1 Topic by stromkraft (edited by stromkraft 2023-03-29 20:56:40)

  • Registered: 2014-07-01
  • Posts: 79

Topic: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

I thought the 4.07 release should have its own thread, so started this as I didn't see one.

Some short time ago I installed 4.07 for my original Babyface with firmware v226 in macOS 13.2.1 on M1 hardware. I did experience mild and occasional, but nevertheless clear and recurrent dropouts everywhere in the system, including my DAW and also noticed the CAReportingService using up quite a bit of CPUpower during the time with these issues. I've since then updated to macOS 13.3 and have had bouts of unrelated problems, but remains to be seen if this OS update solves the issue with dropouts.

Report about 4.07 under 13.3 will follow in a few days.

Please post your experience with the release 4.07 version and don't forget to mention your audio interface, its firmware version and OS.

RME Babyface v226 | 4.07 | MacBook Pro 13" 2020 | 16gb/1tb
  • From: Montreal, QC
  • Registered: 2009-09-20
  • Posts: 41

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

4.07 on Ventura 13.2.1.

Babyface Pro @ 203

Tons of glitches and dropouts in Logic @ 128 samples where there were none with the non-userspace driver. Latency is up as well. Upgrading to 13.3.0 right now to see if there's any improvement. Will roll back otherwise.

  • Registered: 2014-07-01
  • Posts: 79

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

stromkraft wrote:

Report about 4.07 under 13.3 will follow in a few days.

It's still early days, but for the handful of sessions I've had last week I haven't noticed dropouts, like before when using the beta or problems, in sessions, neither when in zoom meetings at the same time as using my DAW nor when using media like streaming services nor music/video apps. I did have dropouts at a 32 sample buffer in one heavy project, but it disappeared when raising the buffer which I'd regard as expected.

I'll have more sessions this week, so I'll see if this continues.

I do have other non-audio problems though, so might reinstall the os.

RME Babyface v226 | 4.07 | MacBook Pro 13" 2020 | 16gb/1tb

4 Reply by dialing_wand (edited by dialing_wand 2023-04-04 12:43:55)

  • From: Montreal, QC
  • Registered: 2009-09-20
  • Posts: 41

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

dialing_wand wrote:

4.07 on Ventura 13.2.1.

Babyface Pro @ 203

Tons of glitches and dropouts in Logic @ 128 samples where there were none with the non-userspace driver. Latency is up as well. Upgrading to 13.3.0 right now to see if there's any improvement. Will roll back otherwise.

After upgrading to 13.3.0, I'm still seeing far more glitchiness in general and it's hard to tell if any improvement is real or imagined. Additionally, I had to remove the "short safety offset" option, which I had no trouble with on the 3.x driver. Overall it just feels like performance is way down.

EDIT:

I rolled back to 3.28A and all the glitches are gone. I can play with a 64-sample buffer again and mix at 128.

  • Registered: 2014-07-01
  • Posts: 79

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

dialing_wand wrote:
dialing_wand wrote:

4.07 on Ventura 13.2.1.

Babyface Pro @ 203

Tons of glitches and dropouts in Logic @ 128 samples where there were none with the non-userspace driver. Latency is up as well. Upgrading to 13.3.0 right now to see if there's any improvement. Will roll back otherwise.

After upgrading to 13.3.0, I'm still seeing far more glitchiness in general and it's hard to tell if any improvement is real or imagined. Additionally, I had to remove the "short safety offset" option, which I had no trouble with on the 3.x driver. Overall it just feels like performance is way down.

EDIT:

I rolled back to 3.28A and all the glitches are gone. I can play with a 64-sample buffer again and mix at 128.

Was it any different with recording active? What about non-DAW apps, if you used any like that?

RME Babyface v226 | 4.07 | MacBook Pro 13" 2020 | 16gb/1tb
  • Registered: 2012-06-15
  • Posts: 42

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Sadly, I can confirm, I am seeing a lot of glitchiness, including on the Babyface DSP reverb.  Going to have to roll back.

  • Registered: 2014-07-01
  • Posts: 79

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Given I don't have any issues currently with my original Babyface and the 4.07 user space driver in macOS 13.3 I do wonder if hardware could have any part in this kind of issue. Or some other detail of course.

