Sorry, somewhere in the back of my head I thought there was a way to make SL work on PowerPC despite the official end of support. But I obviously mixed that up with Logic 9.

So just report whether your are using an Intel or NVidia chipset and what Firewire chipset you've got. I cannot check right now, but I think Profiler should report the chipset. And you can follow Daniel's link to find out how to report the Firewire chipset and revision.

Symptoms: core audio hangs followed by system hang once core audio app is force-quit.
MacBook Pro 2.2GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, latest OS, latest Logic Pro, FF400
NVidia / FireWire (OHCI) TI ID

I think we need to start splitting hairs about what constitutes proper use of the phrase kernel panic. Are you getting the multi-language kernel panic screen (or as in my case a verbose log readout in the final moments of the freeze since I boot always in verbose mode)? Or when the panic occurs can you still get a dialog box when you hit CMD+OPT+ESC? I think we need to state this when we experience instability. Also have you looked at the ALL MESSAGES section of the console log to investigate the seconds surrounding the time of the freeze? I'm learning a lot having done these things as we all share information that sheds light on what the problem systems have in common.

In my situation, I think I have been experiencing two sets of problems. One was arbitrary freezes (real kernel panics) due to the HAL plugin I have since disabled. The other are hangs with activity that seems to be showing up in the system log (but these do not show up in the 'hangs' log). With respect to the RME, the hang we are experiencing seems to be related to core audio waiting for something to happen which never comes. It's not that simple though, because as Logic (or other core audio app) tries to start, you also see failed attempts to load previously verified plugins during the application launch sequence.

Here's some good news: after removing all remnants of JackOSX, today was the first day I have successfully come home from work, plugged in my FF400, launched Logic and not hung at the core audio stage. I'm feeling somewhat optimistic atm, but I'm trying not to get too excited. If you are having RME problems, I would remove any system audio routing hacks you may have installed. JackOSX was definitely one of my problems in terms of specific conflicts with the RME. Core audio was fine with the built in interface and JackOSX installed.

BAD NEWS UPDATE: Crap. I spoke too soon. Although I got through the core audio startup, I am hanging the minute I do anything in Logic. In the console log, I get a similar error for all my plugins as the second one seen here, so there is still a similar core audio problem:

1/16/10 16  12:18:56 AM    /Applications/Fireface Mixer.app/Contents/MacOS/Fireface Mixer[327]    ATS: Invalid FontObjectID (3) - only low 16 bits are being passed in.

1/16/10 16  12:20:32 AM    pkgutil[339]    PackageKit: *** Missing bundle identifier: /Library/Receipts/Alchemy Audio Unit.pkg

Everything works after rebooting. So I guess I am back to square one. I thought it might be a 64-bit Logic mode wrinkle; but since everything works now, I'm back to looking at RME/core audio as the source, and there isn't much I can find in the log that helps. Damn.

Feel free to comment and correct me on the following definitions, but keep in mind that we are discussing the RME driver here, not OS X definitions.

Kernel Panic: Displays a "Hold Power Button to turn off the computer" message. Gets registered in the log.

OS X Crash: Anything that turns off OS X without displaying the "Hold Power Button" message. You may get a text/terminal screen displaying various CPU register numbers or you may just see the computer turn off/restart. Could or could not be registered in the log.

Computer Freeze: System is not responding in any way and no message is displayed. Most likely wont be registered in the log unless OS X writes something upon the next restart (a frozen system cannot do anything).

Application Crash: One or more applications crash/close either without further notice or with OS X displaying a crash message box (usually offering to report the crash log to Apple). Is registered in the log.

OS X usually can be normally worked on with and the application can be restarted. It may happen that some part of the audio/firewire driver got corrupted/froze (usually not) and a restart of OS X may be necessary to make it work again.

Application Freeze: One or more applications are not responding in any way. You may or may not be able to force the application to quit via ALT-CMD-ESC or Process Monitor. May be registered in the log once you force the application to quit.

