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RME User Forum → ADI-2 & 2/4 Pro series, ADI-2 DAC series → ADI 2/4 Pro SE VS ADI 2 Pro FS R BE
I wonder what changed in comparison. In terms of spec sheet alone, input impedance increased, max power of headphone output increased, THD increased, and output channel increased. Are there any other changes?
And has the internal chipset of two quarters changed?
I'm also curious about those details.
You only need to read the product page … it's summarized there in the 1st chapter.
MM phono cart input without need for external phono pre was a big deal for me, 2/4 over the BE.
I wonder what changed in comparison. In terms of spec sheet alone, input impedance increased, max power of headphone output increased, THD increased, and output channel increased. Are there any other changes?
And has the internal chipset of two quarters changed?
Additional to the changes you mentioned:
• The Rear TRSs can be re-routed to be used as separate Line Outputs for channel 3/4.
• Added a dedicated Pentacon / 4 mm balanced headphones output.
• Balanced headphones out now only needs to use channel 3/4, does no longer occupy both channels 1/2 AND 3/4.
• Headphones outs now have a little more power.
• Analog Input now can be used as turntable / phono RIAA preamp input, that works well here with MM-Pickups.
To accomplish this, the input impedance was changed to the standard (47) 45 kOhm.
• DAC-chips changed from AKM to ESS.
According to my extensive, level matched blind A/B comparison, both sound the same IF SAME SHAPED DA-FILTERS ARE USED.
Albeit, most same-named DA-Filters have different shapes between AKM and ESS, ONLY IN CASE USING THESE both chips sound different.
The filters are well documented in each model’s manual.
“Sharp” sounds the same, the others are different.
The audible difference only occurs with sample rates of 44.1 and 48 kHz.
With SRs above the filters are out of the audible range.
• The new Power Supply (ATS040T-P120) now has a 3-prong-connector that includes safety ground.
The safety ground isn’t connected directly to ADI-2/4 Pro SE, but through a 1 kOhm resistor.
This configuration avoids ground-loop related hum to built up, while addressing a problem with stray-current related hum that could occur in some configurations.
The new ADI-2/4 Pro SE standard PSU can be used with ADI-2 Pro and ADI-2 DAC too.
• For those having too much money and worship the gods of misguided audiophila 
, RME will release a upgrade LPS / Linear Power Supply that can replace the standard SMPS / Switched Mode Power Supply.
Might be that the LPS indeed has an advantage when ADI-2 is used as measurement frontend.
At least, if RME does something, my RME-experience let’s me presume they do it right and at reasonable prices.
The LPS can be used with ADI-2 Pro and ADI-2 DAC too.
I have a question.
I'm currently using the ADI 2 PRO FS R BE model, so if I operate the headphones in valence mode, can't I use the speaker? In my case.
Also, I bought an ADI 2 PRO FS R BE today. But it was connected to UCX2.
It is also set to SPDIF OUT on UCX2.
I also set it to SPDIF OUT in ADI2.
Total mix, ADAT 1/2 of the information is accepted and exported, why?
I have a question.
I'm currently using the ADI 2 PRO FS R BE model, so if I operate the headphones in valence mode, can't I use the speaker? In my case.
On ADI-2 Pro, Balanced Headphones Mode uses both channels, 1/2 AND 3/4.
Therefore it can not run speakers from Line Out 1/2 at the same time.
REMARK: On ADI2/4 Pro SE, Balanced Headphones AND speakers can be used at the same time.
Also, I bought an ADI 2 PRO FS R BE today. But it was connected to UCX2.
It is also set to SPDIF OUT on UCX2.
I also set it to SPDIF OUT in ADI2.
Total mix, ADAT 1/2 of the information is accepted and exported, why?
ADI-2 can use ADAT format.
You can listen to ADAT 1/2 only.
Read manual page 54 for more information please.
...”With ADAT only channels 1/2 are monitored, but all 8 channels are passed through.”...
ruern wrote:I have a question.
