• tbger
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Topic: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

Hi,


I'd like to upgrade my setup with a dedicated AD/DA unit which would record onto my PC.  I've figured the FireFace UC should be a good solution for this, being equipped with very good quality conversion capabilities.

I would like to ask a few questions in order to know if it would suit my needs.  Since I'm not a professional, I might have asked about obvious things, please forgive me for that.


1.  Is the ADAT socket on the FireFace also stereo capable ?  I need it for 2-channel optical toslink.

2.  Practically, do my computer have to be very strong in order to handle the FireFace's processes successfully (i.e. without dropouts, etc.) ?

3.  Does the FireFace accept 32kHz signal via the ADAT input (supposing it accepts a stereo signal) ?


I'm sure some of this may have been answered in the Manual, but I can't thoroughly comprehend everything written there.


Thank you very much,
Roy

2 Reply by MC

  • MC
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Re: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

1. and 3. Yes.
2. I can not answer.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

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Re: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

Are you referring to 32k SPDIF, e.g. DAT Longplay? That will work just fine.
I'm not aware of actual ADAT converters that will do 32k...

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

RME Support's Website

4 Reply by waedi (edited by waedi 2021-01-30 05:21:52)

  • waedi
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Re: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

question 2 : No, the computer don't need to be very strong.
This question can not be answered directly because you did not tell what computer it is.
Mac or PC ? What Operating system ?

20 years ago I had a Multiface 1 connected to a Titanium Powerbook G4 and it worked super.
Fireface 400 is working properly on old white iMac.
If your computer is a Acer Notebook from 2002 with Windows Vista and Norton antivirus running all the time, this could be a problem child for music production.

The Fireface UC is a perfect device for professionals and beginners. Learning by doing.
Greetings

M1-Sequoia, Madiface Pro, Digiface USB, Babyface silver and blue
  • tbger
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Re: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

RME Support wrote:

Are you referring to 32k SPDIF, e.g. DAT Longplay? That will work just fine.
I'm not aware of actual ADAT converters that will do 32k...

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME


Lots of thanks to anyone answered !

Daniel - yes, I asked it for transferring long play DAT taped, exactly.  Thanks for your comment and for letting me know about the ADAT incapability.  I guess I'll have to use the coaxial SPDIF port.  (If the ADAT actually should be 32kHz capable - I'd like to know about that though !)

waedi - my computer is relatively old - it's a Dell Vostro 3300 with Intel Core i3 CPU, M370 2.4 GHz, with 4GB of RAM.

6 Reply by MC

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Re: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

You misunderstood Daniel's answer. Our optical I/Os can use ADAT and SPDIF format. Here SPDIF optical is supported at 32 kHz. ADAT at 32 kHz is not known to Daniel, that's all he said. Your DAT is NOT doing ADAT when using optical. So no need to change to the coaxial input.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

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  • tbger
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Re: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

Thank you Mr. Carstens, you put it just as simply and accurately as possible.


Another question please:

Would someone please tell me if the ExpressCard (34 mm) slot on my Dell Vostro 3300 should be capable of handling the FireWire connection of RME's products ?  Or should I be looking at USB devices only ?


Thanks,
Roy

8 Reply by MC

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Re: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

You have an RME ExpressCard? Then yes. Otherwise note this is NOT FireWire, only the same connector.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

MC's Website

9 Reply by tbger (edited by tbger 2021-01-31 11:00:25)

  • tbger
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Re: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

I'm sorry, I don't understand what you mean by an RME ExpressCard.  I was talking about the slot on my laptop, which is similar to that on this picture:

https://www.notebookcheck.net/fileadmin/_processed_/csm_vostro_ans1_02_c92104d21f.jpg

(edit:  the little slot on the right, above the DVD drive, is the ExpressCard 34mm slot)


I'm sorry for being somewhat ignorant in these areas.


Roy

  • mkok
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Re: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

A bit confused as the side of your laptop shows what looks to be a power socket, usb socket and Ethernet socket.

Babyface Pro Fs, Behringer ADA8200, win 10/11 PCs, Cubase/Wavelab, Adam A7X monitors.
  • cyrano
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Re: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

That looks suspiciously like an SD card port. For storage cards from camera's and such.

On rare occasions, the SD card ports can be exchanged for an ExpressCard slot. Maybe in yours?

https://www.ebay.com/c/2248463907

PCMCIA and it's successor ExpressCard are largely gone from laptops these days. I wonder if it's killed by it's many names and configurations. These lead to up to 65% returns on PCMCIA cards sold online.

The RME ExpressCard is a card that fits in an ExpressCard slot. That card is needed for older RME devices. It features a port with a connector that looks like it's Firewire, but it's not. It's proprietary and only works with these older RME devices.

