1 Topic by GeometryGod (edited by GeometryGod 2023-11-24 18:41:10)

  • Registered: 2022-12-17
  • Posts: 63

Topic: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

After dealing with dropouts for nearly two months, I decided to do a clean install of Sonoma, and restore all of my data from a time machine backup. Part of my reason for doing a clean install of Sonoma is hearing how some M1 users seemingly had no issues with dropouts. I also noticed the "Macintosh HD-Data" portion of my drive in Disk Utility would not complete a first aid scan without reporting errors (even when booted into recovery mode). Once I saw this, I thought it might be possible that the dropouts were correlated (although this seemed like a long shot).

I'm happy to report that the dropouts seem to have been greatly reduced after the clean install. I do get occasional quick stutters when opening two audio programs, or switching between displays, etc... but none of these are intrusive at all. Before I used to get stutters at least once every 15-30 minutes just listening to audio, or making music.

I am left happy that my amazing UFX III interface is working now, but feeling disappointed that after several attempts at contacting customer support over nearly two months I didn't get a single reply. RME is widely renowned for their customer support, but that was not my experience here. I spent countless hours troubleshooting on my own, and also was in contact with Synthax who kindly helped give me some ideas of things to try. I am writing this to hopefully help someone who is struggling with this issue with dropouts - no guarantees, but it worked for me.


---

My Original Issue (Now Solved)

Issue:
-I am having dropouts, stutters, glitches using my UFX III
-I noticed these dropouts after installing Mac OS Sonoma

Specs:
-2021 MacBook Pro M1 Max
-Firmware v20
-Driver 4.09

Things I've tried:
-Restarted my laptop
-Disabled Mac from entering sleep mode
-Unplugged all other USB devices, plugging in only the UFX III with the USB C cable included in the box directly into my MacBook pro - dropouts, glitches, stutters still occur.
-Tried a second USB C cable - plugged directly in to my laptop, with no other usb devices connected - still dropouts.

When these dropouts/stutters occur, I am simply only running Spotify / YouTube, with no cpu intensive programs running alongside.

2 Reply by ax

  • ax
  • ADAT user
  • Offline
  • Registered: 2023-11-27
  • Posts: 12

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Hey!

Thank you for sharing your experience. I just got a brand new UFX III and I'm experiencing the same issues on my MacBook Pro M1 Pro.

Trying to understand why the clean install fixed your issue: what driver did you install after the clean install on macOS Sonoma? The kernel extension driver or the DriverKit driver? Or both?

I might have installed both when setting up the UFX III -- and I think that the issue might be linked to having both drivers. Would love to know which one is working without any issues with Sonoma.

Thanks!!!

3 Reply by ax

  • ax
  • ADAT user
  • Offline
  • Registered: 2023-11-27
  • Posts: 12

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

OK so after doing some digging, I think that I found the issue: installing both the kernel extension driver and the DriverKit driver is indeed messing up the installation.

I did get this error in the first place when installing both drivers: https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=37074. But then it got away, not sure how exactly. But the thing is: it looks like the kernel extension wasn't properly removed. This post: https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.ph … 40#p209440 actually made me think that.

So I'm sharing it here again for visibility. If you installed both drivers, instead of doing a clean install of your Mac, you can "clean" your kernel extensions:

Clear staged KEXTs with command: 

sudo kmutil clear-staging

Shutdown
Boot into Recovery Options (On M1, hold down power button while booting)
Launch Terminal
Reset the KEXT system with command: 

kmutil trigger-panic-medic --volume-root /Volumes/Macintosh\ HD/

  (Or whatever your startup disk is called)
Restart

I'm a software engineer and I've already built a Hackintosh so I know what I'm doing, but this is clearly a bad user experience for regular Mac users using the Fireface.

If someone on the RME team reads this: please improve the manual and the drivers download page. They are really misleading and it's not clear what is the preferred driver. And I think that you should also include a guide for removing the kernel extension if you know that newer macOS versions are not removing it properly via the DriverKit installer.

  • Registered: 2022-12-17
  • Posts: 63

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

ax wrote:

Hey!

