1 Topic by jmimac351 (edited by jmimac351 2024-02-22 02:07:29)

  • From: Central Florida, USA
  • Registered: 2024-01-21
  • Posts: 33

Topic: DACapalooza 2024...

So... I am on a quest to find "The DAC".  I think I have found "The DAC".  A friend of mine also has an RME unit (ADI-2 Pro) and turned me onto the RME unit as an option.  We're both very impressed with it and talk about it having "some sort of Magic..."

I have 7 DACs right now.  They range from very little to quite a bit of money.  2 of them in this picture are AKM4493 DACs --> RME ADI-2 DAC FS and Schiit Audio Modius.  Not pictured here is a TEAC UD-505 with AKM4497.  I have not heard it, yet.

All of these DACs sound "Good".  The RME, however, has a different quality to it.  More Dynamic... more "Juice"... more "Presence".

My friend and I have discussed this and we can't quite put our finger on it.  I told him that I think it may be the "Auto Reference Level" feature.  I sent him a description of what it's doing.  He responded by saying:

"That seems pretty German and I don't really understand it, but I know it sounds good!" smile

I am trying to find an even simpler explanation for it... assuming that is indeed the main reason for "The Magic". 

Whatever is going on... we like it.

https://photos.smugmug.com/Other/Miscellaneous-Audio/i-GWPf483/0/DNtkBs38dr9B7DVmmSStqLNnsFwPFvWqk93Qp85C2/L/IMG_8572-L.jpg

  • Registered: 2021-07-25
  • Posts: 19

Re: DACapalooza 2024...

Do you have the loudness feature enabled?  To me, that is one of the best things for someone that listens to music in the background or generally at lower volume levels. The RME DACs are amazing for this alone.

3 Reply by KaiS (edited by KaiS 2024-02-22 03:05:57)

  • KaiS
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Re: DACapalooza 2024...

Auto Ref Level is indeed doing something “German”:

Instead of being satisfied with the “Good Enough Quality” of the DAC chip, Auto Ref Level preserves this quality over an additional dynamic range of ca. 20 dB.

So, even if you dial down the Digital Volume control by 20 dB, you still get 100% of each DAC chips dynamic range and resolution.


Another “German” feature:

Even though ADI-2 is extremely versatile, this versatility is not on cost of audio quality.
The DSP based structure of ADI-2 is as short-pathed as possible.
No additional sound degrading analog audio components like capacitors or analog volume controls in the signal path.

KaiS's Website

  • From: Central Florida, USA
  • Registered: 2024-01-21
  • Posts: 33

Re: DACapalooza 2024...

KaiS wrote:

Auto Ref Level is indeed doing something “German”:

Instead of being satisfied with the “Good Enough Quality” of the DAC chip, Auto Ref Level preserves this quality over an additional dynamic range of ca. 20 dB.

So, even if you dial down the Digital Volume control by 20 dB, you still get 100% of each DAC chips dynamic range and resolution.


Another “German” feature:

Even though ADI-2 is extremely versatile, this versatility is not on cost of audio quality.
The DSP based structure of ADI-2 is as short-pathed as possible.
No additional sound degrading analog audio components like capacitors or analog volume controls in the signal path.

Thanks Kai!  I hope you understand the comment was made most endearingly! smile  Perhaps an example of the amount of detail available for the product that can take some effort to process / understand.

I am switching between the units in Real Time, while the music is playing.  Each of the non-RME units are about what many are used to hearing, I suppose.  When the RME unit is selected, it immediately adds "punch"... dynamics.  It's one thing to read the words about that feature, but while doing these real time comparisons, it's become quite another to experience the difference with real time switching.  It's so remarkably, obviously better...

I think the non-RME units are such that people can get accustomed to the way they sound and become their "new normal".  And if it's what you've become accustomed to experiencing and have never heard the difference, you just don't know any better.

I've never experienced / heard of this sort of thing and it seems odd that others aren't doing it.  I assume the feature isn't proprietary.

I am still looking for an ADI-2 Pro R BE. smile

  • From: Central Florida, USA
  • Registered: 2024-01-21
  • Posts: 33

Re: DACapalooza 2024...

crazybaby wrote:

Do you have the loudness feature enabled?  To me, that is one of the best things for someone that listens to music in the background or generally at lower volume levels. The RME DACs are amazing for this alone.