All in all, USB is much, much simpler. And sufficient for anything up to 32 channels of I/O on most well behaved computers. Even old ones. I too, have a G4 laying around that's 20+ years old and still happily records many channels, if needed. And a Core Duo Dell @1GHz with 1 GB ram and native firewire that does the same with Linux.

MB Pro - 2 X FireFace 400, FF800 & DigiFace USB
ADAT gear: Korg, Behri, Fostex, Alesis...

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12 Reply by tbger (edited by tbger 2021-01-31 11:30:31)

  • tbger
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Re: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

cyrano, thank you very much for your clarification.  As to the picture - well, it's actually an ExpressCard slot, as far as I can tell.  There's a long dummy card that pops out when I push the red cover shown on the outside.

Anyway, I was initially considering the FireWire option thinking it would lower the cost for me, but I've realized that the price of the required adapter should be very high, and I'd rather choose a USB unit, as you advise.  It would save me the risk involved, and maybe also end up to be a cheaper option.


Highly appreciated,
Roy

13 Reply by MC

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Re: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

Quite confusing here. You talked about a UC - which doesn't have FireWire. Nor needs the special ExpressCard that old units like Multiface and Digiface need. If you plug in a real FireWire ExpressCard card you would need to use an interface with FireWire, like the Fireface 400, 802, UCX or UFX.

But no one would go that route in 2021 anymore, FireWire is dead. BTW, your laptop from 2010 has chances to be problematic with USB, but should work good with an ExpressCard that has USB ports - or FireWire.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

MC's Website

14 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2021-01-31 16:34:49)

  • ramses
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Re: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

cyrano wrote:

That looks suspiciously like an SD card port.

34mm Expresscard Slot, see: https://www.notebookcheck.com/Dell-Vost … 753.0.html

MC wrote:

But no one would go that route in 2021 anymore, FireWire is dead. BTW, your laptop from 2010 has chances to be problematic with USB, but should work good with an ExpressCard that has USB ports - or FireWire.

Would also propose to upgrade the 10+y old laptop and to consider purchasing a Fireface UC.

If you want to be more on the safe side, then buy a turnkey system for audio. If laptop is not required then better a more powerful desktop system where you can also disable energy saving in the BIOS (C-States and alike settings). With Laptops this is usually not possible as energy saving is required so that the device does not become too hot.

This company offers laptops and desktops, nearly at the same price, but the desktop system will be more powerful and give you possibilities to expand (therefore I wouldn't choose the smallest case):
- laptops https://www.da-x.de/de/audio-notebook-d … rator.html starting at €1289.
- desktops https://www.da-x.de/de/audio-workstation-mini.html starting at €1149.

Simply for comparison:

The performance of your old CPU is very low:
https://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cp … amp;id=744
Passmark: 1119, Single thread performance: 977

A Ryzen 7 based Notebook (with Ryzen 7 CPU from 2019 with 4 Cores/ 8 threads) for €559 would give you already more cores and performance:
https://geizhals.de/asus-d509da-bq693-s … ml?hloc=de
https://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cp … mp;id=3426
Passmark: 7343, Single thread performance: 2029

My 5 year old Intel Xeon CPU:
https://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cp … mp;id=2838
Passmark: 11144, Single thread performance: 2347

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14

15 Reply by tbger (edited by tbger 2021-02-01 21:03:44)

  • tbger
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Re: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

Thank you very much everyone !

Mr. Cartsens, you're right.  I was simply considering a USB interface, and was just checking whether a FireWire one could also be an option (because it's cheaper).  The FireWire ExpressCard adapter solution wouldn't be good to me ultimately, because when I upgrade my laptop, the whole setup won't be relevant anymore (adapter + FireFace 400).  A FireFace UC really is the best option.

Ramses, thank you for stopping by and giving me your informative advice.  This great solution would go into my wish list for now.


Roy

16 Reply by tbger (edited by tbger 2021-02-04 12:22:57)

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Re: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

Hi,



Another question, if I may:  Being new to the pro audio world, I'm completely ignorant about what 'Clocking' or 'Clock' means.  Would someone please explain it to me in simple words ?

I have another DAC (Violectric V800) which I'm planning to optically connect to the FireFace UC, and also an external recording device as a backup unit (a Marantz PMD570 which records up to 16Bit/48kHz) which I'd like to connect via the coaxial output - and I'm wondering how I'm going to deal with the various sample rates (when recording 24/192 for example, or when transferring a long play DAT tape at 32kHz), and possibly also with the clocking factor.


Any help would be much appreciated.


Regards,
Roy

  • tbger
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Re: New amateur user; asking info before purchase

Hi,


Just here to report that thankfully, I've successfully managed to connect and install my new Fireface UC on my old laptop, and to also create most of the setup I wanted.


Roy