I'm currently using the ADI 2 PRO FS R BE model, so if I operate the headphones in valence mode, can't I use the speaker? In my case.On ADI-2 Pro, Balanced Headphones Mode uses both channels, 1/2 AND 3/4.
Therefore it can not run speakers from Line Out 1/2 at the same time.REMARK: On ADI2/4 Pro SE, Balanced Headphones AND speakers can be used at the same time.
ruern wrote:Also, I bought an ADI 2 PRO FS R BE today. But it was connected to UCX2.
It is also set to SPDIF OUT on UCX2.
I also set it to SPDIF OUT in ADI2.
Total mix, ADAT 1/2 of the information is accepted and exported, why?ADI-2 can use ADAT format.
You can listen to ADAT 1/2 only.Read manual page 54 for more information please.
...”With ADAT only channels 1/2 are monitored, but all 8 channels are passed through.”...
So, do you only get SPDIF signals from Total Mix to AS1/2 channel? Even though there's a separate SPDIF channel? There's no way?
AS1/2 is the optical port. Use the coaxal one (RCA) and AS1/2 stays free.
I have a question. Two TRS ports in the back,
I think we can support balanced mode with one port in the ADI2 PROFS lineup, but was it impossible?
I have a question. Two TRS ports in the back,
I think we can support balanced mode with one port in the ADI2 PROFS lineup, but was it impossible?
All ADI-2 model’s XLR outs at the back are active balanced.
They are line outs, with an output impedance of 200 Ohm, and short-circuit protected.
Although definitely not intended as such, the XLRs can be (mis-)used as balanced headphones outputs.
Due to their high output impedance this will work better or worse, largely depending on the headphones model used.
I don’t see any advantage compared to the dedicated front HP outs, balanced or single-ended.
But it’s your life - feel free to try.
The back TRS are impedance-balanced (the inverted legs do not carry a signal) and therefore even less suited as headphones outs.
Thank you for your answer.
In the case of THD, of course, this is also a kind of noise and it's a problem, but I know that if you lose too much, your tone gets cold. So, is the THD very high clear and cold?
Also, channel separation has also been raised to 130 dB, so how different effects can this result have?
When I work on it, can that generally affect my work?
• DAC-chips changed from AKM to ESS.
According to my extensive, level matched blind A/B comparison, both sound the same IF SAME SHAPED DA-FILTERS ARE USED.
Albeit, most same-named DA-Filters have different shapes between AKM and ESS, ONLY IN CASE USING THESE both chips sound different.
The filters are well documented in each model’s manual.
“Sharp” sounds the same, the others are different.The audible difference only occurs with sample rates of 44.1 and 48 kHz.
With SRs above the filters are out of the audible range.
Good morning Kai.
With the AKM chip of the ADI-2 Pro FS, you had a certain preference for the slow filter
https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=31302
https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.ph … 68#p177168
What about the ADI-2/4 Pro with the ESS chip? Have you found a filter with similar characteristics that you prefer?
Normally, I use SD Slow and SD Sharp filters. Well, there's going to be a change.
Sharp everywhere for me on the 2/4.
KaiS wrote:• DAC-chips changed from AKM to ESS.
According to my extensive, level matched blind A/B comparison, both sound the same IF SAME SHAPED DA-FILTERS ARE USED.
Albeit, most same-named DA-Filters have different shapes between AKM and ESS, ONLY IN CASE USING THESE both chips sound different.
The filters are well documented in each model’s manual.
“Sharp” sounds the same, the others are different.The audible difference only occurs with sample rates of 44.1 and 48 kHz.
With SRs above the filters are out of the audible range.Good morning Kai.
With the AKM chip of the ADI-2 Pro FS, you had a certain preference for the slow filter
https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=31302
https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.ph … 68#p177168What about the ADI-2/4 Pro with the ESS chip? Have you found a filter with similar characteristics that you prefer?
There’s no exact equivalent.
Same named filters are very different between AKM and ESS version, both in time- and frequency response.
Not exactly the same, but ESS “SD LD” - “short delay low dispersion”- comes close to AKM “Slow” filter.
