1 Topic by davidg (edited by davidg 2011-06-17 11:32:27)

  • Registered: 2011-06-17
  • Posts: 7

Topic: RPM driver not working in Win 7 64 bit

I have an HDSP RPM which I've had for about 5 years, never had any problem with it on a Win XP laptop.  The Cardbus card has the latest firmware (rev. 17).  I just got a new PC with Win 7 64bit, and installed the latest WDM driver (3.24) downloaded from the RME downloads section.  It appeared to install fine and everything went exactly as the instructions said.  The Hammerfall DSP Mixer and Setting icons are at the bottom right of the taskbar notification area as they should be and they both seem to work fine, and correctly show input levels to the RPM, and allow me to mix inputs to output channels i.e. to actually route audio through the RPM (i.e. from ins to outs, but not from Windows itself).

So, everything seems correctly configured.  But when I try to play audio through Windows, using Real Player or Windows Media Player, both will act like they are starting to play, but then just stay 'stuck' at 0:00 and the play time counter never advances and no audio comes out, and nothing shows up in the level meters in the Hammerfall DSP mixer.  I tried quite a few different settings in the Windows Sound Control Panel Playback and Recording settings, and nothing makes any difference.  And if try that play test sound button in the Sound Control Panel, it too doesn't play any audio, just sits there like it's wanting to start playing a sound but never does.

I installed Digicheck 5.32 and it will correctly show input levels if the "Hardware Level" option is checked under "Input Device Setup", but shows nothing if "ASIO" is checked.  Therefore, it seems that the HDSP driver is just not able to get audio to or from Windows.

I also tried under Windows Sound Control Panel Playback and Recording settings to set the default playback and record devices to "Speakers (RME Hammerfall DSP Default Device)", "Analog (3+4)", "Analog (5+6)", "Virtual (1+2)", etc., and regardless, windows apps won't play, and I get no audio.

I also tried clicking Bypass under "I/O Box" and the setting of that makes no difference, still no audio either way.  And I tried changing the Windows Sound Control Panel "Default Format" setting to 16 bit 44100 and to 24 bit 44100 and neither makes no difference.  I also tried there changing "Exclusive Mode" to check or uncheck "Allow applications to take exclusive control", and another variant of also checking / unchecking "Give exclusive mode applications priority", and none of those combinations of settings make any difference.  Still no playback.

Of course I also tried all the other obvious things.  I tried rebooting several times; cold booting several times; reinstalled the driver; deleted the old driver and reinstalled; left the computer off for a bit between boots.  So I think I have tried all the obvious things to get this to work and this seems to be a real issue with the RME driver not working properly with Win 7 64bit.

Ideas anyone?  Has anyone used the RPM successfully with Win 7 64bit before?

(By the way, a small and probably unrelated bug I noticed is that in the Hammerfall DSP Settings screen it always comes up with none of the radio buttons on under "Input 3/4" selected.  If you click one (e.g. "Line 0 dB"), then close it and reopen, same thing no radio button is checked.  All the other settings on that screen seem to work fine though.)

  • From: Germany
  • Registered: 2007-04-10
  • Posts: 9,857

Re: RPM driver not working in Win 7 64 bit

How is the RPM connected to the new PC?


Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

RME Support's Website

  • Registered: 2011-06-17
  • Posts: 7

Re: RPM driver not working in Win 7 64 bit

Hi Daniel, It is connected via the RME Hammerfall Cardbus card.  I looked up the name just to make sure you know exactly which one I have, and the one I have is the "flat version" pre-2005 model, which according to www.rme-audio.net/old/english/hdsp/cardpci.htm#CARDBUS

The CardBus shown above ships since mid 2005. In case two HDSP CardBus shall be used in one laptop, the lower card must be a flat version, which is also available. It uses a special cable (15-pin Closed LAN to 6-pin IEEE1394a, included), with a length of 4.5 meters (15 ft.). The flat card is 100% identical and compatible, but does not offer the Secure BIOS technology of the upper version.

Thanks,
David

  • From: Germany
  • Registered: 2007-04-10
  • Posts: 9,857

Re: RPM driver not working in Win 7 64 bit

New PCs and laptops do not tend to have Cardbus slots... So I assume you are using some kind of adapter, which may be part of the issue here.


Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

RME Support's Website

  • Registered: 2011-06-17
  • Posts: 7

Re: RPM driver not working in Win 7 64 bit

Hi, yes the PC does have a Cardbus slot, provided by a StarTech PCI to Cardbus adapter card.  (Which are very common, and in fact are standard options offered by PC manufacturers such as HP and Dell when you buy a system.)

Does RME not support Cardbus in the Windows 7?   If so, does RME plan to support this soon?  I don't think I am willing to spend $400 for another PCI interface card when the old one should work fine. (It does in fact work as far as allowing me to at least talk to the RPM and adjust mixer settings). Cardbus is still a common format used by many people and still supported by Windows, and I'd be very surprised if a company with RME's excellent reputation were to abandon all their customers who have purchased CardBus cards over the past 10 years.

Thanks,
David

  • Jeff
  • Jeff
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  • Registered: 2007-05-21
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Re: RPM driver not working in Win 7 64 bit

Cardbus is certainly supported in Windows 7. The adapter is the problem here, and I would argue that this is not "very common".

Regards,
Jeff Petersen
Synthax Inc.

Jeff's Website

  • Registered: 2011-06-17
  • Posts: 7

Re: RPM driver not working in Win 7 64 bit

Hi Jeff,

Well I guess it's all relative what you want to define as "common", but are you saying that RME does not support and does not plan to support its Cardbus interfaces on Windows 7?

