• Registered: 2011-03-04
  • Posts: 80

Topic: RME FF800 : what are the bandwith limitations / pitfals, concretely ?

I am spinning and the more i read, confused. Have used a PCI ADAT card (Frontier Design Dakota) for almost 14 years, 4 PCs, 4 OS generations.

Have tried a RME Fireface 800 this week-end, and I am currently in the decision process to buy one.  I like very much the idea of being 'out' of the computer (although FW may disappear, and at this price tag, I wish to do another decade, at least...). As long as PCI or PCIe exists, that should not be a problem though, thanks to cheap FW cards.

I am on a desktop.  While I don't do bands very often, my Dakota did the job on several occasions (8 armed tracks simultaneously).  Also use my Yamaha 02Rv2 which I'll probably keep until it dies (this is why I want ADAT capabilities). 

However, I was reading that FW units have limitations in bandwidth, so recording multitrack same time could be more easily done on PCI card (??). Need some clarifications on this: are we talking about limitations to 1, 2 or 8 channels being used simultaneously for recording ? Are we talking about number of tracks played back through ADAT channels ? Problems with both at same time ??... Need to have exemples, concretely. If we're talking about recording 24 tracks simultaneously, this will never be my problem...

While I don't necessarily want to have a 'mobile' solution, I like the idea of being able to have someone coming in with a portable then connect to system.  But most will be done in-house here. 

Also like the idea that *if* my 02R fails, then I also like the idea of having a stand-alone solution like the RME FF800.  And having analog I/O.

I am not that concerned with the wiping out of Firewire as much as I am with this bandwidth issue.  My tests with the FF800 have not been that far as what I am asking above.  So those of you who have worked with this unit a lot:

1) are you using it for desktop (studio) or mobile recording ?
2) What about this ''bandwith'' limitations: will it start to have any problems with FW when playing back 18 tracks while recording 5 new ones ? What would be typical figures here so I can understand what these limitations can be, and help my decision?


Thanks,
Rob

My Current system:
Quad-Core i7 2.86
8GB memory
Windows 7 x64, SONAR 8.5 (32 & 64bit), SONAR X1 (64bit)
Frontier Design Dakota (which I would replace)
MOTU MIDI Express 128 USB midi interface

  • Knut
  • Knut
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  • Registered: 2007-04-06
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Re: RME FF800 : what are the bandwith limitations / pitfals, concretely ?

However, I was reading that FW units have limitations in bandwidth, so recording multitrack same time could be more easily done on PCI card

Don´t worry. The Fireface 800 can of course use all 56 channels - inputs and outputs - at the same time without limitations and the Firewire 800 bus has still enough bandwidth for more than one Fireface. Even if we don´t encourage users to use several Firefaces on the same bus, because we cannot guarantee a trouble-free setup, there are many users using successfully two or three Fireface 800 on one single workstation.

Btw. the Fireface UFX provides 60 channels on USB 2.0 or FireWire 400.

best regards
Knut

  • Registered: 2011-03-04
  • Posts: 80

Re: RME FF800 : what are the bandwith limitations / pitfals, concretely ?

Thanks for this reply.

On the other end, while this is true that usually people don't go to forums just to say 'hey, I have a trouble-free unit', I'm kind of discouraged to read all problems people seems to have here with FF800... having to juggle with FW cards, finding the right chipsets, repairing this or that, solving crackles and glitches and so on... but the most scarry thing is some have experienced problems after a month or so...

I'm really concerned about spending $2000 on an interface that might take me to spend more time into technical trials and errors than producing music... In close to 14 years, I never had a serious problem with an internal PCI card (Frontier Design), and it's still alive and well...  I'm thinking of the FF800 as a serious upgrade and getting away from 'inside the PC'. But I wonder if this really means 'more freedom'. Maybe I should opt for a RayDAT PCIe card...

Once again, I played for a week-end with a FF800 and had no problem. But are there people out there (and hopefully the vast majority ...) that had no issues in many years with FF800 ??...  With all due respect, it sounds silly tome to read from some of you detailing what I would consider a ''major'' issue, that you ''like'' this unit very much.  Of course, we all need some comforting when paying such a high price tag, but I would assume that it should come with at least some peace of mind...

I sincerely don't mean to be disrespectful to anyone here, although my words may sound a bit sarcastic.  I'm probably trying to convince myself that these troubles must be the exception, not the rule, so I will feel more relaxed when I see my VISA bill when I make my decision.

  • Knut
  • Knut
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Re: RME FF800 : what are the bandwith limitations / pitfals, concretely ?

Compared to the thousands Fireface 800 RME sold every year since the release the group of users with serious problems is very small. This is rock solid, approved hardware. Still the best FireWire driven interface on the market. If it comes to user happiness: the Fireface 800 just won the SoS user voting award as best audio interface - against interfaces of all classes!

A major issue was indeed the LSI FireWire chipset Revision 6, which Apple built into Macbooks and iMacs two years ago, but new revisions of the chipset show no problems. If you choose the right partner for the Fireface 800 it will be a trouble free combination.

best regards
Knut

  • wal
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  • Registered: 2010-09-16
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Re: RME FF800 : what are the bandwith limitations / pitfals, concretely ?

Hi lanstrad,
You really shouldn't concern yourself with the Fireface's bandwidth, as it works fine with all channels simultaneously. Although should ensure your computer's Firewire chip is compatible (Even though I have used named incompatible ones with no real problems!). Regarding reliability. the Fireface 800 has one of the best reputations in the audio interface industry.. Mine has worked flawlessly for three years. The support is also excellent, if not a little quirky!
Buy one!. I don't think you will be disappointed..
Regards,
Wal...

wal's Website

6 Reply by lanstrad (edited by lanstrad 2011-03-08 04:05:45)

  • Registered: 2011-03-04
  • Posts: 80

Re: RME FF800 : what are the bandwith limitations / pitfals, concretely ?

Thanks to both of you.

Btw, when I tested the unit, I was doing so on a cheap ($20) Firewire PCI card added to computer, and had no problem... Of course, I probably tried 5% of what the FF800 can do...  I have not tried it in the PC's FW

What should be the card I go for ? Should I aim instead for PCIe ?  400 or 800 ? Any brand ? (this story about TI chipset ..?)

Also, about 'longevity' I'd like to read more of you users - how long have you had the unit without troubles (I mean serious troubles, not things that can be solved by some easy tweaking) ?  I'm aiming at *very long* time (read: over 10 years) of loyal use in such a purchase (at this price tag).

Thanks again,
Rob