OS X keeps responding but may display a beachball of death. OS X may crash or freeze some time after the Application Freeze. It may happen that some part of the audio/firewire driver got corrupted/froze (usually not) and a restart of OS X may be necessary to make it work again.

--

When I did my quick test with the Imac 21" I had a Kernel Panic with "Hold Power Button" message upon plugging in (once out of several otherwise successful tries).

Had a serious system damage because of too many hard resets yesterday.
Recovered from Timemachine backup.
Than deinstalled the FF driver.
MotU Ultralite works perfectly in the meantime.
Will sell my two Fireface 800 and buy a ADI 8 QS-M instead.

I have to take my Mac out of the studio every day. So it's not really a choice for me. I'm F'd. It takes me about 10 minutes to get reconfigured because of various apps I have to launch, even when I'm working on music. I loathe having to go through this every time I want to use my FF. If RME didn't have such good digital clocks, why I'd... ;P

Fireface 400, Firmware 1.70, driver 2.65, 17" Macbook Pro (mid 2009) with dedicated graphics (9600M GT), LSI/Agere rev. 7 Firewire chipset, Nvidia 730i/9400M mainboard chipset, Snow Leopard 10.6.2 (fresh installation)

Tested successfully:

1) Plugging in/out in slow and fast succession (bus-powered via Firewire) with:

a. no application loaded
b. audio application loaded (Au Lab, Garage Band, Live 8) *with* playback running over FF400 and onboard sound
c. audio application loaded (Au Lab, Garage Band, Live 8) *without* playback running

2) Sending Mac to sleep and awaking *with* and without audio application loaded, even during playback and input monitoring.

3) Various buffer sizes downto 24 samples.

Problems so far:

1) Once after plugging the FF400 out during playback in Live 8 and plugging it back in Live froze when selecting the FF400 as output again (Beachball of Death on Live application windows).

After trying to force quit via ALT-CMD-ESC and trying to load Process Monitor OS froze with a Beachball of Death (mouse point could be moved, but nothing else was possible, OS X did not even notice me unplugging and replugging my external display). I had to switch off via ALT-CMD-POWER then.

After restart I tried the exact same thing, but it worked. Since I successfully tried the same stunt with Au Lab and Garageband before I suspect a problem with Live rather than the FF for the time being.

2) Obviously my 17" MBP automatically starts Snow Leopard in 64-bit mode, but the FF only comes with a 32-bit Midi driver: "20.01.10 09:21:45    kernel    64 bit mode enabled"

"20.01.10 16:50:46    MIDIServer[244]    MIDIServer [244] starting; arch=x86_64
20.01.10 16:50:46    MIDIServer[244]    PlugIn Fireface MIDI.plugin -- /Library/Audio/MIDI Drivers/ does not contain a supported architecture.
20.01.10 16:50:46    MIDIServer[244]    MIDIServer relaunching because a 32-bit driver was found
20.01.10 16:50:46    MIDIServer[244]    MIDIServer [244] starting; arch=i386"

3) The following likely minor error comes up every time the FF is plugged in:

"20.01.10 16:41:18    /Applications/Fireface Mixer.app/Contents/MacOS/Fireface Mixer[193]    ATS: Invalid FontObjectID (3) - only low 16 bits are being passed in."

I will do the same tests with onboard graphics (9400M) later. And after that I will test an 27" Imac which hopefully comes with TI chipset like the 21.5" ones that I experienced a kernel panic with once (when plugging the FF400 in).

Well, Timur. I'd say you did half of RME's homework for them already. TI Firewire and Snow Leopard certainly rings a bell in my studio!

Could one of the people with issues please force their Snow Leopard into 64 bit mode (keep pressing the keys 6 and 4 during bootup afaik)?