RME Babyface v226 | 4.07 | MacBook Pro 13" 2020 | 16gb/1tb

8 Reply by stromkraft (edited by stromkraft 2023-04-09 01:04:40)

  • Registered: 2014-07-01
  • Posts: 79

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

pschuegr wrote:

Sadly, I can confirm, I am seeing a lot of glitchiness, including on the Babyface DSP reverb.

You do know that's done on comp, right? At least, I've seen statements indicating this.
I've got a feeling Apple sits on some answers in this area. After all, they came up with the concept of user space drivers. It's very unsatisfactory to have few ideas on how to be able to get some proper answers to this kind of problem.  Even if it's a natural part of real-time audio processing.

What we need is to set our respective machines into the state of avoiding whatever it is that causes this kind of behaviour. That is more complicated as this area is where software music tools, audio drivers, the OS and audio interface and computer hardware all meet. It's not clear cut that one thing is to blame as it's all interacting. Which is no reason to give up.

RME Babyface v226 | 4.07 | MacBook Pro 13" 2020 | 16gb/1tb

9 Reply by stromkraft (edited by stromkraft 2023-04-09 01:56:32)

  • Registered: 2014-07-01
  • Posts: 79

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Here's one lead pointing to the CAReportingService (Core Audio) (Stackoverflow)and in the comments this Apple discussion post USB 2 audio interface drop outs is mentioned.

I have also noticed the process CAReportingService using a lot of memory, also when not having any kind of audio dropout issue. Not lately though.

Another process, that I'm not certain is the driver or even directly related, is the more obvious RMEUsbAsp. It's certainly a contender for being the driver as nothing else is named with "rme".

RME Babyface v226 | 4.07 | MacBook Pro 13" 2020 | 16gb/1tb
  • Registered: 2012-06-15
  • Posts: 42

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Yeah, I just pointed out the DSP reverb problem as an indication that it wasn't related to the DAW, sometimes teasing those apart is tricky.

  • Registered: 2014-07-01
  • Posts: 79

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

pschuegr wrote:

Yeah, I just pointed out the DSP reverb problem as an indication that it wasn't related to the DAW, sometimes teasing those apart is tricky.

Absolutely. Thanks for sharing.

RME Babyface v226 | 4.07 | MacBook Pro 13" 2020 | 16gb/1tb

12 Reply by stromkraft (edited by stromkraft 2023-04-10 07:15:41)

  • Registered: 2014-07-01
  • Posts: 79

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Another tool as this is related to CoreAudio (CA) is to investigate with the terminal using lsof to see what processes are using CA, like this piping with grep to limit results: 

lsof | grep -i coreaudio

When there are issues it could be a good idea to see if some other process might be disturbing CoreAudio operation, so you can quit these and isolate the real issue.

Remember, when attempting to find a cause for something ruling out possibilities by removing their influence can be a good first step. Note that some things listed as users are system processes you may have very little control over. Any unexpected process is probably of bigger interest to you.

RME Babyface v226 | 4.07 | MacBook Pro 13" 2020 | 16gb/1tb

13 Reply by magebarf (edited by magebarf 2023-04-09 11:05:40)

  • Registered: 2018-07-10
  • Posts: 16

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

On my end (Mac Mini M1, MacOS Ventura 13.3, Babyface) the CAReportingService is not really active at all only rarely rounding the CPU load above 0.0%.

I am however seeing a "de.rme-audio.dkusb" (DKUSB I assume is the DriverKit USB driver?) process, as user _driverkit, hovering around 4%.

I admit I am not an expert on the process statistics, as shown in the activity monitor, but clicking the (i) icon at the top tool bar and then switching to the statistics page, I see the faults counter increase rapidly. Now, I don't think faults simply means errors, as each and every process I'm looking at gives something similar, but my quick round of googling confirmed my suspicion that it could be page faults (which is simply related to memory management, moving pages in and out of RAM).

This is likely something out of RME's hands, as it relies on so many layers of MacOS and DriverKit below it, but I would assume that an Audio driver, with "continuous" processing being done, would not be paged out, causing page faults as frequently as I'm seeing here? What are you others seeing?

Edit: Just to mention, the observation above is on my machine after 12 days of uptime. Just about to get MacOS 13.3.1 installed, so can see if that affects anything.
Also, as a entirely unrelated note while browsing the list of processes: "Core Audio Driver (MSTeamsAudioDevice.driver)" what the heck, shame on you Microsoft!

