Topic: Help with setting up S/PDIF...Babyface Pro???

Hello,

I have a Kemper Profiling amplifier hooked up to my Babyface Pro...then going into my DAW, Logic X. I was told that I could use the S/PDIF connections on the Babyface Pro with the Kemper (which also has S/PDIF). I am confused as to how to hook things up with the Babyface Pro?

Thanks.

OS X 10.14.6, Logic Pro 10.4.6
RME Babyface Pro

Re: Help with setting up S/PDIF...Babyface Pro???

ramses wrote:

What did you do up to now ?
What is not working ?

What you need to do roughly:
In RME driver settings dialog:
1. set ADAT to optical SPDIF protocol
2. set BBFP to read clock from ADAT, because AFAIR Kemper is unable to be clock slave
    Or you would need a SRC (sample rate converter) in between
    https://www.kemper-amps.com/forum/index … ock-s-pdif

Thanks! Just inquiring as of right now because I'd like to free up the outputs on my Kemper by using the S/PDIF option. Haven't even bought the S/PDIF cables yet. Up to now I have been using the conventional XLR out to 1/4 inch line-in into the Babyface Pro from the Kemper.

I have read that the Kemper has to be the master and that the sample rate has to be set to 44.1 kHz in order for the S/PDIF connection to work.

OS X 10.14.6, Logic Pro 10.4.6
RME Babyface Pro

3 (edited by deckard1 2019-09-22 07:21:14)

Re: Help with setting up S/PDIF...Babyface Pro???

ramses wrote:

Oh I just realize, Kemper has no optical SPDIF.

Then it would be better for you to use an RME recording interface with coaxial SPDIF and eventually more analog lines.

Thanks. So how would it be set up regarding the cables if the Kemper is to be the master?

OS X 10.14.6, Logic Pro 10.4.6
RME Babyface Pro

4 (edited by ramses 2019-09-22 07:58:50)

Re: Help with setting up S/PDIF...Babyface Pro???

Sorry I had to re-think and updated several times, so you read some snapshots when I saved in between my writing.

Its tricky, because Kemper offers so many possibilties and has several ports (analog and digital) and its difficult now to guess in what way you want to use this box. Connecting the Kemper only to SPDIF will surely not be the only thing that you want to perform as there are possibilities also to record the dry and wet signals, to reamp, and and and ...

Best would be somebody answers who has already a Kemper in use and has already a good workflow with the box and can tell about the required cabling.

Other things to consider:

1. Kemper has no optical SPDIF and BBF Pro has no coaxial SPDIF
2. Kemper can only act as clock master and dictates his sample rate to the project (assumed that clock quality of RME recording interface will be of better)

There are several possibilities to solve this
- get separate converter to convert coaxial SPDIF to optical SPDIF
  i.e. https://www.thomann.de/de/lindy_audioko … igital.htm
- get a recording interface with coaxial SPDIF
   RME UC, UCX, ...
- get a SRC (sample rate converter) in between which supports also coaxial SPDIF, to decouple Kemper clocking from the rest of your setup and sample rate from the rest of your setup

The only RME device which comes to my mind which performs SRC is the ADI-2 Pro FS.

You could also connect an ADI-2 Pro FS to the ADAT IN/OUT of your BBF Pro.

Then the ADI-2 Pro FS should be able to perform SRC
- Kemper can act as clock master and stat at 48 kHz
- BBF Pro can stay clock master and ADI-2 Pro FS anyway refreshes clocks and performs AD/DA conversion
  by using its own FS clock

This setup might also be beneficial to make D/A conversion better for monitors and phones and you have all the benefits from the ADI-2 Pro FS.

But then again I question myself whether you then have enough inputs and outputs, because the Kemper offers a lot of possibilites to output the Amp signal with and without effects, etc ....

So .. I am not 100% sure whether you get the ideal cabling with only BBF Pro and even if you add ADI-2 Pro I am not sure whether at the end still some more analog inputs and outputs would be wanted.

Eventually a combination of
- UC / UCX and
- ADI-2 Pro (for SRC etc ..)
would be the ideal combination for a Kemper.
Because then you have
- SRC to decouple clock from Kemper
- Better D/A in general for phones and speaker
- More analog ports

But this is roughly from memory and needs some more time to think about the whole setup and how you want to use this ... for me I have no quick answer for you in terms of the whole general concept with Kemper.

To solve the cabling issue only you only need something like this lindy converter or you need a different recording interface which has also an coaxial SPDIF input like UC or UCX.

Another solution might be to stay analog, but then you might need more analog I/O than your BBF Pro delivers.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: Help with setting up S/PDIF...Babyface Pro???

