• Registered: 2021-03-06
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Topic: Babyface Pro SPDIF IN connection issue

Hello.

I'm trying to use Sound Devices 702 recorder for increasing Babyface Pro XLR's inputs with phantom power. Also, it has analog limiters, which I like to use in recording sessions.

The idea is connecting SD 702 to BF Pro by SPDIF. The digital output from SD 702 is Coaxial S/PDIF. There is a quote from manual:

The Digital Output Bus appears solely on the AES3id BNC output connector. The unbalanced
AES3id output is directly compatible with most S/PDIF inputs.
The format for the AES3id output is selectable between professional AES and SPDIF. In either case
the SCMS bit is not set.

The Babybace Pro digital input is Optical Toslink (SPDIF/ADAT).

Optical I/O (TOSLINK): The unit automatically detects SPDIF or ADAT input signals. The optical output can operate as ADAT or SPDIF output, depending on the current setting in the Settings dialog.

For connection between them I'm using LINDY TosLink (Optical) and Coaxial Bi-directional Converter

https://www.lindy-international.com/Tos … p;pi=70411

And it works when I send digital audio from BF Pro to SD 702!

But when I'm changing cables from IN's to OUT's on all devices and trying to send audio from SD 702 to BF Pro - nothing happens. Just random pops and clicks.

Optical Input Status is "No Lock". Clock source  is Internal. When I'm switching it to "Optical IN" it starts to corrupting audio with a loud random clicks (like short sample impulses).

At SD 702 side there are just only three settings for digital output and I tried all it's combinations without getting any audio at the BF Pro side.


Please, help me.
Thank you!


Win 10, 1.210 driver version, Hardware revision is 101.

2 Reply by waedi (edited by waedi 2021-03-06 16:48:49)

  • waedi
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Re: Babyface Pro SPDIF IN connection issue

Have you done the routing in the 702 ?

6) AES3id Output
Unbalanced digital output, two-channel, for Output Bus 2. Signal source is menu- selected.

You have to choose the channels that shall go out thru the digital output.
you also should try to go into the Babyface USB settings and change the clock mode from internal to external.
At the 702 did you try both adat and spdif ?
Did you try both settings also in the Babyface settings, adat and spdif ?
Maybe also a short disconnect (reboot) of the BF can help ?
edit :
It seems to be the case that the 702 operates as slave only and it needs to be connected with two cables.
Probably no digital audio output will be generated without clock signal from outside ?
The 702s user manual has no word of slave / master it always sync to incoming clocks.
But it also says that it will use the choosed samplerate from the settings when digital input is lost.
It does not tell anything about providing digital audio output without external clock.

The best thing to do is connecting both way, in and out adat and let the Babyface clock mode be internal.

Therefor you need a second Lindy converter and the cables and adapter BNC to RCA etc.
Very annoying connection setup, but why not ? The 702 is an old outdated device but if you can use it this way would be great.
Don't throw it away when you can use it.

M1-Sequoia, Madiface Pro, Digiface USB, Babyface silver and blue

3 Reply by MC

  • MC
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Re: Babyface Pro SPDIF IN connection issue

As the Lindy covers both ways, why did you connect only one way? That would quickly show if the SD indeed needs an external clock or not.

But it might also be that the Lindy can't use the SD output signal in some way.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

MC's Website

  • Registered: 2021-03-06
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Re: Babyface Pro SPDIF IN connection issue

waedi wrote:

Have you done the routing in the 702 ?

6) AES3id Output
Unbalanced digital output, two-channel, for Output Bus 2. Signal source is menu- selected.

You have to choose the channels that shall go out thru the digital output.
you also should try to go into the Babyface USB settings and change the clock mode from internal to external.
At the 702 did you try both adat and spdif ?
Did you try both settings also in the Babyface settings, adat and spdif ?
Maybe also a short disconnect (reboot) of the BF can help ?
edit :
It seems to be the case that the 702 operates as slave only and it needs to be connected with two cables.
Probably no digital audio output will be generated without clock signal from outside ?
The 702s user manual has no word of slave / master it always sync to incoming clocks.
But it also says that it will use the choosed samplerate from the settings when digital input is lost.
It does not tell anything about providing digital audio output without external clock.

The best thing to do is connecting both way, in and out adat and let the Babyface clock mode be internal.

Therefor you need a second Lindy converter and the cables and adapter BNC to RCA etc.
Very annoying connection setup, but why not ? The 702 is an old outdated device but if you can use it this way would be great.
Don't throw it away when you can use it.

Hi, thanks for replying!

AES3id Output
Unbalanced digital output, two-channel, for Output Bus 2. Signal source is menu- selected.
You have to choose the channels that shall go out thru the digital output.
At the 702 did you try both adat and spdif ?

There are three settings the SD 702 digital output side:

Output2 Left: I set it to A - it is a left channel from input
Output2 Right: I set it to B - it is a right channel from input

Digital Output: Mode - Consumer and Professional. Don't know which is right, but I've tryed both.

Did you try both settings also in the Babyface settings, adat and spdif ?

I see this option for Optical Out on BF Pro, but can't find this option for Digital IN.

Maybe also a short disconnect (reboot) of the BF can help ?

Sadly not.