  • From: Montreal, QC
  • Registered: 2009-09-20
  • Posts: 41

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

stromkraft wrote:

Was it any different with recording active? What about non-DAW apps, if you used any like that?

That's a really great question.

Using the 4.07 userspace driver, I did not notice any issues in other applications including Loopback, OBS, Zoom, GMeet. I also didn't notice any glitchiness with recording and playing back low-track count audio (in Logic) - as I had been using 4.07 for voice-over work and it wasn't until I went back to writing music that I noticed the issue.

To be fair, the issue is with very heavy sample libraries that pummel the PCIe/Thunderbolt bus (ex. EW Opus with large string ensembles.)

At least in my case it seems to be near-realtime sample playback in Logic that's the issue. I don't use the Babyface Pro DSP.

15 Reply by dialing_wand (edited by dialing_wand 2023-04-09 13:04:21)

  • From: Montreal, QC
  • Registered: 2009-09-20
  • Posts: 41

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

magebarf wrote:

Also, as a entirely unrelated note while browsing the list of processes: "Core Audio Driver (MSTeamsAudioDevice.driver)" what the heck, shame on you Microsoft!

One really nice update to Ventura is the ability to control which extensions (kernel or userspace) are being loaded:

Settings->General->Login Items now shows a list that was previous hidden or controlled via the CLI.

  • From: Montreal, QC
  • Registered: 2009-09-20
  • Posts: 41

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Sorry for the flood here. I was looking through the latest responses to the 4.06 thread and noticed someone complaining that the issues were only in 48k. This is sample rate I use for most of my work and my machine is locked to that sample rate.

Now that I think about it, I did notice a lot more glitchiness, particularly in YouTube playback, and I'm quite positive the bulk of the sample libraries are 44.1kHz.

Could this be some issue with SRC in realtime in userspace?

17 Reply by rao

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Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

After getting a little worried about possible latency performance degradation with 4.07 I checked with:
* MacOS 12.6.4 on an M1 Macbook Pro  / 32GB
* Logic Pro 10.7.7
* 32 samples I/O Buffer
* simple tracks using a demanding softsynth

With both 3.28a and 4.07 I got:
* 22 tracks @ 44.1khz without glitches and overload with 23 tracks

I also checked @ 48khz with 4.07 and got 21 tracks to work.
So far I couldn't spot a difference in performance.

  • Registered: 2012-06-15
  • Posts: 42

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

@dialing_wand: thanks for pointing out the better control over login items! Got a few stray items that could be causing problems.

19 Reply by magebarf (edited by magebarf 2023-04-09 16:41:19)

  • Registered: 2018-07-10
  • Posts: 16

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

dialing_wand wrote:
magebarf wrote:

Also, as a entirely unrelated note while browsing the list of processes: "Core Audio Driver (MSTeamsAudioDevice.driver)" what the heck, shame on you Microsoft!

One really nice update to Ventura is the ability to control which extensions (kernel or userspace) are being loaded:

Settings->General->Login Items now shows a list that was previous hidden or controlled via the CLI.

Thanks for the pointer! I had missed the updated version of this dialog. Previously you had some of these placed under your Account settings I believe?

However, the sneaky Core Audio driver for Teams is not placed there. If anyone else is seeing it, a recommendation is to at least upgrade it to the latest version (right click your Teams application, Show Package Contents, and then run the installation package in SharedSupport) as it seems to fail upgrading automatically, which leads to it being stuck on a x86/x64 version even on the M1. After upgrading it's now Apple Silicon native, and stays quite constant at 0.0 CPU.

The purpose of the audio device is to act similar to Audio Hijack/Soundflower, to simplify grabbing the system sounds when sharing a screen in Teams, so if you know you won't be using it you can probably follow this guide (https://droidwin.com/how-to-uninstall-c … er-on-mac/)

  • Registered: 2023-04-10
  • Posts: 4

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Didn't see this thread before commenting in the 4.06 sticky, but will copy/paste my comments to here:



Hi all, I wanted to report on an issue I've noticed after upgrading the FW/Driver on my UCX-II to v42/4.07.

