Topic: ADI-2 DAC fs usb/coax implementation
Quick question mostly for my own curiosity, does adi-2 dac fs use optical or magnetic galvanic isolation for coax and usb interfaces?
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ADI-2 DAC fs usb/coax implementation
RME User Forum → ADI-2 & 2/4 Pro series, ADI-2 DAC series → ADI-2 DAC fs usb/coax implementation
Posts: 13
- Sebastian.Athea
- AES/EBU artist
- Offline
2 2023-04-27 23:50:28 (edited by KaiS 2023-04-28 10:01:31)
Re: ADI-2 DAC fs usb/coax implementation
No, only the “Pro’s” AES are transformer coupled.
- Sebastian.Athea
- AES/EBU artist
- Offline
Re: ADI-2 DAC fs usb/coax implementation
So optocoupler for the coax and usb?
- MC
- Administrator
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Re: ADI-2 DAC fs usb/coax implementation
Not at all.
Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME
Matthias Carstens
RME
- Sebastian.Athea
- AES/EBU artist
- Offline
Re: ADI-2 DAC fs usb/coax implementation
MC wrote:
Not at all.
Hi MC, if it's not a problem can you explain how are the signals from coax and usb handled?
Re: ADI-2 DAC fs usb/coax implementation
If your heading for ground isolation -
USB and Coax connection have their ground / shield linked to chassis and common ground.
If, for some reason like using ADI-2 as frontend for critical measurements, you might need to use Optical and/or an USB isolator.
7 2023-04-28 13:49:02 (edited by Sebastian.Athea 2023-04-28 13:49:15)
- Sebastian.Athea
- AES/EBU artist
- Offline
Re: ADI-2 DAC fs usb/coax implementation
KaiS wrote:
If your heading for ground isolation -
USB and Coax connection have their ground / shield linked to chassis and common ground.If, for some reason like using ADI-2 as frontend for critical measurements, you might need to use Optical and/or an USB isolator.
Yes. Any recommendations for usb isolator?
8 2023-04-28 15:19:29 (edited by KaiS 2023-04-28 15:24:43)
Re: ADI-2 DAC fs usb/coax implementation
Sebastian.Athea wrote:
KaiS wrote:If, for some reason like using ADI-2 as frontend for critical measurements, you might need to use Optical and/or an USB isolator.
Yes. Any recommendations for usb isolator?
I have no personal experience with any.
Seems, a setup including one needs to be handled a bit with care.
The ground elimination even prevents the necessary discharging of inter-device high voltages, specially during the plugging process of the USB-cable.
There are reports of broken devices when you read through comments.
Loads of $20 offerings with mixed review results exist.
The KGUSS Topping HS02 USB2.0 Audio Isolator at least is from a company with some reputation in audio:
https://www.amazon.de/KGUSS-widersteht- … &psc=1
A very valid and completely safe, albeit more costly option would be, inserting an RME Digiface USB and run optical.
- Sebastian.Athea
- AES/EBU artist
- Offline
Re: ADI-2 DAC fs usb/coax implementation
KaiS wrote:
Sebastian.Athea wrote:KaiS wrote:If, for some reason like using ADI-2 as frontend for critical measurements, you might need to use Optical and/or an USB isolator.
Yes. Any recommendations for usb isolator?
I have no personal experience with any.
Seems, a setup including one needs to be handled a bit with care.
The ground elimination even prevents the necessary discharging of inter-device high voltages, specially during the plugging process of the USB-cable.There are reports of broken devices when you read through comments.
Loads of $20 offerings with mixed review results exist.
The KGUSS Topping HS02 USB2.0 Audio Isolator at least is from a company with some reputation in audio:
https://www.amazon.de/KGUSS-widersteht- … &psc=1
A very valid and completely safe, albeit more costly option would be, inserting an RME Digiface USB and run optical.
Thanks!
- MC
- Administrator
- Offline
Re: ADI-2 DAC fs usb/coax implementation
The Topping USB isolator is based on a new Analog Devices chip that does all the galvanic isolation between input and output while providing full USB 2 speed (480 Mbit/s). No wonder it works with all our USB 2 devices.
But Topping added a standard Mornsun DC/DC converter to also isolate the incoming DC, generating an isolated DC output. Intona does the same, but use their own, discrete solution. The result is that the Topping has 1 nF capacitive coupling between input and output (as specced for the Mornsun in its data sheet), while the (much more expensive) Intona reaches below 10 pF (100 x less) - that's a different class, obviously.
Still in normal use the Topping is sufficient and will make the typical issues in home use inaudible (ground loops and leakage current).
Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME
Matthias Carstens
RME
- Sebastian.Athea
- AES/EBU artist
- Offline
Re: ADI-2 DAC fs usb/coax implementation
MC wrote:
The Topping USB isolator is based on a new Analog Devices chip that does all the galvanic isolation between input and output while providing full USB 2 speed (480 MBit). No wonder it works with all our USB 2 devices.
But Topping added a standard Mornsun DC/DC converter to also isolate the incoming DC, generating an isolated DC output. Intona does the same, but use their own, discrete solution. The result is that the Topping has 1 nF capacitive coupling between input and output (as specced for the Mornsun in its data sheet), while the (much more expensive) Intona reaches below 10 pF (100 x less) - that's a different class, obviously.
Still in normal use the Topping is sufficient and will make the typical issues in home use inaudible (ground loops and leakage current).
I just wanted to open the thread asking the exact question you answered; Thank you MC
- Sebastian.Athea
- AES/EBU artist
- Offline
Re: ADI-2 DAC fs usb/coax implementation
I got the Topping HS02 and it lowered snr by 19db which is awesome, but on the other hand why isn't some sort of galvanic isolation present inside the device in the 1st place? I guess that not many people have it hooked up to pc loaded with 3 water cooled 250 watts GPUs but still it seams like a bit of an oversight.
13 2023-06-03 09:46:28 (edited by KaiS 2023-06-03 10:06:57)
Re: ADI-2 DAC fs usb/coax implementation
Sebastian.Athea wrote:
I got the Topping HS02 and it lowered snr by 19db which is awesome, but on the other hand why isn't some sort of galvanic isolation present inside the device in the 1st place? I guess that not many people have it hooked up to pc loaded with 3 water cooled 250 watts GPUs but still it seams like a bit of an oversight.
If you look at the price point of a well made USB isolator you have your answer.
Most people don’t face any of the problems USB isolation solves, and ADI-2 by itself is not affected by USB noise at all.
Other, much more simple solutions exist too, like using Optical connection on the digital, or balanced on the analog side.
And then there‘s is the conformity with FCC and CE rules, regarding HF interference, which is hard to impossible to meet with the USB shield not connected on both sides.
From the last page of the manual:
35. Declaration of Conformity
CE
This device has been tested and found to comply with the limits of the European Council Directive on the approximation of the laws of the member states relating to electromagnetic compatibility according to RL2014/30/EU, and European Low Voltage Directive RL2014/35/EU.
FCC
This device complies with Part 15 of the FCC Rules. Operation is subject to the following two conditions: (1) This device may not cause harmful interference, and (2) This device must accept any interference received, including interference that may cause undesired operation.
Warning: Changes or modifications to this unit not expressly approved by the party responsible for compliance could void the user's authority to operate the equipment.
Posts: 13
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