Thank you for sharing your experience. I just got a brand new UFX III and I'm experiencing the same issues on my MacBook Pro M1 Pro.

Trying to understand why the clean install fixed your issue: what driver did you install after the clean install on macOS Sonoma? The kernel extension driver or the DriverKit driver? Or both?

I might have installed both when setting up the UFX III -- and I think that the issue might be linked to having both drivers. Would love to know which one is working without any issues with Sonoma.

Thanks!!!

I first tried the kernel extension and it worked fine. Then I installed the DriverKit.

I got the error about concurrent extensions installed, so I went through the process of disabling then re enabling SIP, and that deleted the original kernel extension.

Here's the post explaining how to fix the concurrent installed extensions: https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=37074

After installing 4.09 and cleaning the concurrent kernel, everything seems to work fine. It's now been several days with none of the same dropout behavior as before.

Another note: my UFX III is directly connected to a CalDigit TB3 hub.

  • Registered: 2022-12-17
  • Posts: 63

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

ax wrote:

OK so after doing some digging, I think that I found the issue: installing both the kernel extension driver and the DriverKit driver is indeed messing up the installation.

I did get this error in the first place when installing both drivers: https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=37074. But then it got away, not sure how exactly. But the thing is: it looks like the kernel extension wasn't properly removed. This post: https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.ph … 40#p209440 actually made me think that.

So I'm sharing it here again for visibility. If you installed both drivers, instead of doing a clean install of your Mac, you can "clean" your kernel extensions:

Clear staged KEXTs with command: 

sudo kmutil clear-staging

Shutdown
Boot into Recovery Options (On M1, hold down power button while booting)
Launch Terminal
Reset the KEXT system with command: 

kmutil trigger-panic-medic --volume-root /Volumes/Macintosh\ HD/

  (Or whatever your startup disk is called)
Restart

I'm a software engineer and I've already built a Hackintosh so I know what I'm doing, but this is clearly a bad user experience for regular Mac users using the Fireface.

If someone on the RME team reads this: please improve the manual and the drivers download page. They are really misleading and it's not clear what is the preferred driver. And I think that you should also include a guide for removing the kernel extension if you know that newer macOS versions are not removing it properly via the DriverKit installer.

I didn't see this as I was typing my reply. Thank you for sharing!

6 Reply by ax

  • ax
  • ADAT user
  • Offline
  • Registered: 2023-11-27
  • Posts: 12

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

We posted at the same time :)

Thanks for sharing the details. So yeah this is exactly the same issue. I figured it out myself earlier today and I've been playing music for more than 2 hours without issues, so this is the fix. RME, you know what to do!

7 Reply by GeometryGod (edited by GeometryGod 2023-11-27 17:55:23)

  • Registered: 2022-12-17
  • Posts: 63

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

ax wrote:

We posted at the same time smile

Thanks for sharing the details. So yeah this is exactly the same issue. I figured it out myself earlier today and I've been playing music for more than 2 hours without issues, so this is the fix. RME, you know what to do!

Wish I saw this last week - lol

8 Reply by ax

  • ax
  • ADAT user
  • Offline
  • Registered: 2023-11-27
  • Posts: 12

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

I feel you. Definitely a super annoying issue for this kind of high-end product. But I'm glad it's fixed for both of us now. Hopefully this post helps more people too.

Have a good one!

  • Registered: 2023-12-08
  • Posts: 6

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Just stumbled across this post. I have been experiencing occasional dropouts of audio too, with M1 and Fireface UFX III. This is with more than one laptop, and part of a much larger touring system, so tracking down the issue has been tricky. I will follow the advice you guys have posted here and will report back. Thanks for documenting your experiences!

  • Registered: 2023-12-08
  • Posts: 6

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

An update: I'm running 2 MacBook Pro laptops at the moment, both with macOS 13.2.1 and M2 chips. Both have Fireface UFX III interfaces connected.

Both had the v4.09 driver installed, and both experienced occasional dropouts of audio (around a second of silence).

I have installed v3.82B on one of the laptops, set up a continuous sine wave tone on one of the analog outputs, and have recorded the results. I've uploaded an image of the dropout here: https://ibb.co/RB9KFJD

You can see that there is a glitch in the sine wave 2 times before the dropout occurs.