The behavior I'm seeing so far is specific to Line Input 5 on the interface, to where the interface stops receiving any audio coming in. I can move the cable to any other input and it works, but here's the other crazy thing.  After a reboot, the input works.  I can also go to TotalMixFX and if I change the input's configuration from +19dBu to +13dBu the input starts working again, either on +19/+13dBu.  After some time which can be hours or days the input will stop processing audio again until I toggle the input configuration or reboot the interface.

Any additional information needed to debug this? I'd love to get as much information as needed for RME's team as I don't suspect this is a hardware issue.  If it is hardware for some reason I can work with Sweetwater to RMA but I believe this is related to software/firmware.

-Tyler

21 Reply by stromkraft (edited by stromkraft 2023-04-10 09:12:59)

  • Registered: 2014-07-01
  • Posts: 79

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

magebarf wrote:

I am however seeing a "de.rme-audio.dkusb" (DKUSB I assume is the DriverKit USB driver?) process, as user _driverkit, hovering around 4%.

driverkit is indeed using it whereas RMEUsbAsp is used by the CoreAudio daemon, coreaudiod. The former is installed in "/Library/SystemExtensions" and runs only when the audio interface is connected and the latter runs always. So if we run lsof on dkusb we probably will see the FireFace app is using it, so that is making the audio changes you can do with it. However the latter is installed as "/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/HAL/RMEUsbAsp.driver" so would appear to much more likely being the actual driver. If I run lsof on it I get nothing. HAL is an abbreviation of Hardware Abstraction Layer.

The driverkit developer documentation says

"In macOS, use the System Extensions framework to install and upgrade your driver."

but I do think that means that is, what is installed there, does, namely it installs and I think also controls the driver.

RME Babyface v226 | 4.07 | MacBook Pro 13" 2020 | 16gb/1tb

22 Reply by magebarf (edited by magebarf 2023-04-10 13:44:54)

  • Registered: 2018-07-10
  • Posts: 16

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

stromkraft wrote:

driverkit is indeed using it whereas RMEUsbAsp is used by the CoreAudio daemon, coreaudiod. The former is installed in "/Library/SystemExtensions" and runs only when the audio interface is connected and the latter runs always. So if we run lsof on dkusb we probably will see the FireFace app is using it, so that is making the audio changes you can do with it. However the latter is installed as "/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/HAL/RMEUsbAsp.driver" so would appear to much more likely being the actual driver. If I run lsof on it I get nothing. HAL is an abbreviation of Hardware Abstraction Layer.

Interestingly, the side track/rabbit hole I started unnesting with regards to MS Teams ends up in this same corner...
If my understanding is fully correct, based on what I saw related to the MS Teams device for audio routing/sharing system audio, the components in the HAL is what makes the RME hardware show up as a device in the "Audio MIDI Setup" application.

This may of course be a extremely oversimplified take, and I would bet the component/.driver file does a whole lot more than present it as a configurable Audio Device, but it definitely shows there are layers on top of our already known layers. smile

23 Reply by artisan (edited by artisan 2023-04-11 11:09:30)

  • Registered: 2021-02-15
  • Posts: 17

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Hey folks

On an M1 Max macbook. Just got the UFX III and upgraded to latest firmware and drivers. I'm noticing completely random audio glitches (stutters) that I can't seem to reproduce on demand. Is this happening to others? It's very sporadic, I've only started noticing it now when playing audio from Youtube and from Apple Music. I'll have to pay more attention during my sessions. I'm worried about it being a hardware issue but it seems, on this thread, that there might be issues on the software end (?)

Anything I can do to help figure out what's causing this? Because if it's happening to me it must be happening to others too, unless there's a hardware issue...

I had a UCX II before this on the older firmware (kernel root extension, I think it was 3.27) and I never had any issues whatsoever. This only started happening when I got the UFX III and updated it to latest firmware and DriverKit extension (4.07) (FW v20)

I also use 48KHz. I may be wrong but I don't think I've heard these issues in my DAW, which is set to 48KHz. But I know for sure I hear it from Apple Music (Hi-Res Lossless) and Youtube.

