ok so we've got 4 possible solutions and one guy is going to test point 2, let's see how do it will work heheeh then i found the repeater cable... http://www.lindy.co.uk/firewire-extensi … 32908.html from UK... i'm registered there because i don't understand deutsch and i don't know why the account from .co.uk do not works in .de web page, so i'll send a mail them to see if they can send the item to me in spain!

is the same wire than here? http://cgi.ebay.es/Firewire-Active-Repe … .m63.l1177 i'll try it, is not so expensive.

Grumpy kids often come with ridiculous statements, that's right. RME interfaces do not have any problem with Lucent chips.

Hi, I got the Lindy Repeater and the FW400 works fine with my MBP now. What exactly is this cable doing to make it work?

Could I please recommend that you ask all your stockists to issue a warning about compatibility with the MBP and point the in the direction of the cable. It should be flagged on your site (*definitely* in the support section) as a cure. If make more of an effort to inform your customers before they purchase then it will save them a lot of time!

Thanks,

Alex

You can just use the repeater cable. A FW hub like in the external Lacie or WD HDs is a (multiport) repeater and works the same way.
The Lindy repeater cable is tested and fixes the Firewire problems of the LSI/Agere FW chip built into the recent Apple notebooks and iMacs. Other repeater cables and FW hubs should also work but are not tested, so there is no guarantee for success.

The upcoming revision 7 of LSI/Agere chip seems to work without the problem. We don?t know, when the new chip will replace the current revision 6 in Apple products, but will of course post it here when solid information are available.   

best regards
Knut

Looks to be exactly the same as the Lindy one. I don't think there are others on the market anyway.

You just use the repeater cable as if it was a normal cable. No hub or anything else needed. In fact it is sort of a one port hub.

There are some 1-port hub (one input one output) solutions out there, usually for industrial use-cases with even screw-on ports. You could try one of those, too. But the Lindy cable (which that ebay offer seems to be) is a proven solution (by me :-P).

Curious if you know what the identification of rev 7 of the LSI/Agere chip looks like. When I hold down Command + S on the iMAC it shows the 1394 information as 'OHCI Lucent ID 5901'. I'm not sure if the 5901 is a revision identification or what. Any thoughts? Also, under boot camp there was no way in Windows XP to see the 1394 hardware identification. This was all done at an Apple store so I had no way to use any third party apps.

I just bought the new white MacBook (Jan 09 with Nvidia), it has Lucent ID 5903 chipset. So far everything seems to work just fine with my fireface400, have been testing it for a while. I am not using any hubs or hard drives between the mb and ff.

Just thought to mention.

Does it run fine at 32 samples?

Gilbert, I am running my ff400 at 32 samples and playing back a Live set while writing this. Performance is not great of course, 15% CPU hit while running the Live "editing arrangements" tutorial while enabling ins and outs 1-8. But it seems to work without dropouts. If I use fx to burden the CPU over 25% (Live meter) it seems to start dropping out (the playback at least)

Since I was checking out this forum and thread particularly myself before ordering my Macbook (white Jan 09 with Nvidia) I thought this could interest some.

Remember this is just one configuration and maybe all the new white Macbooks are not made of precisely similar parts. I played it safe and ordered through Apple store so I have still some days left to return it if it would not work for some reason. At least in my location (Finland) it works this way.

Cheers

Edit: btw it seems that my ff400 is running fine with firewire bus power. my ff400 serial is 22678597, I remember this had something to do with it being able to do this?

It?s the "old" white plastic Macbook with new internal hardware, which is still sold by Apple.

Aaaah, thanks.

I don't think this is a problem of the LSI/Agere performance, but rather of Ableton Live. Using the same set on the same hardware I can get only upto around 50% CPU load (Live's meter) on OS X at 64 samples, but upto around 65% on Windows. The number of tracks is 30% higher on Windows then. At 512 samples there is a hard wall at 80% in Ableton Live on OS X, but on Windows you can go upto 100%.

So using Live on OS X for measuring hardware performance seems like a bad basis to begin with.

Additionally I used a TI based ExpressCard and it used around 3-5% more CPU load with the very same setup. The ExpressCard chipset might be to blame for this though (is it the same as the FW chipset?)!

Nope, Cubase. But I don't see why Live would be any different in this regard?

Thanks for your comment Gilbert. I grabbed my old MOTU 828 mk1 from the shelf and started comparing latencies. At 64 samples myff400 seemed to start dropping out at 56% of cpu burden while 828 made it til 75% when playing a Live set. the difference was quite a few reverbs..

hmph.. What is exactly your experience, does the firewire hub/drive between the ff and mb effect on this or is this the best I can get? If so I might need to find a new home for my ff.

the drivers or the drivers and the hardware.. quote from the motu tech notes:

"If the FireWire installer warns you that you're running a FireWire card with the NEC chip, you should replace said card with a card that uses the TI (Texas Instruments) or LSI (formlery Lucent/Agere) chip."

so they are are actually saying that this supposedly crap agere is ok for them. at least it seems to work..

would be nice to have a comment on this from the RME side.

