1 (edited by Tralien 2024-09-30 19:26:34)

Topic: Beginner question: ADI-2 as preamp for Cayin iHA-8 amp possible?

Hello guys,
I´m new to this and new to RME. As long as I am looking for a new combination of dac and amp for my Hifiman headphones, I come across RME ADI-2 again and again.

I would like to try ADI-2 DAC FS e.g. as DAC mainly.....So Signal chain would be: Computer -> Adi-2 Dac FS-> Cayin amp -> Headphones.

I have the option to buy a Cayin iHA-8 cheap, which might be a good amp for my purpose. But it does not provide a remote control. So I cant lay down in my chair and make music louder without getting up. But this amp has a preamp mode, which allows to use it as amp-only (dont know how to translate this mode). So Volume control does not happen within the Cayin, it happens in the signal chain before. The ADI-2 provides a remote control,  but can I connect these 2 the way I want? Or do I need a 3rd device? or do I need to buy a headphone amp WITH remote control when I want to use the Adi-2?

Source would be mainly USB / Computer if that´s important. No hardware bought yet, still trying to get all things together and cant find any information about Fixed and variable output level, i hope its not fixed only wink

Sorry for this noob question, I know you guys discuss serious problems. But I´m happy to hear your explanation or suggestions...english or german. Thank you guys

Re: Beginner question: ADI-2 as preamp for Cayin iHA-8 amp possible?

You may find you don't need the headphone amplifier. The headphone output on the current generation of ADI devices is very effective.

Re: Beginner question: ADI-2 as preamp for Cayin iHA-8 amp possible?

ADI-2 DAC has a very effective volume control that can be IR remote operated.
You can connect external amps to ADI-2’s variable output.

I even would suggest to try ADI-2 DAC‘s very capable headphone amps.
In fact there are two built in, one for regular ‘phones, a second one for IEM’s.

4 (edited by Tralien 2024-09-30 21:56:47)

Re: Beginner question: ADI-2 as preamp for Cayin iHA-8 amp possible?

which ones are the variable outputs? Chinch and XLR? It sais Line Outputs above them on the back, that confuses me ?!? Or is variable output meant the headphone-output with a 6.3mm to Chinch adapter?


I´ve read about the headphone amp.....1.2W output power unbalanced. If I wanted to use its internal headphone amp, I would choose the ADI-2/4 Pro which has around 4 Watts balanced. But that´s a huge lift in price. If I had a dynamic driver, I would try it, but for a Planar driver you need lots of power sad

5 (edited by KaiS 2024-09-30 22:34:52)

Re: Beginner question: ADI-2 as preamp for Cayin iHA-8 amp possible?

Both, XLR and RCA outs carry the same signal, just that XLR is 6 dB hotter by design.

Both, together, can be set to fixed or variable.
The term “Line Out” does not mean fixed level, it’s opposed to headphones- (or speakeramp-out).


1200 mW is more than ten times what you ever use even with power hungry planar magnetic phones.

Example, Hifiman Susvara 60 Ohm, 83 dB/mW, one of the hardest to drive ‘phones exist:
1200 mW drives it to 114 dB SPL.
If you assume very dynamic music, with 20 dB peak to average ratio (most music has much less), you still get an average, “permanent” level of:
114–20 = 94 dB SPL.

According to NIOSH (see below) you may listen at 94 dB SPL for a maximum time of one hour per day, if you want to avoid permanent hearing damage.
The rest of the day you would need to stay in perfect silence to recover.

https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/media/images/2024/08/decibel-chart.08.19kh.jpg

Practically, even with hard to drive phones, I usually don’t exceed 10 mW, even with dynamic classical music.
This is the reality, the proof of the pudding.

And most planar magnetic phones have 10 or more dB higher sensitivity than Susvara, so with 1200 mW you reach into the SPLs of gunshots.
You don’t go to a shooting range without ear protection, do you?

Give it a try (ADI-2 ‘phones amp, not the shooting range) and you will agree.

BTW: ADI-2’s meters can show the output level, so you always see how much unused power is left.

6 (edited by KaiS 2024-09-30 23:12:21)

Re: Beginner question: ADI-2 as preamp for Cayin iHA-8 amp possible?

