• Registered: 2007-05-13
  • Posts: 72

Topic: Octamic 2 and Avalon U5

Hello

I have a RME Multiface and a octamic 2.  3 Questions

1. I was thinking of replacing the Multiface with a fireface 800, and then use the multiface for my laptop, as I have the HDSP card.  Will I be able to hear any difference in the " quality" compared to the Multiface ?.

2. The Fireface has an instrument input with High Z.  Is it better to use that than buying ex a Avalon U5 for Bas and guitar ?

3. If I buy a Avalon U5 preamp, how do I then set it up ?.  Is it ok to use it into the Octamic 2. Becasue Avalon U5 is a pre amp and the Octamic 2 has a pre amp, so now it is a preamp into a preamp ?.  Do I then just put the Octamic on -10 DB ? Or is it better to put the Avalon U5 direct into the Multiface ?. What will I gain or lose in either way ?

Many Thanks

Michael

  • From: Houston, TX
  • Registered: 2007-05-11
  • Posts: 1,191

Re: Octamic 2 and Avalon U5

I'll let someone else comment on the SQ as I don't own a FF800...

The U5 has Mic and Line level outs - you can either feed it into another Mic Pre with it's mic level out (as I do for flavor) or you can come into your Multiface or FF800's LINE inputs with the U5's Line level outs.

The U5 is a $550 DI - so I'd have to assume it is a little more robust than the FF800's DI inputs wink

cool

MADIface-XT+ARC / 3x HDSP MADI / ADI648
2x SSL Alphalink MADI AX
2x Multiface / 2x Digiface /2x ADI8
  • Registered: 2007-05-13
  • Posts: 72

Re: Octamic 2 and Avalon U5

Ok thanks,

But can you use the preamp on U5 and then feed it into the Octamic 2 and then put that on - 10 DB ? .  Just want to knwo the principle.  Will that destroy something ?  OR is it better to use U5 and direct into the Multidface ?. What is the advantage of going into the Octamic 2 and then into the multiface instead of just going direct into the multiface ? . That I dont understand

Thanks

Michael

  • From: Houston, TX
  • Registered: 2007-05-11
  • Posts: 1,191

Re: Octamic 2 and Avalon U5

You probably wouldn't need a pad if you use the U5's Mic level output (it's already at mic level - no need to knock it down any more).  If you try this and the level is too hot - then either back down the U5's gain, or engage the Octamic's -10dB pad.

As far as U5 Mic > Octamic > Multiface versus U5 Line > Multiface , you'd have to try it and see if the sound is perceptibly different.  I don't own an Octamic, but I understand it's more of a transparent/clean type preamp - so there's probably not much to gain by adding it to the chain.  I'd just go from U5 Line > Multiface.  Why add more gain stages than needed if they really aren't "helping" the sound?

However, I use an HHB Classic-80 Tube Pre after my U5 Mic output - this IS a colorful preamp and allows me to add a good deal of drive and harmonics to the relatively "Clean" U5 sound (I use it for a Rock Bass type sound).  Then the Classic-80 feeds the ADI-8 Line Input.  So it really depends on what you want to accomplish with your direct sound.  Do what's appropriate for the song wink

cool

MADIface-XT+ARC / 3x HDSP MADI / ADI648
2x SSL Alphalink MADI AX
2x Multiface / 2x Digiface /2x ADI8
  • Registered: 2007-05-13
  • Posts: 72

Re: Octamic 2 and Avalon U5

Thanks Radnyman,

A question then comes to mind.  The Octamic 2 has much newer converters compared to the Multiface so would it not be better to go into the lin of the Octamic ?. 

I wish someone from the RME support could answer on this tread also :-) 

How doe sit work with the link of ADAT between the Octamic 2 and the Multiface.

1. If I go from my Microphone or the Avalon U5 or anything into the Octamic 2, are the Octamic 2 converts used and the Multiface converters NOT ?.

If that is the case then I guess that I dont have to buy the Fireface 800 to replace the Multiface ?.  Is that correct ?

I never use the Multiface, the only purpose for that is to have a link into the Computer and to get the sound out to my speakers.

Regards

Michael

  • From: Houston, TX
  • Registered: 2007-05-11
  • Posts: 1,191

Re: Octamic 2 and Avalon U5

Oh - I didn't know the Octamic was a converter as well (I thought it was an 8-channel version of the analog Quadmic ed: ).

Well - then the only way to choose which is "better" will be to try them in all possible combinations and listen.  What sounds good is good.  One can talk about which one has newer ("better?" - maybe) converters and the effects of passing through multiple gain-stages - but it's REALLY about the sound of that particular instrument and player on a particular take.  I'll bet the bank that's pretty much what RME will tell you wink

I doubt you will hear a significant difference - but might be just enough to sway you one way or the other - and of course - being a human will severely sway any A/B testing unless you go the double-blind route (only if you are really serious about picking which one sounds best w/o knowing which one you are hearing).

