• Registered: 2010-01-05
  • Posts: 17

Topic: Buffer size latency errors

Hi

sorry if this is a repost - i have searched but cant find antying the same as this problem...

Basically I am getting a lot of latency errors during playback in cubase. I have the latency set at 1024 and it currently says i have 68/669 errors. I am using a usb midi keboard and no hardware synths. I have a core 2 duo 7400 and 4 gig of ram with xp sp3. The cubase project i am currently working on is running at about 70-80% cpu usage but it spikes every now and again and i get a audio dropout and the error counter goes up....

Does anyone else get this problem or have any suggestion to how i should go about avoiding this problem?

Thanks.

  • From: Germany
  • Registered: 2007-04-10
  • Posts: 9,549

Re: Buffer size latency errors

Where exactly do you see these Errors? Is this a Fireface or a Fireface UC?


Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

RME Support's Website

  • Registered: 2010-01-05
  • Posts: 17

Re: Buffer size latency errors

Sorry i realise i have posted this in the wrong section - could admins please move it to the USB section

thanks

  • Registered: 2010-01-05
  • Posts: 17

Re: Buffer size latency errors

sorry it is a fireface UC - i forgot to write that!

  • Registered: 2010-01-05
  • Posts: 17

Re: Buffer size latency errors

I see the errors in the fireface USB settings on the taskbar...


im now working on another project, only about 40/50% cpu usage - still dropouts.....now saying 114/1161 errors :'(

  • From: Germany
  • Registered: 2007-04-10
  • Posts: 9,549

Re: Buffer size latency errors

Your PC seems to have a massive (USB) performance problem... This may help finding the cause: http://rme-audio.de/forum/viewtopic.php?id=1704


Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

RME Support's Website

  • Registered: 2010-01-05
  • Posts: 17

Re: Buffer size latency errors

hi thanks for that.

I did a test - wilst having cubase open (but not playing) and winamp running (playing) i got no more than 490us although it averaged 300 and thus it says i can steam audio with no problem.

Is there anything else i can check on that u are aware of?

Thanks

  • Registered: 2008-01-01
  • Posts: 3,025

Re: Buffer size latency errors

Any USB card readers? Anything else USB according to device-manager?

How much bandwidth does the UC reserve according to device-manager?

Don't know what I'm talking about? Get an expert to take a look at your computer! wink

  • Registered: 2010-01-05
  • Posts: 17

Re: Buffer size latency errors

i have a usb wireless dongle - which i disable (in the taskbar) when i use cubase....i have some other usb stuff...mouse, keyboard, midi keyboard....


I have just checked the usb bandwidth u mentioned - it seems that in the port its connected to it claims it is using 102% of the system reserved bandwidth - then when i changed ports it says its using 121%! now maths is not my strong point but i gather this isnt good. I have unplugged other devides and also tested when the fireface is not plugged in and the other ports are 10% or 20% if in use.....So to me it would seem that it is the device itself that overloads the bandwidth? Is this possible?

Thanks for any help you can give - its much appreciated.

  • Registered: 2008-01-01
  • Posts: 3,025

Re: Buffer size latency errors

Unless it is a RME driver error it sound more like your USB ports are not running at full USB 2.0 speed. I have seen this before on a laptop running with VIA USB chipset if I remember right (not sure). 20% of 480 mbit is 96 mbit, yours seems to run only at around 80 - 94 mbit.

What is the maximum throughput you get with an USB drive when copying a single large file to your internal drive?

  • Registered: 2010-01-05
  • Posts: 17

Re: Buffer size latency errors

hi again

im not sure that is 100% true because i htink the 10% figure etc just says what bandwidth is reserved for that device - not for how well the port is functioning....

12 Reply by Timur Born (edited by Timur 2010-01-06 12:39:25)

  • Registered: 2008-01-01
  • Posts: 3,025

Re: Buffer size latency errors

AFAIK the Fireface UC does not reserverve a "percentage" of the USB bandwidth, but a fixed amount of mb/s (isochronous transfer uses a fixed bandwidth, clock-frequency x bit-rate x tracks + midi + overhead). How many percent that makes for your USB port depends on what the USB port can deliver. Any USB 2.0 port should deliver 480 mb/s, but in practice some chipsets/mainboards/BIOS/drivers don't seem to deliver properly.