It seems to be the case that the 702 operates as slave only and it needs to be connected with two cables.
Probably no digital audio output will be generated without clock signal from outside ?

Even don't think about it. Will ask Sound Devices, they must know the answer.

The 702s user manual has no word of slave / master it always sync to incoming clocks.
But it also says that it will use the choosed samplerate from the settings when digital input is lost.
It does not tell anything about providing digital audio output without external clock.

Yes, I set 96k on both BF and 702.

Therefor you need a second Lindy converter and the cables and adapter BNC to RCA etc.
Very annoying connection setup, but why not ? The 702 is an old outdated device but if you can use it this way would be great.
Don't throw it away when you can use it.

SD 702 has great preamps with analog limiter, which I really love and want to use. I use it for field recording, but want it in the studio work too. Thank you, I will check it!

  • Registered: 2021-03-06
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Re: Babyface Pro SPDIF IN connection issue

MC wrote:

As the Lindy covers both ways, why did you connect only one way? That would quickly show if the SD indeed needs an external clock or not.

But it might also be that the Lindy can't use the SD output signal in some way.

I haven't additional cables to check it, but as I understand Lindy hasn't two independent converters. It converts 1 Input to 2 Outputs with switchable option between Optical and Coaxial connections. So, for connection all IN's and OUT's on both devices I need two Lindy's.

6 Reply by MC

  • MC
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Re: Babyface Pro SPDIF IN connection issue

wavecraft wrote:

https://www.lindy-international.com/Tos … p;pi=70411

That is a remarkable achievement of Lindy marketing. To call a one-or-the-other way solution 'bi-directional'. What a bunch of...

I thought your converter covers both ways. Those exist, not much bigger and not much more expensive.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

MC's Website

  • Registered: 2021-03-06
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Re: Babyface Pro SPDIF IN connection issue

MC wrote:
wavecraft wrote:

https://www.lindy-international.com/Tos … p;pi=70411

That is a remarkable achievement of Lindy marketing. To call a one-or-the-other way solution 'bi-directional'. What a bunch of...

I thought your converter covers both ways. Those exist, not much bigger and not much more expensive.

Yeah:( Do you remember a trademark of alternative converters?

  • waedi
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Re: Babyface Pro SPDIF IN connection issue

I did type "adat to spdif converter" into the search field in the Thomann catalog, guess what comes on top of the list : ADI2 DAC FS, best choice !

That Lindy piece is outstanding the only one doing this.
They had not the idea to make it a double whopper.
And Uli didn't heard of that Marktlücke so far.
In our local dialect, having a Lindy means somehow, having a retarded child.
Half baked, nicht ganz lind.

I would buy a second one, it does the trick.

M1-Sequoia, Madiface Pro, Digiface USB, Babyface silver and blue

9 Reply by wavecraft (edited by wavecraft 2021-03-07 23:27:14)

  • Registered: 2021-03-06
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Re: Babyface Pro SPDIF IN connection issue

waedi wrote:

I did type "adat to spdif converter" into the search field in the Thomann catalog, guess what comes on top of the list : ADI2 DAC FS, best choice !

That Lindy piece is outstanding the only one doing this.
They had not the idea to make it a double whopper.
And Uli didn't heard of that Marktlücke so far.
In our local dialect, having a Lindy means somehow, having a retarded child.
Half baked, nicht ganz lind.

I would buy a second one, it does the trick.

Haha:)

Looks like there isn't a pricy alternative. ADI2 DAC FS costs $966. I found a 15$ China digital converter analog, but afraid to buy and using it with my gear. And now I'm afraid of using Lindy too.

May be I should by a second Lindy. But now I'm thinking about difference between Lindy and China analog. Sadly haven't chance to compare. BWT, that's a genius marketing from Lindy, if I will pay twice:)

Still waiting a letter from Sound Devices about slave/master question.

Dankeshon!

10 Reply by MC

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Re: Babyface Pro SPDIF IN connection issue

I googled too and didn't find it anymore. So one indeed needs to buy two units for both ways. Seeing how cheap that stuff is (around 10 Euros) no big deal, apart from that you have to handle two power supplies then. Note that all these cheap versions end at 96 kHz. For optical 192 kHz support you need to look for much better ones.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

MC's Website

  • Registered: 2021-03-06
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Re: Babyface Pro SPDIF IN connection issue

I see a strange behavior of the Input status at the audio card settings. The DS 702 is set to 96k, but the card at the INPUT settings is showing 32k, 64k and No Lock.

Recorded video with demonstration of what's going on: https://youtu.be/YXFe3mO5p78

12 Reply by MC

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Re: Babyface Pro SPDIF IN connection issue

No change from your post 1. A crappy input signal can not be detected correctly...it seems the Lindy's coax input can not understand the SD's outpu signal, OR that signal is not as compatible to SPDIF as they say.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

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  • Registered: 2021-03-06
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Re: Babyface Pro SPDIF IN connection issue

MC wrote:

No change from your post 1. A crappy input signal can not be detected correctly...it seems the Lindy's coax input can not understand the SD's outpu signal, OR that signal is not as compatible to SPDIF as they say.

I think the Lindy is broken. From the factory or in the process of delivering. I found a small part of it in the box (door of coaxial female connector, you know, don't know the right word for it). I will search for other alternatives, thanks!