I do not normally, but I have used the Loudness feature and it is excellent.

6 Reply by jmimac351 (edited by jmimac351 2024-02-24 10:54:05)

  • From: Central Florida, USA
  • Registered: 2024-01-21
  • Posts: 33

Re: DACapalooza 2024...

A few thoughts from listening to these various DACs... in case it's of interest / helpful to others.

1) The Schiit Yggdrasil sounded very nice, but had a mechanical transformer hum that I could hear 12' away.  It was just shipped back yesterday.

2) The conversation / thoughts I've seen about AKM4493 vs ESS DAC chips.  My Ayre QB-9 Twenty DAC uses the ESS ES9038Q2M.  It sounds excellent.  My RME ADI-2 DAC FS. has the AKM4493. It also sounds excellent.

I sought out a used RME ADI-2 DAC FS with the AKM4493 chip, as it is well regarded, and I wanted to hear it.  After listening to 2 different, high quality DACs, each with current versions of the chips in the ADI-2 DACs (AKM4493 and ESS ES9038Q2M), I would not hesitate to opt for an ADI-2 DAC with the ESS chip option.  I believe what RME has shared regarding the excellent sonic quality between units with AKM or ESS chips being "indistinguishable". 

In fact, based on what I've experienced with my Ayre QB-9 Twenty DAC and the ESS ES9038Q2M, I have increased interest in possibly going straight for the RME ADI-2/4 Pro unit.  If it sounds as good as this in my Ayre QB-9 Twenty, I know it will sound outstanding in the RME ADI-2/4 Pro... although RME has noted that it's more about the RME technology being implemented, rather than just the chip being used. What I think I've read about expanded Auto Reference range in the ADI-2/4 Pro is of particular interest to me, and I'm trying to understand that better as it relates to my 2-channel home audio use case.

So, if you happen to be in the market for a used (or new) ADI-2 version, my advice is to buy the one that is the best deal / condition, and don't get hung up on which DAC chip is in the unit... it's going to sound great either way and you're going to be happy.

Well done @MC and RME... this stuff is awesome.

Have fun.

7 Reply by jmimac351 (edited by jmimac351 2024-02-27 12:16:37)

  • From: Central Florida, USA
  • Registered: 2024-01-21
  • Posts: 33

Re: DACapalooza 2024...

Well, yesterday I purchased an ADI-2/4 Pro. 4 months ago I'd never heard of "RME".  Now I own 2 ADI units.

This is been a revelation / learning process. 

Thank you to @mc, @kais, @ramses and many others who patiently share their thoughts, experience... and answer many of the same questions over and over again. smile These products are "a very different thing" for those who haven't been exposed to this gear.

THANK YOU.

Now I have some other equipment to sell...

This particular comment from @mc and the advice from @kais to go ahead and get something with more features than I "need" right now, because I may end up wishing I had them down the road, finally made me realize that the flexibility of these units is a HUGE advantage... and I might as well get the one with the most features. 

For instance, the reason I was even in the market for the ADI-Pro or ADI-2/4 is because I wanted the Analog In and Digital Out that my ADI-DAC does not offer.

Life is hard. smile

MC wrote:

This unit is based on many years of continued feature development of the ADI-2 Pro. We do NOT expect any major feature updates after release of the ADI-2/4 Pro SE, simply because right now it already does everything that it is supposed to do (bug fixes is a different story, of course).

Apart from that please note that 'limited run' does not mean one-time production. If there is high demand we will make more 'limited runs', so to say. Just don't expect it to be always and constantly available.

  • ramses
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Re: DACapalooza 2024...

Congrats. BTW, did you get the information that there is a remote software for easier management available?
-> ADI-2 Remote

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13
  • From: Central Florida, USA
  • Registered: 2024-01-21
  • Posts: 33

Re: DACapalooza 2024...

ramses wrote:

Congrats. BTW, did you get the information that there is a remote software for easier management available?
-> ADI-2 Remote

YES!  In fact, if that software were not available I would not be enjoying the product nearly as much as I am.  I am not sure I would have bought into the ecosystem further / as quickly without the ADI-2 Remote software.  Anyone not using ADI-2 Remote is really missing out, IMO.