Like I said, I had one laptop where the USB port seemed to be delivering a maximum of around 100 mbit (which is higher than USB 1.1, but lower than USB 2.0) and thus the UC reserved around 100%.

So if your USB port says that the UC reserves 121% then either something is broken or your USB port doesn't deliver more than around 80 mbit. Try updating your BIOS maybe or delete all USB ports and hubs in Device-Manager and restart Windows to have them redetected and reinstalled.

  • Registered: 2010-01-05
  • Posts: 17

Re: Buffer size latency errors

thanks mate will try this and let u know how i fare!

  • Registered: 2010-01-05
  • Posts: 17

Re: Buffer size latency errors

ok i have ubdated usb drivers and also made sure the chipset is upto date and also flashed my bios (although i seems i was already up to date with that)...and im still at 102% bandwidth....

Admins: have u heard of this problem before?

I am using a Biostar TP43D2-A7 p43 express chipset series...its fairly new....

Thanks

15 Reply by traineegod (edited by traineegod 2010-01-07 11:11:26)

  • Registered: 2010-01-05
  • Posts: 17

Re: Buffer size latency errors

?

Would it perhaps be worth my while to get a pci-e usb2 card to see if it sorts this problem out - and if so can anyone recommend one?

  • Registered: 2008-01-01
  • Posts: 3,025

Re: Buffer size latency errors

It's unlikely to find many people (if anyone) who tried a pci-e usb2 card yet. Most people just use their onboard ports successfuly. So you have to try yourself. wink

17 Reply by traineegod (edited by traineegod 2010-01-07 15:32:51)

  • Registered: 2010-01-05
  • Posts: 17

Re: Buffer size latency errors

Admins? Any advice?

Also - how much bandwidth should a Fireface UC be reserving?

Thanks

  • Registered: 2008-01-01
  • Posts: 3,025

Re: Buffer size latency errors

36 channels x 44100 Hz x 24 bit = 38102400 bits = ~4,55 mb/s + Midi + Overhead

The UC reserves 20% of my USB2.0 port which corresponds to 12 mb/s based on the assumption that my ports deliver a full 480 mbit.

  • Registered: 2010-01-05
  • Posts: 17

Re: Buffer size latency errors

meh

i cant belive this would occur on such a new mother board......

admins - any advice please?

  • Registered: 2010-01-05
  • Posts: 17

Re: Buffer size latency errors

hello again

after downloading this nice little tool: http://www.aggsoft.com/usb-port-monitor.htm i did some tests, and with a cubase project open running a tune i ran the test and it showed the usb port to the fireface UC was transferring 25.88 mbits/s maximum. I then tested copying a film from my hdd to a toshiba usb drive -and that according to the tool copied at 135 m/bits ...all of this while cubase was running....

so that kind of proves that my ports at least are capable of transferring the data at the necessary speed....

in device manager it still says 114% reserved.....

*bangs head on desk*

  • Registered: 2008-01-01
  • Posts: 3,025

Re: Buffer size latency errors

How many tracks did you transfer/playback when you measured the transfer rate of the UC? Problem with measurement is that the hdd uses a whole different USB protocol (bulk transfer) than the UC (isochronous transfer), so it could still be a problem of your board.

Did you try any other audio application yet (both Reaper and Live offer free demo versions for download, so you could use one of these to see if you get the same problems)?

Did you try the UC on another computer?

  • Registered: 2010-01-05
  • Posts: 17

Re: Buffer size latency errors

hi - it was with maybe 10 track or more playing

I just did a trial with reason - played back a demo tune - ran the app and ran at 25.88 mbits a second. Any chance u could run the app on your machine with a project running and tell me how much data urs is transferring?

I migiht be able to get  laptop to test the card on but untill then.....

  • Registered: 2010-01-05
  • Posts: 17

Re: Buffer size latency errors

RME Support? Any advice?

  • Registered: 2010-01-05
  • Posts: 17

Re: Buffer size latency errors

Hello again

Ok i bought a PCI usb card which uses a VIA chipset and im still getting 102% bandwidth use....i found out that my mobo uses the ICH10 chipset which according to the front page of the RME site in the tested systems section should work perfectly anyway.....but it says 102%....

oh the pain

will a RME admin please respond?!

thanks.