I'm still unsure which driver is the correct one to be using, and of course installing v3.82B without uninstalling v4.09 may be contributing to the problem - I don't know. The RME website is not at all clear about which driver should be used - of the 3 available drivers, the second one specifically says it's for M1/2 Macs. The third one says "M1 user please download macOS 11 and up USB Series Driver" but this does not make it clear which of the other 2 drivers it actually means!

Do you guys have any advice on which driver should be used? I assume that the best course of action will be to remove ALL RME related software, drivers, preferences etc and start again, but I don't want to do that until I know that I'm installing the correct driver.

Thank you!

  • waedi
  • DAW Mastermind
  • Online
  • From: Swiss Zürich
  • Registered: 2020-12-08
  • Posts: 4,524

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Post 3 and 4 in this thread are interesting and may be the medicine for you.
Cleaning the 328 driver completely out of the computer and then install the 409.

M1-Sequoia, Madiface Pro, Digiface USB, Babyface silver and blue
  • Registered: 2023-12-08
  • Posts: 6

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Thank you - the confusing thing is that I did previously have 4.08 installed and I got the dropouts. However I'm fairly sure that I didn't do the first step of booting into Recovery mode and changing the security settings (because of course it doesn't mention doing that on the page where you download the drivers!). So maybe that contributed to the problem.

I will try this when I'm back in the rehearsal studio on Monday.

  • Registered: 2023-12-08
  • Posts: 6

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Ok, here we are again... Thoughts I've had over the weekend:

- Although I never booted into Recovery mode to change the security settings, this should be unnecessary for me, as that is only related to the kernel extension driver, correct?
- Prior to post 10 in this thread, I had only installed v4.08 - I then did install v3.82B as clearly v4.08 wasn't working.
- I had not flashed the firmware of the RME units to the latest versions

So, things I've done this morning, on one laptop and interface:

- Followed the steps in post 3 of this thread, and removed v3.82B
- Flashed the firmware of the interface to the latest versions
- Installed v4.09

I'm now running the sine wave test and will keep you posted.

14 Reply by stylesforfree (edited by stylesforfree 2023-12-11 18:29:45)

  • Registered: 2023-12-11
  • Posts: 1

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Hmmm, sounds worrying. I have a UFX II and I have been looking at getting a new mac laptop but for now I think i'll stick to windows.

I went through all these issues a few years back when I got my windows PC and spent a fair bit of time tweaking things to eliminate the dropouts and glitches. I was hoping this wouldn't be the case with a mac.

Maybe I should spring for a new old stock intel mac laptop?

  • Registered: 2023-12-11
  • Posts: 8

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Good evening RME Forum,

I too am now having this issue. I recently installed all my DAW software and literally hundreds of plugins on my MacBook Pro M1 Max including my RME Fireface UC.

Everything was running perfectly and it was smoking my self-built, but aging Windows PC.

Then....
Stutters and dropouts.

Now I can't get anything accomplished. I thought I was done being a computer geek after switching from Windows but lately I've been trying all these procedures with NO resolution.

Whats even more frustrating is I thought I solved it by deleting an old audio driver from an older Yamaha driver. It was running smooth again for a couple of days and then BAM. It's back to glitching audio out of the blue.

Are there any new developements?

I was soooo close to producer nirvana sad

16 Reply by ss

  • ss
  • ADAT user
  • Offline
  • Registered: 2023-08-28
  • Posts: 25

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

stevencowley wrote:

Ok, here we are again... Thoughts I've had over the weekend:

- Although I never booted into Recovery mode to change the security settings, this should be unnecessary for me, as that is only related to the kernel extension driver, correct?
- Prior to post 10 in this thread, I had only installed v4.08 - I then did install v3.82B as clearly v4.08 wasn't working.
- I had not flashed the firmware of the RME units to the latest versions

So, things I've done this morning, on one laptop and interface:

- Followed the steps in post 3 of this thread, and removed v3.82B
- Flashed the firmware of the interface to the latest versions
- Installed v4.09

I'm now running the sine wave test and will keep you posted.

Have you done all of this after a clean install?