24 Reply by stromkraft (edited by stromkraft 2023-04-12 04:01:54)

  • Registered: 2014-07-01
  • Posts: 79

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

artisan wrote:

Hey folks

On an M1 Max macbook. Just got the UFX III and upgraded to latest firmware and drivers. I'm noticing completely random audio glitches (stutters) that I can't seem to reproduce on demand. Is this happening to others? It's very sporadic, I've only started noticing it now when playing audio from Youtube and from Apple Music. I'll have to pay more attention during my sessions. I'm worried about it being a hardware issue but it seems, on this thread, that there might be issues on the software end (?)

Anything I can do to help figure out what's causing this? Because if it's happening to me it must be happening to others too, unless there's a hardware issue...

I had a UCX II before this on the older firmware (kernel root extension, I think it was 3.27) and I never had any issues whatsoever. This only started happening when I got the UFX III and updated it to latest firmware and DriverKit extension (4.07) (FW v20)

I also use 48KHz. I may be wrong but I don't think I've heard these issues in my DAW, which is set to 48KHz. But I know for sure I hear it from Apple Music (Hi-Res Lossless) and Youtube.

I did have some of such problems under macOS 13.2 and previously in macOS 12 as well, but they're gone since macOS 13.3. Using 44.1 kHz though. I've seen suggestions these kinds of problems being related to using 48 kHz, but haven't investigated.

RME Babyface v226 | 4.07 | MacBook Pro 13" 2020 | 16gb/1tb
  • Registered: 2023-04-12
  • Posts: 4

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Also seeing a ton of glitches and stuttering -- in DAW and also when using just for playback on YouTube or Spotify. Causes my computer to start crawling to the point I have to restart.

MacOS 11.7.4, 27" iMac, 6 core i5, 40GB RAM

UFXIII Running the most recent Firmware and 4.0.7 driver.

  • Registered: 2021-02-15
  • Posts: 17

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

stromkraft wrote:
artisan wrote:

Hey folks

On an M1 Max macbook. Just got the UFX III and upgraded to latest firmware and drivers. I'm noticing completely random audio glitches (stutters) that I can't seem to reproduce on demand. Is this happening to others? It's very sporadic, I've only started noticing it now when playing audio from Youtube and from Apple Music. I'll have to pay more attention during my sessions. I'm worried about it being a hardware issue but it seems, on this thread, that there might be issues on the software end (?)

Anything I can do to help figure out what's causing this? Because if it's happening to me it must be happening to others too, unless there's a hardware issue...

I had a UCX II before this on the older firmware (kernel root extension, I think it was 3.27) and I never had any issues whatsoever. This only started happening when I got the UFX III and updated it to latest firmware and DriverKit extension (4.07) (FW v20)

I also use 48KHz. I may be wrong but I don't think I've heard these issues in my DAW, which is set to 48KHz. But I know for sure I hear it from Apple Music (Hi-Res Lossless) and Youtube.

I did have some of such problems under macOS 13.2 and previously in macOS 12 as well, but they're gone since macOS 13.3. Using 44.1 kHz though. I've seen suggestions these kinds of problems being related to using 48 kHz, but haven't investigated.

I didn't seem to get any in my session yesterday in the DAW, @ 48KHz.

However, this morning I set the interface to 44.1KHz, and watched some Youtube, and I did get glitches. I'm on macOS 13.3.1.

sad

  • Registered: 2021-02-15
  • Posts: 17

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

kevindeleon wrote:

Also seeing a ton of glitches and stuttering -- in DAW and also when using just for playback on YouTube or Spotify. Causes my computer to start crawling to the point I have to restart.

MacOS 11.7.4, 27" iMac, 6 core i5, 40GB RAM

UFXIII Running the most recent Firmware and 4.0.7 driver.

Ok well I guess then I don't have to be too worried about it being a hardware issue. Probably a driver issue... Well, I hope...

28 Reply by stromkraft (edited by stromkraft 2023-04-12 16:00:57)

  • Registered: 2014-07-01
  • Posts: 79

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

@artisan and @kevindeleon, have you done a simple CPU History run in Activity Monitor, so that you can see whether any core is overloaded or not when you have these dropouts/glitches? That could happen out of multiple reasons. Spikes certainly can happen when one thinks the load is light. I'm not certain spikes will register in CPU History, but they might. CPU overload is one of the things you actually can measure.

