II

Focusrite and many other companies simply are missing time, engagement and passion to deliver better quality products.
On the other hand one simply must say .. they deliver cheap devices for "the masses" you can't deliver RME quality for such a low price. And some of their more expensive products are simply too expensive if you compare this them with RME (how less they deliver).

In terms of preamp sound. I think the sound has to come from the artist / room / mic.
I don't think its a good idea if preamps have a sound on their own.
They should IMHO be transparent and simply record what comes in in the best possible way.

In terms of gain, I really love autoset to find the proper gain and then store it and then deactivate autoset.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: Question coming from Focusrite Clarett USB 18x20 to Fireface II

Robkress - yes, I too have not been able to get comfortable with the Focusrite software. I see a short section in the Fireface UFX II manual about DIGIcheck? I was not aware of it until you mentioned it. Sounds like something worth checking out.

Ramses - thanks for the suggestion about using Autoset for proper gain and then saving it in a Snapshot.

Just ordered the Fireface UFX II.  Thanks for your help.

Re: Question coming from Focusrite Clarett USB 18x20 to Fireface II

JM345 - good luck with your new device.  The community here is super supportive and when you have questions, lots of people are eager to help out.  Your first stop when getting your device should be the manual.  It is long and dense but the definitive source for all you need to know.  And..... everyone here will tell you to RTM smile

As a side note, I did end up keeping my Fousrite Saffire box.  I agree with Ramses that it is good to have clean transparent preamps (RME) but I also do like preamps with character.  If you have kept your Clarrett box, you may be able to connect it to the Fireface (via adat) and have both worlds (RME and Focusrite preamps).  In my setup, I have fireface with Focusrite Saffire input through adat and then a presonus M80 (8 channel preamp) coming into the Fireface via analog inputs. 

I am a drummer so I have at times needed more than 4 mics.  I also use my gear (some or all) at times for live shows I do with my musician friends.  The RME gear is so stable and reliable, it's easy to take and run a show from stage with a laptop.

R

Rob

Re: Question coming from Focusrite Clarett USB 18x20 to Fireface II

Robkress - thanks for the support. Yes, folks here have been very helpful. I have been reading the manual and watching the videos to get up to speed with the Fireface II.

Thanks for the suggestion of keeping my Clarett, but I think I will have enough inputs with the Fireface II. And I am hoping for a cleaner/more neutral preamp and converters with the Fireface II. I'm just hoping I won't miss the input gain pots that are on the Clarett.

Re: Question coming from Focusrite Clarett USB 18x20 to Fireface II

Look here, wrote a little TM FX setup primer.
https://www.tonstudio-forum.de/blog/ind … rnal-equi/

Collection of RME video tutorials here:
https://www.tonstudio-forum.de/blog/ind … al-Videos/

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: Question coming from Focusrite Clarett USB 18x20 to Fireface II

Ramses - thanks for links. I have seen some of the videos and linked to others. They have been very helpful.