I’m about to upgrade to Sonoma to see if it fixes my problem, and if not then a clean install is next on the list.

Did we get confirmation WHICH driver is best to use for a clean Sonoma install?

  • Registered: 2023-12-08
  • Posts: 6

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

ss wrote:
stevencowley wrote:

Ok, here we are again... Thoughts I've had over the weekend:

- Although I never booted into Recovery mode to change the security settings, this should be unnecessary for me, as that is only related to the kernel extension driver, correct?
- Prior to post 10 in this thread, I had only installed v4.08 - I then did install v3.82B as clearly v4.08 wasn't working.
- I had not flashed the firmware of the RME units to the latest versions

So, things I've done this morning, on one laptop and interface:

- Followed the steps in post 3 of this thread, and removed v3.82B
- Flashed the firmware of the interface to the latest versions
- Installed v4.09

I'm now running the sine wave test and will keep you posted.

Have you done all of this after a clean install?

I’m about to upgrade to Sonoma to see if it fixes my problem, and if not then a clean install is next on the list.

Did we get confirmation WHICH driver is best to use for a clean Sonoma install?

In answer to your questions:

I didn't do a clean install, no - I might consider doing this if I get more dropouts.

I'm running Ventura 13.2.1, and if I do a clean install then I might try to roll back to Mavericks.

Let me know how it goes with Sonoma - tbh I'd be nervous about trying a newer OS but you never know!

Post 11 in this thread suggests installing driver 4.09, but I don't know whether that's the official guidance from RME or not, as the info on the website is so vague.

And for extra info:

I've been recording sine wave outputs from 3 of my laptops - two of these are running 4.09, with firmware on the interfaces updated to v20. The third is running 4.08, with the firmware on the interface still at v15. Annoyingly, there have been no dropouts in the 2 days I've been testing. I was hoping that I'd see dropouts on the v15 unit, and that would give me some confidence that v20 is solid.

The advice I've had from the UK distributor is that the interface should be connected directly to the laptop, rather than via a hub. I guess that removes one variable from the system.

All I can do at this stage is continue testing and see what happens. Life is incredibly busy but I'll report back when I'm able to.

  • Registered: 2023-12-08
  • Posts: 6

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Taisoul wrote:

Good evening RME Forum,

I too am now having this issue. I recently installed all my DAW software and literally hundreds of plugins on my MacBook Pro M1 Max including my RME Fireface UC.

Everything was running perfectly and it was smoking my self-built, but aging Windows PC.

Then....
Stutters and dropouts.

Now I can't get anything accomplished. I thought I was done being a computer geek after switching from Windows but lately I've been trying all these procedures with NO resolution.

Whats even more frustrating is I thought I solved it by deleting an old audio driver from an older Yamaha driver. It was running smooth again for a couple of days and then BAM. It's back to glitching audio out of the blue.

Are there any new developements?

I was soooo close to producer nirvana sad

I feel your pain. We'll get it sorted somehow, I hope. What OS/firmware are you running?

19 Reply by dimundsareforever (edited by dimundsareforever 2023-12-30 17:00:50)

  • Registered: 2023-12-22
  • Posts: 1

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Just wanted to share my experience with this. I have a UFX III running the kernel drivers on Sonoma on an M1 Max Mac Studio. I was having dropouts and glitches like those described here every 3 - 5 minutes or so. Incredibly frustrating. Clearing all of my kernel extensions out didn't completely resolve the issue, but it improved things dramatically. I had a version of ACE running on the kernel side from a previous installation of Loopback. Removing that cleared things up quite a bit, but I still have issues periodically. I hope RME can address this since I would imagine a lot of us are probably running our cards on the new Apple Silicon boxes. I would highly recommend to anyone using the RME kernel drivers to not have any other kernel extensions running on their system.

UPDATE: I got pretty frustrated with this, especially since it didn't fully resolve, and it was causing skips when recording sad I went ahead and uninstalled the kernel drivers, installed the driverkit drivers, and the issue is gone. Latency and clocking with driverkit seems pretty rock solid and I'm not experiencing any dropouts at this point, so my recommendation is to use driverkit instead of kernel.

