Topic: MADIFACE USB with Steinberg WaveLab Element 10

There is most probably something that I do not understand. I have a MADIFace USB connected to a Win 10 computer that has Steinberg WaveLab. I have defined MADI 1+2 as WDM and also as channels to record in WaveLab. Also, in WaveLab, I have defined MADI 3+4 and Playback device. Now when I try to record something, I do not get any sound.

There is something fundamentally wrong I am doing here and posting this to gain some knowledge.

Re: MADIFACE USB with Steinberg WaveLab Element 10

Do you see the incoming signals in Totalmix input channels ?

M1-Monterey, Madiface Pro, Digiface USB, Babyface silver

3 (edited by ramses 2021-05-28 09:00:45)

Re: MADIFACE USB with Steinberg WaveLab Element 10

hifimckinney wrote:

There is most probably something that I do not understand. I have a MADIFace USB connected to a Win 10 computer that has Steinberg WaveLab. I have defined MADI 1+2 as WDM and also as channels to record in WaveLab. Also, in WaveLab, I have defined MADI 3+4 and Playback device. Now when I try to record something, I do not get any sound.

There is something fundamentally wrong I am doing here and posting this to gain some knowledge.

I also have WaveLab 10 Pro. As you are mentioning WDM drivers please note, that Wavelab can only load ASIO drivers, not Windows or WDM drivers.

To put an example which works for me well as a basis:
If I want to record something from Youtube, then Windows sends audio to its default sound device Analog 1/2 OUT.
In TM FX you see audio in the middle row: SW Playback Channel AN 1/2 which I route to HW Output AES
(because my active monitors are connected to an ADI-2 Pro, which is connected to the AES port).

Now the important part:
As Wavelab can not record audio from HW Output AES, I have to activate loopback on this output.
Audio can now be recorded on the corresponding input: HW Input AES.
Note: in TM FX you do not see audio from loopback on the HW input AES.
This is intentionally by design, to make it still possible to see audio arriving on the real HW input AES.
And here you have even two possibilities:
a) you can now record on HW Input AES the looped back audio signal from HW output AES and
b) you can still route any audio arriving on the physical port HW Input AES to any other output
    (and if you would like to record it you can use again loopback)

Ok, so to record this in Wavelab: I have loaded the ASIO driver and my input signal is HW Input AES
(which gets audio by loopback from HW output AES). Works nicely.

My question to you is, where does audio come from in your case ?

a) from a HW input from MADI (ADI-642, ..)  ?
    Then you should be able to see the audio signal in TM FX of this HW input
    and record from it with Wavelab with the proper ASIO driver loaded.
b) from OS/application with or without ASIO support ?
    Then you need to use loopback similar to me an a MADI HW Output channel
    and record the loopbacked audio signal from the corresponding MADI HW input channel.

EDIT: I found this information later: you can load RME WDM drivers
But you need to do this through Steinberg's "Generic low latency Driver"
https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/de/a … in-WaveLab

BR Ramses
UFX+, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1650v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub12Pro

Re: MADIFACE USB with Steinberg WaveLab Element 10

waedi wrote:

Do you see the incoming signals in Totalmix input channels ?

Thanks, with this question, I started with TotalMix and now I have what I wanted.

Re: MADIFACE USB with Steinberg WaveLab Element 10

ramses wrote:
hifimckinney wrote:

There is most probably something that I do not understand. I have a MADIFace USB connected to a Win 10 computer that has Steinberg WaveLab. I have defined MADI 1+2 as WDM and also as channels to record in WaveLab. Also, in WaveLab, I have defined MADI 3+4 and Playback device. Now when I try to record something, I do not get any sound.

There is something fundamentally wrong I am doing here and posting this to gain some knowledge.

I also have WaveLab 10 Pro. As you are mentioning WDM drivers please note, that Wavelab can only load ASIO drivers, not Windows or WDM drivers.

To put an example which works for me well as a basis:
If I want to record something from Youtube, then Windows sends audio to its default sound device Analog 1/2 OUT.
In TM FX you see audio in the middle row: SW Playback Channel AN 1/2 which I route to HW Output AES
(because my active monitors are connected to an ADI-2 Pro, which is connected to the AES port).

Now the important part:
As Wavelab can not record audio from HW Output AES, I have to activate loopback on this output.
Audio can now be recorded on the corresponding input: HW Input AES.
Note: in TM FX you do not see audio from loopback on the HW input AES.
This is intentionally by design, to make it still possible to see audio arriving on the real HW input AES.
And here you have even two possibilities:
a) you can now record on HW Input AES the looped back audio signal from HW output AES and
b) you can still route any audio arriving on the physical port HW Input AES to any other output
    (and if you would like to record it you can use again loopback)

Ok, so to record this in Wavelab: I have loaded the ASIO driver and my input signal is HW Input AES
(which gets audio by loopback from HW output AES). Works nicely.

My question to you is, where does audio come from in your case ?

a) from a HW input from MADI (ADI-642, ..)  ?
    Then you should be able to see the audio signal in TM FX of this HW input
    and record from it with Wavelab with the proper ASIO driver loaded.
b) from OS/application with or without ASIO support ?
    Then you need to use loopback similar to me an a MADI HW Output channel
    and record the loopbacked audio signal from the corresponding MADI HW input channel.

EDIT: I found this information later: you can load RME WDM drivers
But you need to do this through Steinberg's "Generic low latency Driver"
https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/de/a … in-WaveLab

Thanks for your detailed response, Ramses, as always. Thanks for the pointer to low latency ASIO from WaveLab. I now have implemented what I wanted to to.

Just to share, did you notice that signal through WaveLab sounds better that sending signal directly to a channel? On my system it does so, in my setup what I have done is that 1+2 has been setup and WDM that receives the audio first from Windows and then in WaveLab I have set 1+2 as Recording and Playback as 3+4. And then on ADI642, 3+4 goes to AES1 that ultimately goes to my DA converter.

Thanks again.

6 (edited by ramses 2021-05-28 15:51:41)

Re: MADIFACE USB with Steinberg WaveLab Element 10

You're welcome, glad that it worked.
For the rest / your question .. I need to look later.

BR Ramses
UFX+, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1650v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub12Pro

Re: MADIFACE USB with Steinberg WaveLab Element 10

I'm sorry, but I don't really follow the two signal flows based on your description, especially the point that something would sound better if it went through the WDM driver. Either something has already been boosted in the Windows sound system or in Wavelab, a higher volume level alone sounds better to our ears.

BR Ramses
UFX+, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1650v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub12Pro

8 (edited by hifimckinney 2021-05-28 17:15:52)

Re: MADIFACE USB with Steinberg WaveLab Element 10

ramses wrote:

I'm sorry, but I don't really follow the two signal flows based on your description, especially the point that something would sound better if it went through the WDM driver. Either something has already been boosted in the Windows sound system or in Wavelab, a higher volume level alone sounds better to our ears.

I do not think it is about volume, through WaveLab it sounds cleaner. So, in my setup, I get audio only when I bring up Record window on WaveLab and then checkbox the Monitor (see below). I get sound only when I check this box.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/128jnEB … sp=sharing

I have in WaveLab audio preference set Recording as 1+2 and Playback as 3+4. So, when I check this box, 1+2 are routed through WaveLab to 3+4. This MADI 3+4 goes out through AES1 to my DA Converter. I have also routed MADI 1+2 to AES2 and so when I compare AES 1 and AES 2, I hear difference.