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RME User Forum → ADI-2 & 2/4 Pro series, ADI-2 DAC series → Finalizing my setup with active Genelec - A few more doubts...
Hello,
I have 2 digital sources :
Source 1 : Mac mini with Roon > USB to RME ADI 2
Source 2 : TV > Toslink to RME ADI 2
I have 2 outputs :
1/ RME ADI 2 > Digital output for my Genelec 8351 that will do the D/A conversion and the amplification.
2/ RME 2 ADI 2 > Analog output for headphones.
Which mode would work best for me : Auto ? Digital to Monitor ? Or DAC ?
Which mode would work best for me : Auto ? Digital to Monitor ? Or DAC ?
I prefer DAC Mode.
It’s the simplest in usage, e.g. source selection is combined for both outputs.
And for the parameter "Dig out Source", should I use "Main out" ?
I have the UFX II and habe Genelec 8330. I tried analgo and digital. Result is that digital ou of RME UFX is better since the AD converter or analog electronic of Genelec is not as good. May be this is different in the Genelc 8351.
So I use AES/EBU out of UFX II.
Peter
And for the parameter "Dig out Source", should I use "Main out" ?
Yes, this way all ADI-2 Pro functionality (DSP, Volume control) is available.
See the block diagram manual page 43.
There you can even see how much simpler DAC Mode is, compared to other Modes.
I will take a deep look at the diagrams.
The routing diagrams look like a maze.
Someone made a simpler version --- https://www.hifizine.com/2019/01/rme-ad … nal-modes/
I found it's easier to understand and refer to the link whenever I need to change modes. Go and check it out.May be useful to you.
The routing diagrams look like a maze.
Someone made a simpler version --- https://www.hifizine.com/2019/01/rme-ad … nal-modes/
I found it's easier to understand and refer to the link whenever I need to change modes. Go and check it out.May be useful to you.
Very nice article as of 2018, but sadly not fully up-to-date in terms of latest firmware changes.
I don't want to be picky, but I am missing an intro with the description of "auto mode", because the device is being shipped in this mode per default.
I think it is important to know, that the unit will then automatically turn into different operating modes (Preamp, AD/DA, USB) depending on the connected cables.
Also important to know that some of the modes can only be set manually or that manually settings are required if you have USB plugged simply to support firmware updates, but if you need to run in another mode than USB, e.g. AD/DA if the device is connected to a recording interface.
Hello,
Thank you for all this information.
I went thought all the modes and according to https://www.hifizine.com/2019/01/rme-ad … nal-modes/ :
USB mode = KO -> No digital output with optical input
AD/DA mode = KO -> No digital output with USB input
Preamp mode = KO -> No digital output with USB or optical input
Digital Thru mode = KO -> No digital output with USB input
DAC mode = OK
I agree : this routing diagram is, to me, far more understandable.
I believe I'm quite close from a final setting :-)
Still a few more questions.
Let's recap :
2 digital sources :
Source 1 : Mac mini with Roon > USB to RME ADI 2
Source 2 : TV > Toslink to RME ADI 2
2 outputs :
1/ RME ADI 2 > Digital output for my Genelec 8351 that will do the D/A conversion and the amplification.
2/ RME 2 ADI 2 > Analog output for headphones.
My mode
Setup > Device Mode > DAC
My questions :
I have set :
Setup > SPDIF > SRC > SPDIF In
Setup > SPDIF > SRC Gain Dig > 0dB
I understand that doing so, I will have the RME reclocking the signal from the SPDIF input before sending it to the digital outputs.
Am I right ? Is it the right setup ?
If so, at what is the new sample rate (if there any) ?
(FYI : The Genelec reclocks at 96)
What about the USB input ? Is it reclocked ?
And what about the SRC Gain Dig ?
I understand that doing so, I will have the RME reclocking the signal from the SPDIF input before sending it to the digital outputs.
Am I right ? Is it the right setup ?