Tossing in some keywords to help surface this better in Google search:

Mac OS Sonoma RME UFX 3 UFX III audio glitch pop crackle dropout loopback ableton sonarworks reference 4 soundid

20 Reply by ax

  • ax
  • ADAT user
  • Offline
  • Registered: 2023-11-27
  • Posts: 12

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Hey!

Coming back here to hopefully save someone some trouble. I was still experiencing some drop-outs from time to time. I'm now using a USB 2 cable instead of the USB 3 cable included in the box and it's (finally) working perfectly!

I don't need too many channels for now so USB 2 works for me, but it would be cool if RME and Apple figured this out smile

  • Registered: 2024-05-03
  • Posts: 1

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

My MacMini M2 (Sonoma 14.4.1) with UFX III was having the same stutter/dropout issue and the solution in my case appears to have been to simply reseat the USB3 cable on the Mac mini side.  I'm having a hard time believing that it worked, but it really seems to have completely fixed this issue that started happening a few weeks ago and was getting worse.

22 Reply by oudman (edited by oudman 2024-05-07 19:54:40)

  • Registered: 2024-05-07
  • Posts: 6

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Hi All

1 How do I check to see if I am running my UFX with the Kernal Driver or the newer driverkit and to make sure that I did not unintentionally install bot?


2 how do I uninstall the "wrong" driver and try the "right" driver?

Back ground:

I think I am having this same problem that is described in this thread.  A couple of months ago I set up a new MAC Studio M1 with Ventura 13.6.4
and my old Fireface UFX that previously worked fine on W10.


When setting up this new machine I read all the articles on kernel vs driverkit, but now that I have a problem I don't remember which one I choose to install. 

Everything worked fine but I did not have a chance to do any production so by worked fine I mean that play back in consumer apps was fine, until a couple of days ago when I started to experience drop outs in Spotify.

then I had to record something last night  for this first time with my new set up.

In each roughly 2.5-  3.5 minute take I experienced 1-3 instances of a weird digital noise like  BBBBBBZZZZT followed by a very brief ( but problematic) silence in the recording.

I was recording a video direct into Quick time with a mic connected via an external preamp to my UFX.

I did a test and experienced the sam problem when recording audio only into Garage Band.

I have rebooted the RME, and the following take after reboot was still a problem.

A trusted and very experienced audio engineer friend suggested ( before this problem) that I stick with Ventura and not upgrade to Sonoma. SO I am also looking for a second opinion on that.  Y instinct is to try to sort through this kernel driver or driver set issue first.


EDIT: after rereading some instructions I think ( but not %100 sure that I installed the Kernal driver)

23 Reply by waedi (edited by waedi 2024-05-07 23:39:24)

  • waedi
  • DAW Mastermind
  • Online
  • From: Swiss Zürich
  • Registered: 2020-12-08
  • Posts: 4,524

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Open the Fireface Settings, top right it shows the driver version
Depending on the interface it may be Madiface Settings

Just install the driver you want, it will erase the other, checking afterwards in the Settings

https://i.ibb.co/v47LgKT/Bildschirmfoto-2024-05-08-um-00-35-26.png

M1-Sequoia, Madiface Pro, Digiface USB, Babyface silver and blue
  • Registered: 2024-05-07
  • Posts: 6

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Thanks for that waedi - I have version 3.31 so that is the Kernel.

I have read in other threads about people having all kinds of problems b/c they inadvertently installed and had both types of drivers running.

but you are saying the new Driverkit one uninstalls the old Kernal extension one?

What am I missing here?

  • waedi
  • DAW Mastermind
  • Online
  • From: Swiss Zürich
  • Registered: 2020-12-08
  • Posts: 4,524

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

The readme text file in the driver zip folder explains all :

To go back to a Kernel Extension driver 3.x: The latest version 3.31 contains an advanced installer that safely removes the DriverKit driver. However, this can also be done manually: simply drag the Fireface USB Settings app found in the folder Applications to the trash can - only use the Finder for this action. With DriverKit this Settings dialog is a complete package, upon removal all driver files belonging to it will also be removed automatically. You will be asked for permission for the removal of the extensions (yes). If done simply install driver 3.x.

