• From: New Jersey USA
  • Registered: 2021-06-15
  • Posts: 8

Topic: Routing external devices with TM

This is a general question. 
I have been reliant of my DAW, which happens to be Studio One version 5.   Within the DAW, there is a plug-in that allows me to route output external effects that can be reused in any projects.   Once I set up the routing within the DAW I can recall the plug-in instance in other projects.   In essence, it allows me to recall my external effects units by name.  This very clever Plug-in is called Pipeline XT.
PIPELINE XT no longer allow me to monitor the send and returns of the new presets even though I configured routing to applicable IO of my newly installed RME interface.
After reading the RME manual, I am coming to the conclusion that I can abandon the Studio One plug-in and do my mixing exclusively with TM.  I believe that I will need to bounce all of my midi channels to audio before I can create a proper submix I’m TM. I believe that while TM might respond to Midi remote commands it does not process midi input.
From my reading,  I believe that I need to set my effect to 100 per cent wet and create a loopback in a submix and use that loopback channel in my Daw for recording.
Is my approach sensible?

2 Reply by waedi (edited by waedi 2021-06-22 01:35:23)

  • waedi
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  • From: Swiss Zürich
  • Registered: 2020-12-08
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Re: Routing external devices with TM

Yes you are right. Midi tracks has to be converted or bounced into audio for routing it thru TM.
Yes, the effect unit should set to 100% wet for recording it. Afterwards you mix that into your song.
No, there must be something wrong in your understanding with that Plugin.
How can this Pipeline XT plugin no longer allow you to monitor the send and returns ?
When these sends and returns are routed thru TM then you can monitor them for sure, Pipeline XT has no control over that, you don't need permission from the plugin to monitor its connections in TM.
Mixing in TM instead of the DAW ? You are not the first with this idea.
I would stay inside the DAW.
It is all digital in the DAW and in TM, I can't see the benefit, it is probably a good training exercise DAW&TM workout.

M1-Sonoma, Madiface Pro, Digiface USB, Babyface silver and blue
  • From: New Jersey USA
  • Registered: 2021-06-15
  • Posts: 8

Re: Routing external devices with TM

I loaded the same project with my RME and another interface.   The pipeline xt plug-in does not function with an RME.  I am hopeful that a user of Studio One will respond to this post.
Thank you for your reply.   I see that Total FX may be more advanced than any DAW I have encountered.

4 Reply by dleagjeld (edited by dleagjeld 2021-07-03 05:41:54)

  • Registered: 2021-07-03
  • Posts: 2

Re: Routing external devices with TM

I'm struggling with this also maybe we can work together to figure this out. Let's take a stereo effect like a delay on a guitar track. Open the mixer section  and drag an instance of stereo pipeline into the send box. In the i/o set up make a set of sends called sub 1 say output 3 and 4 out of the fireface going to the input of the effects unit, out of the effects unit  go into inputs 3 and 4 of the fireface and set up i/o 3 and 4 in S1. In total mix in the hardware output section  make 3 and 4 stereo and engage loopback. When you dragged pipeline it made an effects buss click sub 1 as the input in the guitar track  make the input 3/4 in the effects buss.. In pipeline  the send  is sub 1 and return  3/4 .  That's should work. I'm struggling to get this to work using adat as my  inputs with an eventide.

5 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2021-07-04 04:40:39)

  • ramses
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Re: Routing external devices with TM

In Cubase this is being supported by the DAW. You only need to define an external HW device and assign the input and output channels. After definition it allows you to set the input/output levels and to calculate the RTL.

Greg Ondo described the procedure here on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-N-9AGlrXk

Alternatively - if your DAW doesn't support that - you can achieve this also by TotalMix FX routing.
I prepared a drawing for you with
- an overview about the signal flow and
- how the routing needs to be configured.
Please note: TotalMix FX full mode (default) and Submix mode assumed here.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/rjx7340ojgt5jbc/TM%20FX%20Routing%20External%20HW-v002.jpg?dl=1

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13
  • Registered: 2019-11-03
  • Posts: 18

Re: Routing external devices with TM

Pipeline works perfectly fine with totalmix… there’s something going on with your setup

Try instantiating Pipeline on an audio track (wave file, not a midi file) and see if this fixes your issue.

I’ve used pipeline on instrument tracks many times, so, I suspect there’s something amiss in your setup.  Try switching TM over to “daw mode” just to see if that resolves it

7 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2021-12-01 12:19:15)

  • ramses
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Re: Routing external devices with TM

Studiocity wrote:

Pipeline works perfectly fine with totalmix… there’s something going on with your setup
Try instantiating Pipeline on an audio track (wave file, not a midi file) and see if this fixes your issue.
I’ve used pipeline on instrument tracks many times, so, I suspect there’s something amiss in your setup

Please provide a link to this software, the term "pipeline" produces too many different hits in google search.

Studiocity wrote:

Try switching TM over to “daw mode” just to see if that resolves it

Maybe RME can jump in here.

My understanding of TM FX is, that there is not lag or additional delay introduced to the signal path by TM FX "full mode".

So I question myself why you recommend using "DAW mode" here ?! Was that simply a guess or does your proposal serve here an actual purpose ?

AFAIK DAW mode has not being introduced to "fix" anything (latency wise or whatever), it's simply another operation mode for people who want to route audio in the DAW. But this has the disadvantage to always have the full RTL (round trip latency through USB/FW/TB...) in the signal path.

It's IMHO more useful and flexible to provide a routing in TM FX "full mode" that is exactly the same like in DAW mode.
You can achieve this routing very comfortably by one mouse click:
      TM FX: Options -> Reset Mix -> Straight Playback

This routes every SW playback channel to it's corresponding HW output, it's the same signal flow / "routing" as in DAW mode.

The big advantage here: you have exactly the same routing of "DAW mode" in "full mode", but you keep the flexibility of TM FX "full mode" to create individual submixes per HW output. Then you can still route vocals or instruments directly to a HW output like e.g. phones output, so that you hear the recorded audio in (near) real-time without the (much bigger) RTL.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

8 Reply by CrispyChips (edited by CrispyChips 2021-12-01 13:12:08)

  • Registered: 2020-07-20
  • Posts: 125

Re: Routing external devices with TM

Quote: “Please provide a link"  - snipped for shortness - "the term "pipeline" produces too many different hits in google search.”


Ramses, I know nothing about the software discussed here whatever, but trust this link of a comprehensive "sound on sound" article, will provide helpful information, if you remain interested.

https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques … studio-one


Though in your present situation I understand if the pipeline below, is more appropriate.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jZPW7ogreY

  • ramses
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Re: Routing external devices with TM

Thanks for the link, good article.

I personally am happy with the implementation in Cubase which seems to perform something like a "network ping" to measure the actual latency, I think this is by far the most accurate method. Especially if your AD/DA converters are connected behind ADAT or MADI. The driver can not know the AD and DA of the devices which are connected behind ADAT oder to a MADI bus.

But for me this is only a viable option anyway as currently I do not use external HW.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13