1 (edited by dr.larkos 2023-09-10 04:24:23)

Topic: ADI-2 PRO XLR (L&R) analog outputs, what type of balancing technique?

Further to my last query about XLR Balanced Inputs, as a new topic.

According to the manual, the combined XLR /TRS analog inputs are both "servo-balanced," namely, an OPAMP is used in a circuit to build a differential amp and create a balanced differential signal.

Now, regarding the analog outputs, the manual indicates that the TRS (L&R) outputs are "impedance-balanced," a circuit using resistors to create a balanced differential signal. However, the XLR (L&R) analog outputs are described simply as  non-servo, "electronically balanced" outputs. What type of electronic balancing technique is being used here, "cross-coupling" or something else?

All the best..........dr.larkos

2

Re: ADI-2 PRO XLR (L&R) analog outputs, what type of balancing technique?

Cross coupling is used for servo-balanced outputs - which the XLR are not. These are balanced outputs with a complete symmetrical output path from DAC to XLR.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: ADI-2 PRO XLR (L&R) analog outputs, what type of balancing technique?

Thank you, Matthias. 

Within your context, I gather, the term "symmetrical" is not meant as a synonym for "differential" but as a distinct word indicating a specific characteristic of the "differential" signal, namely, that the +/- components of the "differential signal" are in phase: no phase errors, to the extent physically possible, all through the complete output path from DAC to XLR male connector. Am I correct?

Cheers......dr.larkos

4 (edited by KaiS 2023-09-11 07:14:41)

Re: ADI-2 PRO XLR (L&R) analog outputs, what type of balancing technique?

dr.larkos wrote:

Within your context, I gather, the term "symmetrical" is not meant as a synonym for "differential" but as a distinct word indicating a specific characteristic of the "differential" signal, namely, that the +/- components of the "differential signal" are in phase: no phase errors, to the extent physically possible, all through the complete output path from DAC to XLR male connector. Am I correct?

Like the vast majority of DAC-chips, the ones used in the ADI-2 series all put out a symmetrical, balanced signal, hence an in-phase (+) AND out-phase (–) signal.

These two signals are both transferred completely independent and identical through ADI-2’s analog processings, the Reference Level switching and output buffer, to the XLR outs.

The result is a fully symmetrical, electronically balanced output with pin 2 / (+) and pin 3 / (–) carrying an active anti-phase to each other signal.

According to @MC’s posting there‘s a internal circuit that removes common mode noise from the DAC:
https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.ph … 13#p149113

The output is NOT servo-symetric, if one polarity is shorted to ground the other polarity is NOT boosted by factor 2.
Therefore neither pin 3 (nor pin 2) should be connected to ground when used unbalanced, as this signal shortcut has slight detrimental effects.


The rear TRSs present impedance-balanced outputs.

Only the (+) / Tip contact carries an active signal.
The (–) / Ring contact is connected to ground through a resistor equal to the (+)’s impedance.
This way the TRS can be connected to unbalanced inputs without further measures, e.g. with a simple TS-cable.
Connection to a balanced input with balanced cables keeps the possible noise suppression advantages of this type interconnects.

5 (edited by ramses 2023-09-11 07:07:17)

Re: ADI-2 PRO XLR (L&R) analog outputs, what type of balancing technique?

@waedi (oh, now he deleted his posting, nevertheless ..)

That is precisely one of the main benefits of a balanced connection, the differential circuit/amplifier. You take the signal in different polarity, "+" and "-" (0°, 180° polarity) if there should be any differences, this is the interference that is filtered out by this circuit. The other benefit is the higher level, which also enables to use longer cables in the studio or on stage.

Google gives a lot of hits, here in easy words: https://www.soundguys.com/balanced-vs-u … ons-60085/

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14

Re: ADI-2 PRO XLR (L&R) analog outputs, what type of balancing technique?

Thank you, guys, all seems to make sense now.

Be well...............dr.larkos