M1-Sequoia, Madiface Pro, Digiface USB, Babyface silver and blue
  • Registered: 2024-05-07
  • Posts: 6

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Thanks again for clarification waedi, do I understand correctly that if I am on driver version 3.31 that I have the Kernal driver and that if I am experiencing audio drop outs when recording I should try the driver kit?

And installing the driver kit does overwrite the kernel or I should move the Kernel to trash as you described before installing the Driver Kit?

Thanks again

  • waedi
  • DAW Mastermind
  • Online
  • From: Swiss Zürich
  • Registered: 2020-12-08
  • Posts: 4,524

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

I can't say "you should", I would try it.
From what i remember reading in the forum the new DK does delete the old Kext, I would try just install then check the driver version in the Fireface Settings, if needed then manually erase is still possible.

M1-Sequoia, Madiface Pro, Digiface USB, Babyface silver and blue

28 Reply by MC

  • MC
  • MC
  • Administrator
  • Offline
  • From: Germany/Thailand
  • Registered: 2007-04-06
  • Posts: 25,582

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

oudman wrote:

And installing the driver kit does overwrite the kernel or I should move the Kernel to trash as you described before installing the Driver Kit?

Read again. The text describes removing the DriverKit driver. You can not uninstall the Kernel Driver this way. That's why the DK driver installer will do that - also described in the driver readme.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

MC's Website

29 Reply by drmikecooper (edited by drmikecooper 2024-09-17 08:24:13)

  • Registered: 2024-09-17
  • Posts: 1

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Just to add to this discussion as a new RME user - I bought the RME Fireface UFX III recently and was getting occasional audio lags/stutters using the latest driver kit drivers. I have switched to a USB 2 cable and the issue is now resolved. Thanks to Ax for this suggestion, otherwise I would have felt rather let down after switching from MOTU which worked flawlessly. Hopefully this can be fixed soon in a driver update.

Running an M2 MacBook Pro with Sonoma

  • Registered: 2024-08-28
  • Posts: 3

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Hi, I’m forwarding an email from RME.

Here is a response I just sent to Sweetwater yesterday about the same complaints:

Some of the Apple Silicon systems have problems with USB audio playback (not recording). It's not anything to do with RME in particular, the dropouts are happening on any USB interface on an affected Mac. There seems to be a relationship between the memory pressure and the dropouts, you will see the problem when memory pressure hits 60%. Browsers like Safari and Chrome are memory hogs so these apps can trigger the problem pretty quickly.

Here is an early thread where the issue was discovered, this is primarily about USB DACs that work class compliant (no driver) so it was clear right away that this is an Apple bug between the Mac OS and the hardware. Intel based Macs are NOT affected.

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/foru … pro.42001/

It's pretty alarming that Apple has not solved this yet, and in fact continues to avoid commenting on the problems on the Apple support pages.

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/25 … ortBy=rank

RME has released an update of the classic kernel extension driver (v3.33) to add a "large" safety buffer option. This will allow a little extra time for the driver to rebuild the stream and cover up most of the dropouts, but really it's just a band-aid until Apple figures out what is going wrong.

Not every Apple Silicon system is showing the problem, but on computers that do have this issue, the only solutions are keeping memory pressure below 60%, restarting regularly, or switching to a Thunderbolt interface. Only USB2 and USB3 interfaces are affected by this issue.

Thanks,
Jeff Petersen
Technical Support

  • ramses
  • DAW Mastermind
  • Offline
  • From: UTC+1
  • Registered: 2012-10-14
  • Posts: 13,183

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

That was also my assumption that it has to do with Apple's memory management over 1y ago.

https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.ph … 70#p204570

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14
  • Kubrak
  • DAW Mastermind
  • Offline
  • Registered: 2023-08-03
  • Posts: 548

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

I do not know what memory pressure exactly means on Macs, but for sure swapping RAM to SSD may cause audio dropouts. Mainly if audio SW needs to read the same SSD.  I have used to have dropouts on Win when using too much virtual RAM. Even buffer over 4000 samples did not help much....

