• From: Central Switzerland
  • Registered: 2022-02-23
  • Posts: 29

Topic: USB Cable between Intel NUC11 Audio Streamer and ADI-2 Pro FS R Black

I used to have my Intel NUC11 Audio streamer connected with an Oehlbach USB 2.0 Cable Type A to a Type B (USB Primus B), which is an excellent quality USB Cable.

However, someone recommended me to give it a try with the EXCALIBUR Silver Edition Premium USB 2.0 cable, made/ by Supra cables, a Swedish company.

This is to my knowledge the only known USB cable which publishes detailed technical specifications of this cable. Very convincing. But what counts it the audible improvement experience.

I was and still am flabbergasted with the improvement of the musical reproduction. Really, much tighter bass/sub bass and major overall improvement of musical reproduction of the whole audible frequency range.

Please note that I have no financial interest whatsoever with this company or its distributor in my  country. I can highly recommend this USB cable. When you order it, do it under the condition, that you want to return it if you don't notice any audible improvement. I bought 2 of these USB cables with a length of 1 meter, for my two ADI-2 Pro FS R Black Editions I have in my possession.

Believe me, you will be stunned by the audible improvement. Allow the cable some burn-in time, just a few hours.

I trust this posting will not be considered as advertising. I just want to share my experiences with all owners of ADI-2. The price doesn't break the bank IMHO. It is beautifully packaged, like you would expect from Apple. But what counts is the audible improvement, it's stunning.

I hope my information finds you well.

SUPRA cables https://supracables.se/ Please note that the site is currently down for maintenance. However, you can download the spec sheet of this cable here: https://supracables.se/datasheets/en/USB-cables/, select usb-2_0-excalibur-a-b-datasheet-en.pdf

2 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2024-09-30 17:11:58)

  • ramses
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Re: USB Cable between Intel NUC11 Audio Streamer and ADI-2 Pro FS R Black

USB is transfer of digital audio data. The transfer of "zeros" and "ones".
As long as cable or plugs are not damaged any USB cable will do without any impact on sound.

You can validate this yourself by

A) keeping the MADIface driver settings window open. Then CRC checks will be performed during the transfer of digital audio data. If the CRC error counter stay at zero and are not being incremented, then you have no USB transport errors, thus all digital audio data should be 100% intact.

B) Performing the Bit test. Download the test files from RME and play them in your player. Take care, that the volume of the player is at 100% otherwise a volume change will change the bit pattern. This known bit pattern is being transferred between audio player and the ADI-2 Pro.
If the bit pattern was not altered (no data corruption took place) then you validated to have a bit perfect transmission.
Better then lossless transfer of audio data is not possible.
As a last step the D/A converter converts this digital audio data into analog data ... there you have then no zeros and ones anymore, here you have an analog waveform. At this late point in the audio chain the transport via USB has no further impact anymore. Digital data arrived unaltered / lossless and is being D/A converted.
Additionally SteadyClock FS takes care, that during the transmission of USB any potential clock jitter is being eliminated.

More is neither possible, nor required!

I know there are audiophile USB voodoo cables for over €700 for not even one meter.
But this doesn't bring you anything sound/quality wise.
I can only give you the recommendation to better save your money.

Any USB cable will do, I would only take care to get one from a company from which you know that the cable manufacturing quality is well in terms of soldering and shielding. Lindy offers good-quality cables, 3m for under €20.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14
  • From: Central Switzerland
  • Registered: 2022-02-23
  • Posts: 29

Re: USB Cable between Intel NUC11 Audio Streamer and ADI-2 Pro FS R Black

A USB cable consists of:
1 x pair of Data wires
1 x pair of Power wires

If you connect a USB Data cable (so. without power wires or disconnected power wires) and connect that to the RME DAC you won't hear anything. No "zeros" and no "ones" are transferred in the Data wires.

So, to connect to the RME DAC you need an USB cable which has both Power Wires AND Data Wires.

With all respect, I guess you may have overlooked the Power wires. And as you should know,  Electric current produces an magnetic field and as a consequence affects the flow of data in the data wires.

When these wires are very well insulated and twisted in such a way to minimize or even eliminate the magnetic influence of the magnetic field, the quality of the transfer of the "zeros" and "ones" are not affected anymore by the magnetic field.

I suggest the critical reader to give it a try to listen to music and determine yourself if you can hear the improvement.

ramses, you imply to suggest that the EXCALIBUR cable is snake oil. I agree, a lot of exotic cables indeed are supposedly snake oil. But your explanation does not suffice, it's a shot from the hip.

Give people a chance to give it a try, just like I did. Every one should have an opportunity. Don't torpedo a positive recommendation and bury it.

Do you wish me to send you such cable so you can give it a try yourself. Your ignorance will be crushed.

4 Reply by MC

  • MC
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Re: USB Cable between Intel NUC11 Audio Streamer and ADI-2 Pro FS R Black

switch6343 wrote:

A USB cable consists of:
1 x pair of Data wires
1 x pair of Power wires

If you connect a USB Data cable (so. without power wires or disconnected power wires) and connect that to the RME DAC you won't hear anything. No "zeros" and no "ones" are transferred in the Data wires.

That is as wrong as it could be. USB power (lines) is not used by our units except the Babyface Pro. One of the most often used  (but stupid and dangerous) fixes against ground loops is to disconnect the power lines and only use data. How comes that works with most units out there, not only ours?