The ESS “SD LD” does sound a bit more “open” in colors and a bit less focused on transients, wich is OK with me.
One has to be aware:
The differences are subtle, by no means night and day, and their audible effects even depend on the music track.
Thank you for the good work / efforts and that you share such results here in the forum.
Very interesting and it saves me time and effort.
Little add:
“Sharp”-DA-filters sound the same on AKM and ESS, according to my listing test.
Only that I don’t like them best on either device.
The first time I became aware of this was in the 1990’s, when CD-Player manufacturers, e.g. Denon and Pioneer, started to offer their own DA-filter versions other than the “Sharp”-shaped ones, partly already switchable.
I noticed that, astonishingly, filters with a significant treble roll-off sounded brighter or clearer.
ruern wrote:I wonder what changed in comparison. In terms of spec sheet alone, input impedance increased, max power of headphone output increased, THD increased, and output channel increased. Are there any other changes?
And has the internal chipset of two quarters changed?
Additional to the changes you mentioned:
• The Rear TRSs can be re-routed to be used as separate Line Outputs for channel 3/4.
• Added a dedicated Pentacon / 4 mm balanced headphones output.
• Balanced headphones out now only needs to use channel 3/4, does no longer occupy both channels 1/2 AND 3/4.
• Headphones outs now have a little more power.• Analog Input now can be used as turntable / phono RIAA preamp input, that works well here with MM-Pickups.
To accomplish this, the input impedance was changed to the standard (47) 45 kOhm.• DAC-chips changed from AKM to ESS.
According to my extensive, level matched blind A/B comparison, both sound the same IF SAME SHAPED DA-FILTERS ARE USED.
Albeit, most same-named DA-Filters have different shapes between AKM and ESS, ONLY IN CASE USING THESE both chips sound different.
The filters are well documented in each model’s manual.
“Sharp” sounds the same, the others are different.The audible difference only occurs with sample rates of 44.1 and 48 kHz.
With SRs above the filters are out of the audible range.• He new Power Supply (ATS040T-P120) now has a 3-prong-connector that includes safety ground.
The safety ground isn’t connected directly to ADI-2/4 Pro SE, but through a 1 kOhm resistor.
This configuration avoids ground-loop related hum to built up, while addressing a problem with stray-current related hum that could occur in some configurations.The new ADI-2/4 Pro SE standard PSU can be used with ADI-2 Pro and ADI-2 DAC too.
• For those having too much money and worship the gods of misguided audiophila
Might be that the LPS indeed has an advantage when ADI-2 is used as measurement frontend.
At least, if RME does something, my RME-experience let’s me presume they do it right and at reasonable prices.The LPS can be used with ADI-2 Pro and ADI-2 DAC too.
There doesn't seem to be a lot of distributors with the ATS040T-P120 power supplies on the internet. But I found this one for example: https://www.bicker.de/en/ats040t-p120_i … er_62368-1
Would this have the lockable connecter also? Minimizing hum on the ADI-2 Pro FS R is the priority, and upgrading to the ADI 2/4 is a little extreme for me.
Do you experience any issues with hum?
I have for example so many electronic devices connected to my power strips in the recording and also in the HiFi corner,
but never had any issues with HUM.
I was using ADI-2 Pro and DAC 1st gen, and I have now two ADI-2 Pro FS R BE.
Furthermore, I understand KaiS statement in a way that the efforts from RME have increased to kill any form of hum (if there is one or a possibility for hum). But this doesn't mean that with the two-prong-connectors (PSU) you would definitely get issues with hum.
If there were generals (design) issues with the old PSU, then the devices could not reach their high SNR and you would hear hum.
So IMHO, no need to become oversensitive on this "hum" topic.
KaiS wrote:...
• The new Power Supply (ATS040T-P120) now has a 3-prong-connector that includes safety ground.
The safety ground isn’t connected directly to ADI-2/4 Pro SE, but through a 1 kOhm resistor.