If so, at what is the new sample rate (if there any) ?
(FYI : The Genelec reclocks at 96)
What about the USB input ? Is it reclocked ?
And what about the SRC Gain Dig ?
USB is not reclocked, the SRC is hardwired to the AES/SPDIF inputs section.
In DAC mode the sample rate follows the selected input, even with SRC on.
Manual clock selection is greyed out.
Digital output’s SR equals ADI-2 Pro’s internal sample rate.
So IMO activating SRC in DAC Mode doesn’t seem to make any sense.
Thank you.
My last concern is about the volume with digital output.
When my setup is
Setup > Options > Device Mode > DAC
I/O > Main Out ½ > AD/DA Source > Auto
I/O > Main Out ½ > Ref. level > +4 dBu
I/O > Main Out ½ > Auto Ref. level > Off
Setup > SPDIF > SPDIC In > Auto (greyed out)
Setup > SPDIF > SRC > OFF
Setup > SPDIF > SRC Gain Dig > O dB
Between my USB input (from my MAC Mini) and my optical input (from my TV set), I have about a 20 dB difference in terms of volume. The USB Input delivers the highest volume.
How can it be ?
The output is the digital AES.
The output is the digital AES.
I/O > Main Out ½ > Ref. level > +4 dBu
The Reference Levels are for the analog outputs only, AES is not affected by this setting.
Between my USB input (from my MAC Mini) and my optical input (from my TV set), I have about a 20 dB difference in terms of volume. The USB Input delivers the highest volume.
How can it be ?
TV program is following the EBU R128 loudness recommendation, which is up to 20 dB lower than typical hot mastered music productions.
Maybe using ADI-2‘s Setups to switch inputs in combination with predefined Volume settings might help.
Store and recall a “Setup” for each input configuration you want to use.
A Setup stores the whole configuration of the device.
There is an option to recall Volume with Setup.
The Setups can be assigned to a button on the remote or front panel for easy access.
Note, the button assignment is stored within the individual Setup, not globally.
This can be used to toggle through numerous Setups with the same single button, like e.g.:
Button X press recalls:
- Setup2 when in Setup1
- Setup3 when in Setup2
- Setup1 when in Setup3
Wow. I'm glad there is an active forum...
If I understand correctly, your proposition will allow me to switch between the 2 inputs without any major difference in terms of level of sound (SPL).
In others terms, for a given sound level (my regular listening sound level), I will get a volume of -20 dB for my optical input (TV set) and -40 dB when I switch to my USB input (Mac mini).
Isn't it degrading the SNR for the USB input ?
...your proposition will allow me to switch between the 2 inputs without any major difference in terms of level of sound (SPL).
In others terms, for a given sound level (my regular listening sound level), I will get a volume of -20 dB for my optical input (TV set) and -40 dB when I switch to my USB input (Mac mini).
Exactly.
...Isn't it degrading the SNR for the USB input ?
No, it would be exactly the same as if you’d set the level manually.
Keep “Auto Reference Level” active for the headphones output, to optimize it’s SNR.
FH1504 wrote:...your proposition will allow me to switch between the 2 inputs without any major difference in terms of level of sound (SPL).
In others terms, for a given sound level (my regular listening sound level), I will get a volume of -20 dB for my optical input (TV set) and -40 dB when I switch to my USB input (Mac mini).
Exactly.
FH1504 wrote:...Isn't it degrading the SNR for the USB input ?
No, it would be exactly the same as if you’d set the level manually.
Keep “Auto Reference Level” active for the headphones output, to optimize it’s SNR.
What I meant is:
If my regular volume level for my USB input (Mac mini) is at -40 dB, then that means I have a headroom of 40 dB which too much and not optimized. Am I right ?
The noise floor doesn't change, so I thought that the SNR -40 dB output level / noise flloor is worse than the optical input (TV set) SNR (-20 db output / noise floor). Maybe I'm wrong ? Or maybe it is not even noticeable ?