Plug some stuff in and record.  You're not going to blow anything up at these levels.  Get some return on your investment wink

cool

MADIface-XT+ARC / 3x HDSP MADI / ADI648
2x SSL Alphalink MADI AX
2x Multiface / 2x Digiface /2x ADI8
  • Registered: 2007-05-13
  • Posts: 72

Re: Octamic 2 and Avalon U5

Hello,

So I ended up buying a Universal Audio 610 Solo and it sounds GREAT.  I have conected it to the XLR input oif the Octamic 2.  Would it be better to connect it to the Multiface Analouge IN instead ? .  Right now I need to turn the gain down to under 15 DB on the Octa Mic as else the signal will be to hot ? . What is yoru opinion ?

Thanks

Michael

  • From: Houston, TX
  • Registered: 2007-05-11
  • Posts: 1,191

Re: Octamic 2 and Avalon U5

Let your ears decide.  One instrument might happen to favor the Multiface - and another might favor the Octamic and its converters.  The Octamic-II's converters are newer than the Multiface's and probably has a better power supply - but age isn't a direct influence of sound quality.

Use the Octamic's 1/4" Balanced TRS Line Inputs for connecting the 610 - you shouldn't need a pad in that case IIRC...

Your ears are the end-all when it comes to "What sounds better" in your mix in your room on your tracks - period.  Try both wink

cool

MADIface-XT+ARC / 3x HDSP MADI / ADI648
2x SSL Alphalink MADI AX
2x Multiface / 2x Digiface /2x ADI8
  • Registered: 2007-05-13
  • Posts: 72

Re: Octamic 2 and Avalon U5

He HE Randyman, Yes the ears are the way to go. But sometime I cant hear if someting is better thatn another thing. Whay can I not sue the XLR cable fra the UA 610 and into the the Octamic also XLR ? . It has one of those combined XLR / Jack.   Right now I have turned the gain to 0 DB oin the Octamic 2 and then turned up the " tube gain on the UA 610 to 8 and then the UA 610 level to 4. And it sound FUC:::::::::: amazing. I jsut recoreded it in Cuasbe 5.5 an d YEAHHHH this is the soudn I have been looking for. I was never alble to record a good bas sound through my Radial DI box and into the OIcta Mic.  But this is WARM, Gritty and CLEAR.  Damm I did not knwo that it coudl be this difference. And what I hear from my monitors when playing is also what I actual hear when I have recoreded it.  Major break through for me :-)

I wil ltry also to input only to the RME Multiface to hear if there is a difference.

Dammm my Thursday suddenly went 100%  into JOY

Regards

Michael

  • Registered: 2007-05-13
  • Posts: 72

Re: Octamic 2 and Avalon U5

And a small extra question.   Now I want to try the UA 610 on my R?de NT 100 condensator mic.  UA 610 has Phantom power but the Octamic 2 has also phanthom power ? .   So Should I shut off the Octamic 2 Phantom power and then use the UA 610 and then have the Gain on Octamic 2 turned down to 0 ?   

Thanks

Mich

  • From: Houston, TX
  • Registered: 2007-05-11
  • Posts: 1,191

Re: Octamic 2 and Avalon U5

Yep.  The device that physically connects to the MIC should have the Phantom engaged.  DO NOT engage Phantom on the Octamic in the scenario you described above as I have no clue what kind of outputs the UA 610 has - and there is a *chance* that applying phantom power to a unit's OUTPUT could cause damage.  The 610's output is probably transformer balanced - so applying phantom to its output likely wouldn't hurt anything - but always play it safe and DISABLE phantom if using a Mic Preamp as an input from a piece of outboard gear.  The same is true for passive Ribbon mics (phantom power will nuke a passive ribbon mic instantly).

I'm not all that familiar with the Octamic - but if the Octamic's 1/4" TRS inputs bypass a gain stage in the preamp, then I'd use those over the Octamic's XLR inputs.  You'll have to reference the manual or pick RME's brain on that one (or just go with whatever sounds best to your ears - that's what's really important in the end - not what some spec sheet or some guy on a web forum says!).  There is no one answer to this quandry - it's 1000000% subjective.

cool

MADIface-XT+ARC / 3x HDSP MADI / ADI648
2x SSL Alphalink MADI AX
2x Multiface / 2x Digiface /2x ADI8
  • Registered: 2007-05-13
  • Posts: 72

Re: Octamic 2 and Avalon U5

Hi Randyman,

THANKS for your good answers.  I will use my ears :-)   I was not sure about the "bypassing" when using the 1/4 TRS Input on the Octamic 2.  But I think I will just create a tread asking RME about that. 

I will not put the Octamic 2 Phantom power on and then only use the new UA 610.  Dammm it sounds good on bass, hope it can do some good things for my R?de NT 1000 Mic also

Have a nice weekend

Regard

Michael