We would be interested too. The 17" MBP has not reached German retail stores yet.

best regards
Knut

There is an older outdated LSI chip available (PCI based) which should also work with the fireface.
The newer PCIE chips from LSI are called FW643 (FW800, PCI ID 5901) and FW533 (FW400, PCI ID 5903). You need Rev. 7 of these chips to run with the fireface without workaround. They are also called FW643-E and FW533-E.

/Uwe

Hi,
Ive read this with interest after battling and failing to get fireface 800 working on Belkin 1394B firewire 800 card Card Part # F5U602. Can you test on this card please and determine if it should also be a blacklisted interface?
(I successfully got ff800 to work under Windows XP SP3 using a different onboard FW400 port.)

I have now ordered a Lacie FW800 card to see if that makes a difference.

The firewire 800 behaviour is curious. I have no other device to test FW800 and I notice that upon reboot , XP resets the sidspeeed for the belkin card to 2 (ie 400/800). At no stage was I ever able to click on the 1394b network adaptor in network connections and see any speed other than 400Mbps.

In device manager , upon clicking on the fireface 800, the usual message was ; 'the device is enabled but not functioning properly'

Setup details:

Fireface800:
hardware rev: 2.7
driver: 2.95
driver date: 30-1-09

system details:

Operation system (version/service pack) : windows XP SP3 (with hotfix from  article 955408) running on Gigabyte EP45 extreme motherboard with Intel quad core.
RAM amount ; maximum (4 Gb)
Network adapters ; onboard realtek RTL8168  CP8111 PCIE gigabit ethernet.
Graphic card ; Gigabyte gv-3d1 dual 6600GT 256Mb
Other installed soundcards ; 2 x M-audio 1010LT, and driver for MOTU 828MkII is still installed though no longer used except through fireface ADAT.
A native instruments USB audio device is installed
5 x MIDI USB devices are installed (2 x CME, 1 x emagic, 1 x akai mpd24, 1 x Yamaha 256)
Which audio software (version) shows the problem?; I dont even get that far. THe problem is erratic but either I cannot boot
the PC, or Adobe Audition 3/ Ableton live 7.14  hangs when it tries to access fireface or clicking on taskbar fireface icons has no effect. sometimes the interface does not initialise correctly (red light still on when windows has booted)

Hello guys,
I did a video to show that the newest MacBook Pro 2.53Mhz (early 2009) works perfectly with the FF400.

How to use RME Fireface 400 with the newest MacBook Pro 2.53Mhz (early 2009):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVw9pBT_oX8

I basically use a HardDrive FF800 La Cie D2 Extrem as a HUB. Works good

Those machine are beast !!

icipascal

According to RME, the problem is fixed, I'm not to sure though...

I am using the Lindy repeater cable somewhat successfully. I still encounter some odd audio distortion with Sound Toys plugins (but only via Audio Units not the VST versions). Periodically my entire system has this distortion. I unplug the Fireface but then OSX won't make any sound (even if it all appears like it should). I plug the Fireface back in and it then won't make a sound. I restart the computer and everything is fine again.

The system-wide distortion is so similar to the Sound Toys distortion that it's definitely the same culprit causing it. I'm thinking the RME drivers are at fault, though I wonder if the Agere Firewire port on the machine could be contributing in some way?

Has anyone tested performance with the different Firewire chips? Do they make a difference? Is there better performance with a TI chip? I want to keep my card slot for the UAD-Solo but I also want my machine to perform reliably!

It annoys me a bit that RME have not explained why this problem affects their products but not those from other manufacturers. I'm sure you could buy an Apogee product and not worry at all!

Is there any word on an actual solution to the problem from Apple? From Lucent? From RME?

Regards,

Alex

The reason for this is that this is simply not the case... See this Gearslutz thread, which has been mentioned here many times...

Distortion issues are not usually a symptom of the Agere/LSI issue.

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Daniel,

I apologize, you are correct that the the problem has nothing to do with the Agere/LSI issue.

In fact, I have just made an interesting discovery. The audio unit versions of the Sound Toys plugins distort if I have a buffer size selected that is not a multiple of 32. So with a buffer size of 32, no problems. Buffer size of 33, distortion. The weird thing is this doesn't happen with the VST versions. Most sequencers normally restrict you to multiples of 32 so I don't know why Ableton does it differently.

Anyway, I've noticed a few users post about Sound Toys distortion on here and for your reference the problem goes away with a buffer size that is a multiple of 32.

Thanks,

Alex

Thanks for that feedback!