KaiS wrote:FH1504 wrote:...your proposition will allow me to switch between the 2 inputs without any major difference in terms of level of sound (SPL).
In others terms, for a given sound level (my regular listening sound level), I will get a volume of -20 dB for my optical input (TV set) and -40 dB when I switch to my USB input (Mac mini).
Exactly.
FH1504 wrote:...Isn't it degrading the SNR for the USB input ?
No, it would be exactly the same as if you’d set the level manually.
Keep “Auto Reference Level” active for the headphones output, to optimize it’s SNR.
What I meant is:
If my regular volume level for my USB input (Mac mini) is at -40 dB, then that means I have a headroom of 40 dB which too much and not optimized. Am I right ?
The noise floor doesn't change, so I thought that the SNR -40 dB output level / noise flloor is worse than the optical input (TV set) SNR (-20 db output / noise floor). Maybe I'm wrong ? Or maybe it is not even noticeable ?
You will not hear noise, so you likely won’t have a noise problem.
The only reasonable point to change the level relationship, if your Genelecs have an option to reduce their ANALOG output gain POST THEIR OWN DAC’s.
If so, you can lower this gain by suggested 10 dB.
OK. Thanks.
To setup my volume, this is how I've done :
1/ Optical input : My TV set volume level at max.
2/ USB input : Roon software is set not to interfere with the signal in terms of volume
3/ Set my volume level for the optical input (the TV set one) at -20 dB (20 dB of headroom)
4/ Set my Genelec volume so that the sound reaches my listening level
5/ Don't touch the Genelec nor the TV set volume anymore and only use the RME volume.
Does it sound correct ?
All correct, if you need the 20 dB of headroom to dial up louder sometimes.
OK.
Well, I thought that 20 dB was a correct amount of headroom. Does it sound too much ?
OK.
Well, I thought that 20 dB was a correct amount of headroom. Does it sound too much ?
Headroom is the wrong term as you intend to use it as Gain Reserve / Volume Dial reserve for listening louder, or lifting up quiet passages of signal.
In this case 20 dB sounds reasonable.
As pure headroom for, in reality nonexisting, transients it’s way too much.
ADI-2 doesn’t produce noise in the Digital domain, so:
The main question is, do you hear noise from Genelec’s DA converter‘s or not.
If not, you don’t have a problem.
Thank you.
Well, I don't have much choice. That sounds like the only solution.
I don't think I will hear much noise from the Genelecs. But I will listen carefully.
For my education, what is then headroom ? The capacity to have spikes without distortion ?
Well, I don't have much choice. That sounds like the only solution.
I don't think I will hear much noise from the Genelecs. But I will listen carefully.
Noise is easy to identify.
With no music, from normal listening distance, you either hear it or not.
For my education, what is then headroom ? The capacity to have spikes without distortion ?
Exactly.
Only that in digital there are no spikes and the maximum level is clearly distinguishable.
Example:
If your volume is -20 dB, the highest possible peak is just 3 dB above at -17 dBFS, due to the effect of Inter Sample Peaks.
BTW: ISPs only exist in the analog domain or when resampling to higher sample rates.
Thank you.
I believe I’m done with the setup.
One more puzzling question.
I stored setup 1 with a specific volume level (-20 dB) for my optical input (TV set) and setup 2 with a specific volume level (-40 dB) for my USB input Mac mini).
I use a Logitech remote control in which I had set an RME command "switch to setup 1". When the RME ADI gets the command via the remote, it asks for confirmation.
So, I have set the command "switch to setup 1" twice in a row in the Logitech remote. And now, it works.
Is that a normal behavior for this command ?
Yes. Confirmation is intentional for such a mighty command that can change absolutely everything with just one button press.
Thank you.
I'm done for now with the setup.
RME User Forum → ADI-2 & 2/4 Pro series, ADI-2 DAC series → Finalizing my setup with active Genelec - A few more doubts...
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