1 Topic by Blindsmyth (edited by Blindsmyth 2020-04-20 17:59:41)

  • Registered: 2020-04-20
  • Posts: 7

Topic: UCX Standalone Midi Control Not Working

Hey there I am trying to control my UCX in Standalone via Mackie Control Messages.

I generate the Mackie Control Messages via an axoloti open source board that sends to midi port 2 of UCX. There is no feedback coming back so output port 2 is not enabled in the settings menu. I also send audio from axoloti to the ucx and back in order to test if standalone control is working.

So in my test sitaution axoloti is connected to input 5/6 and getting audio from the UCX via Out 5/6

What I'm trying to do is routing input 5/6 to output 5/6 and then check in the axoloti to see if a test tone is coming back.

When connected to computer this works fine. The output is moving in the matrix, I see the audio coming back in axoloti, midi monitor confirms, that I send the right midi messages:Message   Chan  Data
17:52:53.306    From Fireface UCX (23692129) Port 2    Note On    1    E-2    127
17:52:53.446    From Fireface UCX (23692129) Port 2    Note Off    1    E-2    0
17:52:55.734    From Fireface UCX (23692129) Port 2    Pitch Wheel    5    8064

Also recalling a setup that puts all faders in the matrix down works:
17:53:23.015    From Fireface UCX (23692129) Port 2    Note On    1    F♯2    127
17:53:23.163    From Fireface UCX (23692129) Port 2    Note Off    1    F♯2    0

However when unplugging the usb connection to the computer, neither changing the fader via Pb nor recalling the setup vie midi note works.
I can tell this because I leave the fader sending to 5/6 high, so I see audio coming back in axoloti. Either via PB or via the setup recall I should be able to turn down the audio coming back to axoloti.
Also on the hardware itself the incoming midi is still indicated by the blinking led.

I have midi control and standalone midi enabled. I stored the current State into the device on all Setups. (1-6)
I also tried restarting the ucx afer unplugging. No effect.

I have read the manual countless time and don't know what the problem could be.

  • Registered: 2020-04-20
  • Posts: 7

Re: UCX Standalone Midi Control Not Working

Any answer from the support? I tried to be as detailed as possible but to put it short:

There is a midi device connected to midi input 2 sending pitchbend messages and midi notes (mackie control) to change faders in the matrix.
It is working with Totalmix open. When total mix is shut down it's not working. Midi control and standalone midi are enabled. I confirm with midi monitor that I am sending the right messages. Why is it not working?

3 Reply by MC

  • MC
  • MC
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  • From: Germany/Thailand
  • Registered: 2007-04-06
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Re: UCX Standalone Midi Control Not Working

My guess is that you don't send all required Mackie Protocol messages needed for full communication. TotalMix FX might be more compatible than the hardware itself. The firmware based stand-alone mode has been added many years ago and (as mentioned in the manual) works with dedicated hardware controllers. It also might require two-way communication.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

MC's Website

4 Reply by Blindsmyth (edited by Blindsmyth 2020-04-24 12:27:50)

  • Registered: 2020-04-20
  • Posts: 7

Re: UCX Standalone Midi Control Not Working

Ok thank you for your answer. This would explain why it is not reacting to pitchbend messages, however I also tried a simple setup change via Midi Note F#2. Today I tried this again using a normal midi keyboard and again there is no setup change.

So just to confirm I didn't make any mistakes here:
I turn down all the faders in the matrix. I save this to snapshot 1. I hit "store current state into device" and I choose setup one.
Midi Control and Standalone midi are enabled.
Then I put the fader of my test tone up.
When total mix is on I can reacall the "empy" setup with note F#2 where all faders are down, and I see in the matrix all faders going donw I and I see that my test tone is gone.
I close total mix, press note F#2, nothing is happening, my test tone is still ariving in the interface.

So I use a "normal" midi keyboard and normal midi messages but have no response from the interface.

UPDATE: I flashed the latest Firmware and now I can change setups in standalone, however pitchbend is still not working. So propably you are right in that there might a bit more about the mackie protocoll, that I'm missing.

5 Reply by Blindsmyth (edited by Blindsmyth 2020-04-25 14:59:34)

  • Registered: 2020-04-20
  • Posts: 7

Re: UCX Standalone Midi Control Not Working

Ok I got the pitchbend messages to work. The weird thing was that somehow midi input 2 was not working with the midi keyboard either, so I switched to input 1. I'm also not sure if uploading a setup always works, I need to make more testing sitautions with all the ins and outs to check this.

Anyway for all the nerds reading here: There is an exchange of sysex messages with the host when a mackie controller is connected, called "host connection query". Somehow I found out that before selecting a submix, one of these sysex messages has to be sent. This is an example of how such a string could look like (taken form here https://github.com/mzuther/PythonMcu/bl … honMcu.tex
{
    0xF0, // Sysex start
    0x00,0x00,0x66, // Header
    0x14, // Header Model ID 14=Mackie Control
    0x01, // Data Fix
    0x5F,0x70,0x79,0x4D,0x43,0x55,0x5F, // Serialnumber bytes _pyMCU_
    0x74,0x65,0x73,0x74, // challenge bytes t,e,s,t
    0xF7}

What I'm doing now is pairing this sysex message, note on and off for the submix with the pitchbend message, to create like volume faders for 1 input going to several outputs simultaneously. It seems to work fine if you don't send to many bytes in too short time and if you're very careful on in which order and timing you send the bytes.

I was doing this before with no effort with cc messages. I could modulate one fader going to multiple outputs with different lfos and have it working with no problem. The standalone midi however seems to be a bit less robust, if you send it too many bytes you get glitchy sounds. It might be also that the huge sysex string of 18bytes is clogging up the midi stream.

Propably the best thing at this point is to get a real mackie controller and have a look in detail in the communcation between the controller and the ucx. But I'm quite confident that I can turn the UCX into a standalone midi controller mixer/patchbay with the bits I have working now.

  • Registered: 2020-04-20
  • Posts: 7

Re: UCX Standalone Midi Control Not Working

I've found out, that it is enough to send this sysex message every second, which frees up my midi stream enough to make smooth volume control. However it always resets the first fader moved by pitchbend message.

I've found out that this sysex handshake only happens on MCU controllers. HUI controllers use standart midi messages in order to do so. However the UCX showed unresponsive to these handshake messages (basically a ping with midi note 0)

Is the UCX compatible with a mackie HUI controller?