OS >= 5.5.0 allows Kemper to use SPDIF at all sample rates up to 96 kHz.
But it still can only act as clock master.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t233PF9e_FE

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

6 (edited by ramses 2019-09-22 08:11:34)

Re: Help with setting up S/PDIF...Babyface Pro???

Assumed that all you want is to digitally record Kemper via SPDIF and nothing more
(no recording of dry signal etc), the Lindy converter alone might be sufficient for you
to get it going.
You simply need to use Kemper as clock master and set BBF Pro to get clock from ADAT.
And here is the converter link again:
https://www.thomann.de/de/lindy_audioko … igital.htm

In the postings before I was under the impression, that you have to connect more inputs / outputs of the kemper.
Maybe this digital connection is sufficient for straight recording of wet signal and reamping.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: Help with setting up S/PDIF...Babyface Pro???

Thanks Ramses! I think I will go the adapter route as the Babyface Pro was my upper limit with regards to spending funds on an interface. Do you know by chance why they didn’t put separate ADAT and SPDIF connections on the Babyface Pro? Lack of space? It is a compact unit.

Thanks.

OS X 10.14.6, Logic Pro 10.4.6
RME Babyface Pro

Re: Help with setting up S/PDIF...Babyface Pro???

lightbox wrote:

The "new" Kemper Profiler Stage can be slaved, the Head and the Rack can't.

Cheers
Martin

This is cool news thanks ;-)

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: Help with setting up S/PDIF...Babyface Pro???

deckard1 wrote:

Thanks Ramses!

I think I will go the adapter route as the Babyface Pro was my upper limit with regards to spending funds on an interface.

Do you know by chance why they didn’t put separate ADAT and SPDIF connections on the Babyface Pro? Lack of space? It is a compact unit.

Thanks.

Only a few assumptions from my side:
- the box is full and it has no full implementation of FX chip certainly for some reasons
- More i/o require more energy
- Eventually also bigger FPGA
- Power consumption might become too big which doesn't allow for bus powering the unit
Finally it will cost more money to put all stuff into such a small box and eventually move it into
a price range were people might think, a little too expensive ...

But at the end you have the possibility to configure ADAT to act as optical SPDIF.

If this unit is too small, well get the UC or UCX ...

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: Help with setting up S/PDIF...Babyface Pro???

I got the two SPDIF cables and the converter for the Babyface Pro to use with the Kemper. Is the optical toslink cable that goes into the Babyface's SPDIF connection supposed to fit nice and snug...tightly I mean? It seems like a loose connection. I wasn't sure.

Thanks.

OS X 10.14.6, Logic Pro 10.4.6
RME Babyface Pro

11

Re: Help with setting up S/PDIF...Babyface Pro???

Look closely - is it fully inserted?

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

12 (edited by deckard1 2019-10-04 09:11:58)

Re: Help with setting up S/PDIF...Babyface Pro???

MC wrote:

Look closely - is it fully inserted?

How would I tell? I didn't want to force it in.

Here's the exact cable I am using going into the Babyface Pro:

https://www.amazon.com/AmazonBasics-Dig … &psc=1

Thanks.

OS X 10.14.6, Logic Pro 10.4.6
RME Babyface Pro

Re: Help with setting up S/PDIF...Babyface Pro???

Look at the comments:

https://www.amazon.com/product-reviews/ … filter-bar

[...] These Amazon cables - the connector end has become worn / degraded from just a few connect / disconnect cycles, to where the cable is now loose in the port. This is not due to abuse, it is due to a very soft plastic end that is not made for any sort of durability. [...]

Should it be a cable issue, Mutec TOSLINK cables are very good and reliable.
https://www.thomann.de/de/mutec_optisches_kabel_2m.htm

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

14 (edited by deckard1 2019-10-04 10:33:56)

Re: Help with setting up S/PDIF...Babyface Pro???

ramses wrote:

Look at the comments:

https://www.amazon.com/product-reviews/ … filter-bar

[...] These Amazon cables - the connector end has become worn / degraded from just a few connect / disconnect cycles, to where the cable is now loose in the port. This is not due to abuse, it is due to a very soft plastic end that is not made for any sort of durability. [...]

Should it be a cable issue, Mutec TOSLINK cables are very good and reliable.
https://www.thomann.de/de/mutec_optisches_kabel_2m.htm

Thanks, Ramses. Good eye. Cable is definitely defective. I submitted the cable for a return with Amazon and got my money back right away without even having to send the cable back. I'll have to purchase another brand.

OS X 10.14.6, Logic Pro 10.4.6
RME Babyface Pro