  • From: uk
  • Registered: 2023-07-23
  • Posts: 31

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Kubrak wrote:

I do not know what memory pressure exactly means on Macs, but for sure swapping RAM to SSD may cause audio dropouts. Mainly if audio SW needs to read the same SSD.  I have used to have dropouts on Win when using too much virtual RAM. Even buffer over 4000 samples did not help much....

It's not the same thing. This issue has a few variables (IO controller, macOS kext vs DriverKit scheduling, device USB ports, even cable used), and those are not necessarily in the interplay you've described. Instead (and as was in my case) it's perfectly possible for a device with high transfer speeds to flood the system enough to deprioritise the audio stream. I've experienced this on good hardware with plenty of resource availability.

Fireface UCX, Focusrite OctoPre, Sound Devices MixPre-D, Mac Studio M2 max, macOS Sonoma
  • Kubrak
  • DAW Mastermind
  • Offline
  • Registered: 2023-08-03
  • Posts: 548

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

OK, but one should use audiointerface on its own USB controller, so that that controller is not used by other USB devices. Notebooks with just few USB sockets may even lack such USB socket.....

But yes, you are right that there may be much more reasons for problems than just lack of suffitient RAM size.

  • Registered: 2024-05-07
  • Posts: 6

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

I have been experiencing audio dropouts consistently since this last post back in May, I have not had time to deal with it as I was only recording rough demos - nothing mission critical.    Since updating to 4.1 I consistently get the error message "   

Concurrently running RME USB Kernel Extension detected! Please try to reboot computer. If this message persists, disable 3rd party Kernel extensions in security policy!"

I had thought that installing driver 4.1 was supposed to remove the kernel extension?  so I am confused that I keep getting this error message.

  • Registered: 2024-05-07
  • Posts: 6

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

update : When I updated my OS this AM I thought it was to Sonoma, I did not realize until after that it went to Sequoia.

I hope all my stuff works.

I have a Time Machine of Ventura if I need to roll back but how would I update to Sonoma rather than Sequoia if that proves to be too new?

37 Reply by MC

  • MC
  • MC
  • Administrator
  • Offline
  • From: Germany/Thailand
  • Registered: 2007-04-06
  • Posts: 25,582

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Installing the later drivers like 4.16 will start the kernel removal process with blind typing of your password. Most probably that went wrong.

An alternative is to set security back to standard and reboot. This will remove all kernel extensions. If you have other than ours that you need (that also require lower security) they need to be reinstalled and security set to low again.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

MC's Website

  • Registered: 2024-05-07
  • Posts: 6

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Hi Mathias

Thanks for responding so quickly:  Can you please clarify:
I dont know what you mean by " blind typing of your password" .  If installing 4.16 did not remove kernels - how di I fix it?

How do I determine if I might have other needed Kernal extensions from other software makers?

Thanks

  • Registered: 2023-11-16
  • Posts: 31

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

This seems like the same issue I am experiencing. I once had the "bzzzzzt" noise, but then I had a Watson battery charger connected to USB-C. I haven't had this since.

But every session I do, I have at least one dropout of about 0,33 seconds. Sometimes the timing is affected, and sometimes there is a click before it.

Also while monitoring, sometimes the yellow mic icon flashes.

M1 Max / Sonoma 14.6.1 / 64 GB RAM / 800 GB free internal SSD space

  • Registered: 2023-11-16
  • Posts: 31

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

Also - I am using driver v4.16 and v20 firmware already.

In a session 2 days ago I had more dropouts, one preceded by a click.

What else can I try? RME support suggested doing some test recordings but I'm not sure what the end goal of that is.

  • Muffin
  • S/Mux specialist
  • Offline
  • Registered: 2021-12-26
  • Posts: 193

Re: How I fixed my UFX III M1 Max stutters / dropouts / glitches

lsanbourne wrote:

Also - I am using driver v4.16 and v20 firmware already.

In a session 2 days ago I had more dropouts, one preceded by a click.

What else can I try? RME support suggested doing some test recordings but I'm not sure what the end goal of that is.

Work with RME support as they try to help you with your issue, obviously. Their end goal is to help you but if you don't understand why they ask you to do something then just ask them to explain it to you!