RME Babyface v226 | 4.07 | MacBook Pro 13" 2020 | 16gb/1tb
  • Registered: 2023-04-12
  • Posts: 4

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

stromkraft wrote:

@artisan and @kevindeleon, have you done a simple CPU History run in Activity Monitor, so that you can see whether any core is overloaded or not when you have these dropouts/glitches? That could happen out of multiple reasons. Spikes certainly can happen when one thinks the load is light. I'm not certain spikes will register in CPU History, but they might. CPU overload is one of the things you actually can measure.

I have not, but next time it starts happening, I will open up CPU History and check it.

I have opened Activity Monitor when this is happening (not CPU History pane) -- and to be honest there was nothing out of the ordinary in terms of one app or process using an exorbitant amount of CPU.

  • Registered: 2023-04-12
  • Posts: 4

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

artisan wrote:
stromkraft wrote:
artisan wrote:

Hey folks

On an M1 Max macbook. Just got the UFX III and upgraded to latest firmware and drivers. I'm noticing completely random audio glitches (stutters) that I can't seem to reproduce on demand. Is this happening to others? It's very sporadic, I've only started noticing it now when playing audio from Youtube and from Apple Music. I'll have to pay more attention during my sessions. I'm worried about it being a hardware issue but it seems, on this thread, that there might be issues on the software end (?)

Anything I can do to help figure out what's causing this? Because if it's happening to me it must be happening to others too, unless there's a hardware issue...

I had a UCX II before this on the older firmware (kernel root extension, I think it was 3.27) and I never had any issues whatsoever. This only started happening when I got the UFX III and updated it to latest firmware and DriverKit extension (4.07) (FW v20)

I also use 48KHz. I may be wrong but I don't think I've heard these issues in my DAW, which is set to 48KHz. But I know for sure I hear it from Apple Music (Hi-Res Lossless) and Youtube.

I did have some of such problems under macOS 13.2 and previously in macOS 12 as well, but they're gone since macOS 13.3. Using 44.1 kHz though. I've seen suggestions these kinds of problems being related to using 48 kHz, but haven't investigated.

I didn't seem to get any in my session yesterday in the DAW, @ 48KHz.

However, this morning I set the interface to 44.1KHz, and watched some Youtube, and I did get glitches. I'm on macOS 13.3.1.

sad

I've switched to 44.1 since restarting and so far so good. Been up and running, listening to music, YouTube, Spotify and no glitching or obvious slowness... I have not opened my DAW yet -- and i'm by no means calling tis a fix -- but so far so good on my system -- going to try to stay at 44.1 for the time being (unless I have to open a 48k session of course) and see what happens...

31 Reply by JL

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Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

I had a weird set of issues yesterday with Digiface AVB.

Earlier I tried 4.07 driver briefly with original UFX, had glitches and installed 3.28A which was ok. Computer is MBP M1 Max, 64 gigs memory, Mac Os 13.3.

Yesterday I was setting up my live keyboard setup with Sonnet Echo 5 thunderbolt hub, I thought it would be convenient to streamline the setup by connecting less cables. I had tried the sonnet hub with earlier os (13.2), earlier Digiface AVB firmware (252) and earlier driver 3.28 everything was ok, only a few usb controllers different and two D-Link usb not exactly the same units. Now with 13.3 and firmware 254 and driver 3.28A I could not get Digiface AVB to work through sonnet, all audio was distorted and sounded bitcrushed, somehow the clocking was totally wrong, also playback meters in totalmix responded sluggishly. Then i tried to connect digiface AVB straight to computer, same thing. Changing sample rate between 44.1 and 48 khz did not help. In all the tests clock was internal, I did not have AVB network so could not try clock from there. Then I installed 4.07 driverkit driver again, and when connected straight to computer it worked, but not through Sonnet. Everything actually worked really well, I did not get a single glitch and thing i was originally was going to test which was my Ableton live setup file in M1 native mode was just great, testing was not super extensive, just playing around for half an hour or so. Cpu load 20-30%.

Then after that we had a studio session and we have a UFX in the control room. That was what earlier had glitches with 4.07 driver but now I decicded to try it not through d-link hub but connected in a different way (first apple tb-usb adapter then caldigit mini hub) and everything was fine for 4-5 hour session using ableton (rosetta), 48 khz, buffer 256. Project cpu load around 30%, so not heavy but not exactly light either.