This configuration avoids ground-loop related hum to built up, while addressing a problem with stray-current related hum that could occur in some configurations.The new ADI-2/4 Pro SE standard PSU can be used with ADI-2 Pro and ADI-2 DAC too.
...There doesn't seem to be a lot of distributors with the ATS040T-P120 power supplies on the internet. But I found this one for example: https://www.bicker.de/en/ats040t-p120_i … er_62368-1
Would this have the lockable connecter also? Minimizing hum on the ADI-2 Pro FS R is the priority, and upgrading to the ADI 2/4 is a little extreme for me.
Seems you found the one, but without the locking DC connector.
DC polarity is not mentioned in the datasheet either.
Guess the PSU with locking plug is available from RME directly.
The price is convincing, I ordered 3 and will report back.
Hum, BTW, is only addressable by another PSU in few very certain configurations.
Nicked_Wicked wrote:KaiS wrote:...
• The new Power Supply (ATS040T-P120) now has a 3-prong-connector that includes safety ground.
The safety ground isn’t connected directly to ADI-2/4 Pro SE, but through a 1 kOhm resistor.
This configuration avoids ground-loop related hum to built up, while addressing a problem with stray-current related hum that could occur in some configurations.The new ADI-2/4 Pro SE standard PSU can be used with ADI-2 Pro and ADI-2 DAC too.
...There doesn't seem to be a lot of distributors with the ATS040T-P120 power supplies on the internet. But I found this one for example: https://www.bicker.de/en/ats040t-p120_i … er_62368-1
Would this have the lockable connecter also? Minimizing hum on the ADI-2 Pro FS R is the priority, and upgrading to the ADI 2/4 is a little extreme for me.
Seems you found the one, but without the locking DC connector.
DC polarity is not mentioned in the datasheet either.
Guess the PSU with locking plug is available from RME directly.The price is convincing, I ordered 3 and will report back.
Hum, BTW, is only addressable by another PSU in few very certain configurations.
I think I found the original RME PSU as well, RME NT-RME-11 is the new PSU with the lockable connector exclusively for the ADI-2/4 Pro SE. It seems only Synthax has them on their website at the moment, out of stock that is. Maybe Thomann could get a small batch of them as well when asked.
There doesn't seem to be a lot of distributors with the ATS040T-P120 power supplies on the internet. But I found this one for example: https://www.bicker.de/en/ats040t-p120_i … er_62368-1
Would this have the lockable connecter also? Minimizing hum on the ADI-2 Pro FS R is the priority, and upgrading to the ADI 2/4 is a little extreme for me.
This is NOT the ps included with the ADI-2/4 Pro SE. It does not have the special grounding arrangement - and also no lockable connector.
Nicked_Wicked wrote:There doesn't seem to be a lot of distributors with the ATS040T-P120 power supplies on the internet. But I found this one for example: https://www.bicker.de/en/ats040t-p120_i … er_62368-1
Would this have the lockable connecter also? Minimizing hum on the ADI-2 Pro FS R is the priority, and upgrading to the ADI 2/4 is a little extreme for me.
This is NOT the ps included with the ADI-2/4 Pro SE. It does not have the special grounding arrangement - and also no lockable connector.
The PSUs from Bicker.de came here today, I can confirm what MC noted:
• The plug is non-lockable.
• Ground arrangement is different to the standard ADI 2/4 PSU, safety ground is directly connected to negative DC, no 1K resistor in between.
This might provoke mains hum from ground loops in some configurations.
• A mains cord is not included, which doesn’t hurt here as I have tons of these.
• Voltage and polarity is correct for ADI-2, so the PSU does work, as emergency spare ADI-2 PSU’s e.g.
What is the use case scenario for the black editions 2 TS outputs on the back?
What is the use case scenario for the black editions 2 TS outputs on the back?
On the ADI-2 Pro the rear T(R)S serve as alternative and independent secondary outputs for Line Out 1/2.
• The Rear TRSs can be re-routed to be used as separate Line Outputs for channel 3/4.
• Added a dedicated Pentacon / 4 mm balanced headphones output.