BTW: If you put the money from Cayin iHA-8 on top of ADI-2 DAC’s price, you end up in the price range of ADI-2/4 Pro SE - if you really need its extra features.

7 (edited by Tralien 2024-10-01 15:04:59)

Re: Beginner question: ADI-2 as preamp for Cayin iHA-8 amp possible?

Both, together, can be set to fixed or variable.

thats whats missing in the manual. or I didnt read it carefully enough. thx for this sentence. now its clear.

I didnt want to start a discussion about the suggested power to drive a Planar driver. sorry for that and thanks for clarification


I dont need the extra features for the adi-2/4 at all, so for me the difference in price gives a lot of money for a dedicated headphone amp. sad that RME did not put that new (and now with balanced connection) amp into the smaller series. market for all in one headphone amps / dac / preamp is growing fast I think, and I would like to have a all in one solution.....argl....maybe I give it a try. thx to everyone for answering my questions.

Re: Beginner question: ADI-2 as preamp for Cayin iHA-8 amp possible?

Tralien wrote:

Both, together, can be set to fixed or variable.

thats whats missing in the manual. or I didnt read it carefully enough. thx for this sentence. now its clear.

I didnt want to start a discussion about the suggested power to drive a Planar driver. sorry for that and thanks for clarification


I dont need the extra features for the adi-2/4 at all, so for me the difference in price gives a lot of money for a dedicated headphone amp. sad that RME did not put that new (and now with balanced connection) amp into the smaller series. market for all in one headphone amps / dac / preamp is growing fast I think, and I would like to have a all in one solution.....argl....maybe I give it a try. thx to everyone for answering my questions.

There are very few headphones that the ADI-2 DAC cannot driver loud enough and the ADI-2 Pro and ADI-2/4 are even more powerful. Yours might very well be one of them, depending on the model.

Personally I would rather get the ADI-2/4 than a ADI-2 DAC/Cayin iHA-8 combo of it where priced in the same ball park. The ADI-2/4 would give a smoother user experience and you can still use the analog out for other things (like active monitors or amps).

The best would be if you could try out the ADI-2 DAC to see if it gets loud enough for you.

9 (edited by Tralien 2024-10-01 22:29:48)

Re: Beginner question: ADI-2 as preamp for Cayin iHA-8 amp possible?

how much is the exact power output of the adi 2/4 pro se headphone amp in balanced mode? rme sais 4w, I assume thats for 16 Ohms....then 2w for 32 Ohms? and how much at 300 Ohms? are there any more detailed numbers ?

another question: " Minimale Lastimpedanz bei Hi-Power @ +25 dBu: 40 Ohm"
means I cant use 16 and 32 Ohms headphones on balanced phones with high power?

Re: Beginner question: ADI-2 as preamp for Cayin iHA-8 amp possible?

Tralien wrote:

how much is the exact power output of the adi 2/4 pro se headphone amp in balanced mode? rme sais 4w, I assume thats for 16 Ohms....then 2w for 32 Ohms? and how much at 300 Ohms? are there any more detailed numbers ?

another question: " Minimale Lastimpedanz bei Hi-Power @ +25 dBu: 40 Ohm"
means I cant use 16 and 32 Ohms headphones on balanced phones with high power?

On ADI-2/4’s manual page 95, the red curve in the upper chart shows the power vs. impedance for balanced:
  8 Ohm 1000 mW
16 Ohm 2000 mW
32 Ohm 3500 mW
64 Ohm 4200 mW
etc.

Manual page 71:
“Minimum load impedance i Hi-Power @ +25 dBu: 40 Ohm”
means, if you want full +25 dBu voltage, impedance shouldn’t be lower than 40 Ohm.
This does NOT mean ADI-2 can’t drive lower impedances.

Personally I’ve even successfully used 4 Ohm phones (Precide Ergo A.M.T.) on ADI-2/4 Pro SE.

@MC Matthias Carstens, the developer, once mentioned he drives desktop speakers (probably 4-8 Ohm) from the weaker ADI-2 Pro or DAC for background listening.
Speakers are more difficult loads than ‘phones, due to their reactive behavior.

BTW: the manual is available in German AND English, use your preferred language.

Re: Beginner question: ADI-2 as preamp for Cayin iHA-8 amp possible?

@KaiS: you are my man ! Thx again.....helps a lot.