What are you guys who have problems using to connect your interfaces to the computer with? Is it even possible driver and firmware updates let alone os updates make some usb hubs or connection setups that worked before suddenly not work?

32 Reply by stromkraft (edited by stromkraft 2023-04-14 15:12:55)

  • Registered: 2014-07-01
  • Posts: 79

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

JL wrote:

What are you guys who have problems using to connect your interfaces to the computer with? Is it even possible driver and firmware updates let alone os updates make some usb hubs or connection setups that worked before suddenly not work?

This might be something right here, because bus powering is often overlooked in these cases. I haven't thought much about it in relation to dropouts. I have recently moved the USB connector for my RME Babyface to an USB hub that while being sufficiently powered from my MacBook, also seems to draw power from one of my connected disks in the same hub. I think that must be the case as the BF is powered also with the USB cable not connected to my machine.

USB only gives you 500 mA max per port, in MacBooks at least AFAIK. As connected devices may not always use all of that, it may work. But once if, even for a brief moment, the total is more than 500 chaos may ensue.

This is something to investigate for everyone facing USB-related problems.

RME Babyface v226 | 4.07 | MacBook Pro 13" 2020 | 16gb/1tb

33 Reply by stromkraft (edited by stromkraft 2023-04-14 10:30:26)

  • Registered: 2014-07-01
  • Posts: 79

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Here's yet another idea to try, which is a suggestion from @ME so quoting:

MC wrote:

Open Audio MIDI Setup, Audio Window, click on the lower left + sign, select Create Aggregate Device, then add your RME interface as the only device. This gives the interface a different transport type that Cubase accepts.

https://archiv.rme-audio.de/images/aggregatedeviceDK.png

(2nd embolden mine)
-- New macOS RME USB 4.04 driver – public beta test

This concerned compatibility with Cubase and Nuendo, but as others have added software on the CA bus and seen this kind of issue go away, this Device aggregation idea should be explored if you have problems with audio dropouts/glitches.

Again, I don't have problems since macOS 13.3, so cannot evaluate.

RME Babyface v226 | 4.07 | MacBook Pro 13" 2020 | 16gb/1tb
  • Registered: 2023-04-12
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Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Just an aside -- i was advised to roll back to 3.28A and all is well at both 48k and 44.1 -- gonna give it a day or two to make sure and then will report back to RME support. Hopefully this verifies a driver issue and is something they can use to fix the 4.x driver

35 Reply by stromkraft (edited by stromkraft 2023-04-21 08:44:08)

  • Registered: 2014-07-01
  • Posts: 79

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

I've since, out of other reasons re-installed macOS 13.3 on my M1 machine and migrated my user data from backup. My problem free reign with the user space 4.07 driver for my original Babyface continues.

I use both 44.1 and 88.2 kHz without any issues and never have bigger than a 512 samples audio buffer, more often at 128 or 64 when recording performed audio.

I listen to Apple Music, use Traktor, watch youtube and other web media, plus I use streaming apps like HBO and TV. My DAW mostly is Ableton Live 11.  No stuttering or glitches, unless I'm doing something in Live that overloads the CPU, in case such issues are expected. I can't remember when last something like that stopped me from doing anything, but I did have issues during the beta and prior to macOS 13.3, as I've shared previously.

RME Babyface v226 | 4.07 | MacBook Pro 13" 2020 | 16gb/1tb
  • Registered: 2023-02-15
  • Posts: 10

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

I recently got a 2023 Mac mini M2 Pro (12 core, 32GB RAM, 4TB).  It came with Ventura and I installed everything clean (did not use Migration Assistant).  I have a UCX II connected directly to a USB port on the Mac mini.  I installed the 4.07 drivers and set it to run at 48.0 kHz.

Similar to other posters, I've had occasional dropouts in audio primarily affecting Youtube, Plexamp, and other web media.  I haven't been able to identify any triggers.  I verified in Audio MIDI Setup that all devices are running at 48.0 kHz for both inputs and outputs, and the front panel on the UCX II shows 48.0.

I noticed a few people commented that they changed to 44.1 kHz so I tried that several days ago and have not had any dropouts since.  Will give it some more time but so far, so good.

37 Reply by stromkraft (edited by stromkraft 2023-04-23 12:49:13)

  • Registered: 2014-07-01
  • Posts: 79

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Garion2k wrote:

I noticed a few people commented that they changed to 44.1 kHz so I tried that several days ago and have not had any dropouts since.  Will give it some more time but so far, so good.