• Balanced headphones out now only needs to use channel 3/4, does no longer occupy both channels 1/2 AND 3/4.
The Pentaconn could also be used as a balanced line output through an adapter cable to two XLRs, couldn't it? That's an alternative to rerouting TRS, and at least it would give a different set of reference levels.
No, if I understood it correctly, then balanced on phones is not exactly the same as balanced on line-level.
There is for my understanding no circuit to filter out any potential difference between the signal in opposite polarity (+/-).
But I might be wrong :-)
KaiS wrote:• The Rear TRSs can be re-routed to be used as separate Line Outputs for channel 3/4.
• Added a dedicated Pentacon / 4 mm balanced headphones output.
• Balanced headphones out now only needs to use channel 3/4, does no longer occupy both channels 1/2 AND 3/4.The Pentaconn could also be used as a balanced line output through an adapter cable to two XLRs, couldn't it? That's an alternative to rerouting TRS, and at least it would give a different set of reference levels.
It’s true, the Pentaconn Output can be used as fully active balanced Line Output too.
All signals are there, left’s and right’s hot and cold, and a screen.
The only thing to consider:
Due to the nature of it being a power amp, it can not be used unbalanced by grounding the cold pins, or you will get a “short detect” message.
For unbalanced use only the hot pins should be connected, the cold pins are left open.
Or just use the TRS for unbalanced.
Sounds a bit funny to use a balanced output with an unbalanced input, but in studio situations this happens quite often (Patchfield), that’s why I give this remark.
No, if I understood it correctly, then balanced on phones is not exactly the same as balanced on line-level.
There is for my understanding no circuit to filter out any potential difference between the signal in opposite polarity (+/-)
The functionality to eliminate unbalanced noise signals from the interconnect (signals with same polarity on both hot and cold lines) is present on balanced inputs only.
ruern wrote:I wonder what changed in comparison. In terms of spec sheet alone, input impedance increased, max power of headphone output increased, THD increased, and output channel increased. Are there any other changes?
And has the internal chipset of two quarters changed?
Additional to the changes you mentioned:
• The Rear TRSs can be re-routed to be used as separate Line Outputs for channel 3/4.
• Added a dedicated Pentacon / 4 mm balanced headphones output.
• Balanced headphones out now only needs to use channel 3/4, does no longer occupy both channels 1/2 AND 3/4.
• Headphones outs now have a little more power.• Analog Input now can be used as turntable / phono RIAA preamp input, that works well here with MM-Pickups.
To accomplish this, the input impedance was changed to the standard (47) 45 kOhm.• DAC-chips changed from AKM to ESS.
According to my extensive, level matched blind A/B comparison, both sound the same IF SAME SHAPED DA-FILTERS ARE USED.
Albeit, most same-named DA-Filters have different shapes between AKM and ESS, ONLY IN CASE USING THESE both chips sound different.
The filters are well documented in each model’s manual.
“Sharp” sounds the same, the others are different.The audible difference only occurs with sample rates of 44.1 and 48 kHz.
With SRs above the filters are out of the audible range.• The new Power Supply (ATS040T-P120) now has a 3-prong-connector that includes safety ground.
The safety ground isn’t connected directly to ADI-2/4 Pro SE, but through a 1 kOhm resistor.
This configuration avoids ground-loop related hum to built up, while addressing a problem with stray-current related hum that could occur in some configurations.The new ADI-2/4 Pro SE standard PSU can be used with ADI-2 Pro and ADI-2 DAC too.
• For those having too much money and worship the gods of misguided audiophila
Might be that the LPS indeed has an advantage when ADI-2 is used as measurement frontend.
At least, if RME does something, my RME-experience let’s me presume they do it right and at reasonable prices.The LPS can be used with ADI-2 Pro and ADI-2 DAC too.
Great and thorough post!
RME User Forum → ADI-2 & 2/4 Pro series, ADI-2 DAC series → ADI 2/4 Pro SE VS ADI 2 Pro FS R BE
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