And as we don't use the power lines except for reasonable grounding they won't change the sound. Nor does the cable as such.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

MC's Website

5 Reply by Kubrak (edited by Kubrak 2024-10-01 07:33:12)

  • Kubrak
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Re: USB Cable between Intel NUC11 Audio Streamer and ADI-2 Pro FS R Black

In case you would be right, and no you are not, data on USB discs would be massively corrupted, the data from keyboard to computer would be corrupted and so on.....

You possibly do not know, that if data become slightly corrupted, it is recognized. Small mistakes might be even corrected. Data may be resent if corrupted....And electromagnetic field may influence data wires only if it alternates, which is not the case of power wires.....

But sure, there are better and worse USB cables. The one for 5-10 EUR or so, is completely suffitient for audio data transfers.

As Ramses already pointed out, one may perform Bit Test. Compare what is sent with what is received on bit level....

  • Registered: 2023-06-30
  • Posts: 160

Re: USB Cable between Intel NUC11 Audio Streamer and ADI-2 Pro FS R Black

I think the OP should be banned. AFAIR, it's not allowed to post advertisements here, not to mention false ones.

Fireface UCX II + ARC USB > ADI-2 Pro FS R BE > Neumann KH 750 DSP + MA 1 > KH 120 A

7 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2024-10-01 09:19:59)

  • ramses
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Re: USB Cable between Intel NUC11 Audio Streamer and ADI-2 Pro FS R Black

unpluggged wrote:

I think the OP should be banned. AFAIR, it's not allowed to post advertisements here, not to mention false ones.

Relax, RME doesn't produce USB cables, I think there is no competition and he only wanted to give a recommendation ;-)

Everyone has the right to share their experiences, even if the technical basis sometimes slips a little. A few friendly hints as to why this premium accessory belongs in the realm of audiophile myths are more helpful.

Perhaps we should exercise a little patience — especially when it comes to topics where psychoacoustics meets money ;-)

We all appreciate the RME forum as a peaceful place where the quality of information stands above the usual marketing promises of some other manufacturers.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14

8 Reply by Kubrak (edited by Kubrak 2024-10-01 11:34:02)

  • Kubrak
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Re: USB Cable between Intel NUC11 Audio Streamer and ADI-2 Pro FS R Black

First I considered to mark it as SPAM, but then came to the same idea, that it is better to discuss the topic and explain why ordinary, decent USB cable will do.

If it helps at least one person not to buy "audiophile USB cable", time has not been wasted.

EDIT.
One thing may be handy on those cables. Manufacturer proclaims that they work fine up to 15 m. So, if one needs long USB connection it might help. Also they seem to be goldplated. There is not price, so maybe they are not even extremely overpriced.

  • ramses
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Re: USB Cable between Intel NUC11 Audio Streamer and ADI-2 Pro FS R Black

Kubrak wrote:

One thing may be handy on those cables. Manufacturer proclaims that they work fine up to 15 m. So, if one needs long USB connection it might help. Also they seem to be goldplated. There is not price, so maybe they are not even extremely overpriced.

Sure? According to standards, 5m is the maximum length for a passive USB2 cable.
What does the product offering tell? Anything about built-in electronics to boost the signal?
If not, I would be very careful.

A normal quality USB cable in combination with a StarTech active USB3 extension (which also works fine for USB2)
is possibly the better choice: https://www.startech.com/en-us/cables/usb3aaext10m
The USB3 extensions can also be extended, see information there in case something like this is needed by anyone.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14
  • Kubrak
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Re: USB Cable between Intel NUC11 Audio Streamer and ADI-2 Pro FS R Black

I know, 5m is max. If their cables do work well for up to 15m..... And would cost less than three 5m cables and two active extensions... Or just little bit more... Why not?

But I do not know, if that cable works fine for up to 15m. And if the cost is "decent".

11 Reply by ramses (edited by ramses 2024-10-01 13:13:58)

  • ramses
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Re: USB Cable between Intel NUC11 Audio Streamer and ADI-2 Pro FS R Black

Kubrak wrote:

I know, 5m is max. If their cables do work well for up to 15m..... And would cost less than three 5m cables and two active extensions... Or just little bit more... Why not?

Correction: 15m you get with a 5m standard cable and 1 active 10m extension (not two!).
Which is
a) less expensive and
b) standard conform.

So why you say "Why not" without knowing anything about this cable.
It seems to be only a passive cable and exceeded standards by 200%.
For USB3 I can tell you that you should better not exceed 3m with passive cables.
Those cables are being offered up to 5m, but then you get USB transport errors.
I also made this experience. In this case, you exceed the standard "evenonly" by 66% instead of 200%.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14
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Re: USB Cable between Intel NUC11 Audio Streamer and ADI-2 Pro FS R Black

If bit-test is absolute this is a no-brainer. It works, everything is butter. Dont work, cable doesnt do the job. Whats problem with the logic? I use the bit-test everytime I do new setups.

About supra cables, I never had one that wasnt stiff as steel wire. Being scandinavian this brand isnt new to me. They can transmitt a signal, but handling were never good. Much better and cheaper options..

ADI-2 DAC, ADI-2 PRO, DigifaceUSB, UCXII, ARC, HEGEL.h80, KEF.ls50, HD650, ie400pro _,.\''/.,_
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Re: USB Cable between Intel NUC11 Audio Streamer and ADI-2 Pro FS R Black

Closing this now and moving it to Misc...

People who make claims like this (also about SPDIF cables) never explain which specific bits in a digital audio signal (embedded into data packets in case of USB) need to be altered or somehow magically improved to cause an audible difference to rather vague characteristics like "much tighter bass/sub bass" and "musical reproduction". How does the cable know which ones are the bass bits? Makes no sense at all... :-|

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

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