You are absolutely right. Starting in 64 bit mode and all problems seem to be gone.
Mac Pro 2xQuad 2,26 Ghz  2009, 6 GB Ram.
Will keep the machine starting in 64 and see how everything else works.
http://blogs.zdnet.com/Apple/?p=4716&tag=rbxccnbzd1
Had to chance the rights before I could edit in TextEdit and put them back to default with Diskutility.
Thank you!

I also tried the 64-bit kernel.
I had one computer freeze when pluging in the fireface while DVD player was running. But I was not able to reproduce it. It was the only problem during two days.

MacBook Pro 13" (5.5), 4GB, 10.6.2, fireface 800 driver 2.65

@ye

I have my FF400 on buspower on my macpro (only because my power adapter died).

So without power adapter. Maybe you could try if that differs ? For i have no problems with my fireface 400

Once I find time I will do another testrun with the external power-supply, because all of my tests have been done with bus-power as well. Not that it should matter, but you never know.

I'm also curious if the non-european power-supplies provide the FF400 with different output voltage than the european ones? Were are people coming from that experience problems, from 110v countries or from 230v countries?

I thought so, thanks for the info. Without reading through the whole thread again: did any of the people experiencing the issues try bus-powered operation yet?

We are trying to pinpoint the circumstances that lead to the issues or that save from them. I did my successful test on a 4 gb MBP and an 8 gb IMac.

That being said my tests were far from exhaustive. For example, I didn't let the OS/FF run for more than 2 hours at a time to see if crashing occurs after some time. I will do that once I find time and will also recheck the 21.5" Imac (4 gb) that I experienced one Kernel Panic with.

I'm just asking but...WILL IT EVER WORK ONE DAY ????

Here, on Macpro 2008, I only have freezes if I turn on my FF400 after turning on my Snow Leopard. The FF is working with bus power.
No problems after turning on FF first, and then turning on the macpro. Even if I go to sleep mode, and then turn on again, I get no freezes.

P.

Sorry, I get freezes, and I can only do a hard restart... no response from computer, mouse or keyboard.

P.

The freeze problems are also with FF800... I don't think that this is power supply issue.

Ah, bummer. Thanks for the reply. Still, it's intriguing that a user doesn't have a problem during buss power, but does otherwise while I only have the option of outlet power.

It would be expected that way, yes. But like so often in computer problem solving we are approaching the point where (in a car analogy) we are trying to find out if the headlights affect the steering. And knowing how bad the Macbook's grounding is I can well imagine the Firewire chipset's power to be affected by an external power-circuit.

Especially the latest report about a complete computer freeze makes me suspicious. This usually only happens because of some power regulation issues (or heat issue which again affects power regulations). Some transistor in the CPU, memory or whatever doesn't get its electrons the way it should and thus stalls the whole system.

The alternative would be some system/driver call to be stuck so hard in a loop that it keeps the whole system from responding, but I wouldn't expect something like this happening in modern software/operating-systems.

Me! I currently use the FF only for playback. No commercial audio software installed on my mac.

Thanks for the report. I will have to do some more testing here, but I wont have enough time before next week and in between I get distracted by other interests (just published a comparison of Windows XP/Vista/W7/OS X memory usage on Gearslutz to hopefully finally end the discussions about the *best* OS DeadHorse).

Same here on a MacPro 2009, even with the latest drivers... I don't get a kernel panic but I have to (hard) reboot after Logic hangs at "Initializing CoreAudio" and subsequently freezes the whole system...

Really? What's the precise procedure? Do you turn off the FF400? If so, before or after sending the Mac into stand-by (and in which order do you wake 'em up)?

@RME: do you have debug version of the FF driver that provides extensive logging? I would be willing do run that if it helps as I can perfectly reproduce the freeze problem using the steps described above.

On a related note: does anyone know why there is no "lost+found" directory (anymore?) after HFS/fsck removed orphaned file and directories? How to tell the impact of such a filesystem recovery following each FF/CoreAudio crash?

Thanks