If this is a common pattern; it's certainly not new but have been the other way around before the user space driver; then the question is why should this be?

I've seen some details in multiple stories indicating CoreAudio resampling could be involved, but I haven't gotten into these to gather any data. At the moment I'm not sure how I can verify the sample rate at different mix points in a CoreAudio stream.

I do suspect that in some cases, at least, the problem happens in CoreAudio. But I certainly don't have solid data backing that up yet.

RME Babyface v226 | 4.07 | MacBook Pro 13" 2020 | 16gb/1tb
  • Registered: 2023-04-24
  • Posts: 5

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Hi there this is my first post on the forum so bear with me and thanks in advance!
I have just upgraded to a Mac Mini M1 and Mac OS 13.3.1 and installed the latest RME USB Driver Updates 4.07 and now my UFX is not appearing anywhere in the sound devices. I have followed the Recovery Mode boot up to allow reduced security and allowed RME developer extension in security and privacy preference setting. Tried different USB cables just in case but still nothing - no Fireface! Anyone have any experience with this or any ideas?

  • From: Germany
  • Registered: 2007-04-10
  • Posts: 9,774

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Did you first update the firmware?

https://rme-audio.de/driverkit-info.html

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

RME Support's Website

  • Registered: 2023-04-24
  • Posts: 5

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

no I didn't! will try that now... thanks so much for swift response

  • Registered: 2023-04-24
  • Posts: 5

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

ok on looking at my downloads from RME I had in fact tried to run the USB series flash tool but it doesn't find my UFX at all so the updater doesn't run. I have since plugged my UFX into my Mac laptop and it appears fine there so no issue with the box. Should try downgrading the RME software to an older version then try running the Flash Tool again? thanks

42 Reply by waedi (edited by waedi 2023-04-24 13:37:24)

  • waedi
  • DAW Mastermind
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  • From: Swiss Zürich
  • Registered: 2020-12-08
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Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Try to run the FUT on the other computer where the UFX got working.

M1-Sequoia, Madiface Pro, Digiface USB, Babyface silver and blue
  • Registered: 2023-04-24
  • Posts: 5

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

I actually retrograded to usb 328 pkg and it now works fine!!

44 Reply by waedi (edited by waedi 2023-04-24 13:49:32)

  • waedi
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Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Glad you can produce music.
Looking forward to new album...?
Did you use Digicheck in the past ? The new Digicheck NG can show playback channels now.

M1-Sequoia, Madiface Pro, Digiface USB, Babyface silver and blue
  • Registered: 2023-04-24
  • Posts: 5

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

hehe yes me too! new killerwatts album on the way.... who's that? x

46 Reply by waedi (edited by waedi 2023-04-24 14:32:13)

  • waedi
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Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Fantastic !
I'm Walter did see you 1999 in Ozora
best wishes from a fan !

M1-Sequoia, Madiface Pro, Digiface USB, Babyface silver and blue
  • Registered: 2023-02-15
  • Posts: 10

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

stromkraft wrote:
Garion2k wrote:

I noticed a few people commented that they changed to 44.1 kHz so I tried that several days ago and have not had any dropouts since.  Will give it some more time but so far, so good.

If this is a common pattern; it's certainly not new but have been the other way around before the user space driver; then the question is why should this be?

I've seen some details in multiple stories indicating CoreAudio resampling could be involved, but I haven't gotten into these to gather any data. At the moment I'm not sure how I can verify the sample rate at different mix points in a CoreAudio stream.

I do suspect that in some cases, at least, the problem happens in CoreAudio. But I certainly don't have solid data backing that up yet.

Back with an update.  44.1 kHz with 4.07 and 4.08 driver was better than 48 kHz but I still had occasional dropouts.  I ended up uninstalling the DriverKit drivers and installing the KEXT-based 3.28 drivers.  That completely fixed the dropouts even at 48 kHz.

  • Registered: 2023-02-15
  • Posts: 10

Re: New macOS RME USB 4.07 (release) driver

Upgrading to Sonoma and running the 4.08(2) DriverKit drivers solved the issue for me.  I've been running Sonoma since release day and have had no audio dropouts.