Thanks,
David

  • Jeff
  • Jeff
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Re: RPM driver not working in Win 7 64 bit

Jeff wrote:

Cardbus is certainly supported in Windows 7. The adapter is the problem here...

Regards,
Jeff Petersen
Synthax Inc.

Jeff's Website

  • Registered: 2011-06-17
  • Posts: 7

Re: RPM driver not working in Win 7 64 bit

Hi Jeff,

How do you know the adapter is the problem?  And does not every computer which has Cardbus require an adapter (i.e. interface chipset) to provide that?  Also it does not seem to be clear from your posts what you are suggesting I do?

Thanks,
David

  • Jeff
  • Jeff
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Re: RPM driver not working in Win 7 64 bit

The Cardbus works fine in Windows 7, with the proper driver and firmware. Your Startech adapter is different from a built in chipset. If you search the forum you will find that their Cardbus/ExpressCard34 adapter also never worked, when others did.

There was a DuelAdapter that worked as a CardBus/ExpressCard34 adapter, but they don't support Snow Leopard or Windows 7.

There is nothing to do except get a RME HDSPe card for your new computer. You can try a different adapter, but I'm not aware of any that actually work for use with an audio interface.

Regards,
Jeff Petersen
Synthax Inc.

Jeff's Website

11 Reply by davidg (edited by davidg 2011-06-18 06:21:18)

  • Registered: 2011-06-17
  • Posts: 7

Re: RPM driver not working in Win 7 64 bit

Jeff,

It would seem that whether the chipset is on the motherboard or on a PCI adapter card wouldn't matter. A chipset is a chipset, regardless of which circuit board it happens to be on.  I think the real question is which Cardbus controller chipsets does RME support?  If I knew that then maybe I can find an adapter card that has one of them.

Also I thought cardbus was a standard interface, for which the chipset should not matter for the most part.  For example, PCI is a standard interface, and an RME PCI card will work on an Intel motherboard just as well as on an Asus or any generic Taiwanese motherboard.  So it seems like you're saying cardbus is not a standard interface, which would be a surprise.  In any case, I don't need the RPM enough to justify shelling out $400 for a new PCI card, so I'd like to try to figure out what other ways I can use my existing RME HDSP Cardbus Card and specifically which CardBus chipsets (whether built-in or otherwise) RME supports.  I would find it hard to believe that the only differentiator is whether the chipset is "built in" or not. Seems that there has to be more to it than that, and that there might be some chipset which is not "built in" to a motherboard but which is still supported.

And another thing is that the cardbus card and adapter *do* work, at least to some extent, because all the RME tools are able to get data to and from the RPM, see the input levels, adjust mixer settings, etc.  So the communications are in fact working between the RME software, the PCI Cardbus Adapter, the HDSP Cardbus card, and finally the RPM.  Therefore if the signal chain clearly is indeed working it seems maybe that blaming something which seems to be only related to the Windows WDM/ASIO driver, on the Cardbus adapter (without even knowing anything about said adapter, such as the chipset it uses*) may not be a valid assumption.  Of course I don't know what the real cause of this issue is, but I'd like to do due diligence and find out what the real root cause is before just giving up and selling the RPM.

Do you have any official word from RME driver software group that certain Cardbus chipsets, or specific non-"built in" chipsets are officially not supported and will not be in the future?

Sorry for all the questions.

Thanks,
David

*p.s. - FYI my Cardbus Controller has a ENE CB1410 chipset, using Microsoft driver version 6.1.7600.16385 dated 6/21/2006.  And as I mentioned this is a very common Cardbus adapter which has been around for many years.  There really seem to be only 2 PCI Cardbus adapter cards in common use, this one (StarTech) and one made by Cables Unlimited which I believe has a Ricoh chipset.

12 Reply by MC

  • MC
  • MC
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  • Registered: 2007-04-06
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Re: RPM driver not working in Win 7 64 bit

The ENE was a big no-go for quite some time until they came up with better drivers/firmware. I can't remember the details, too long ago. I thought they simply died over that problem as they seemed to have vanished in popular hardware thereafter. You might Google or search this forum for details.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

MC's Website

  • nmbr
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  • Registered: 2011-06-18
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Re: RPM driver not working in Win 7 64 bit

I'm having the exact same problems that David is, only with a Multiface II. Adapter uses the Ricoh chipset.

Are there any known cardbus adapters that do work? I would rather pay for an inexpensive adapter than shell out for PCI HDSP card.

  • Registered: 2011-06-17
  • Posts: 7

Re: RPM driver not working in Win 7 64 bit

Well from the lack of response from anyone from RME for 4 days now, I'm starting to get the impression that RME intentionally prevents the Cardbus card from working with any PCI Cardbus adapters so that you're forced to buy their PCI interface.  Oh well, though the RPM is a great interface I guess it's time to put it up for sale on ebay.

  • From: Germany
  • Registered: 2007-04-10
  • Posts: 9,857

Re: RPM driver not working in Win 7 64 bit

davidg wrote:

Well from the lack of response from anyone from RME for 4 days now, I'm starting to get the impression that RME intentionally prevents the Cardbus card from working with any PCI Cardbus adapters so that you're forced to buy their PCI interface.  Oh well, though the RPM is a great interface I guess it's time to put it up for sale on ebay.

You are free to draw such a conclusion from your oversimplified and technically incorrect assumptions above (as well as others), but of course this has nothing to do with facts...
HeadScratch

There have been users who worked with adapters successfully. Apparently, these were technically better than the one you are using (No, chipset and chipset isn't just the same, particularly in the case of ENE cardbus chipsets). A forum search might help. Maybe even a driver update for the adapter...

And while we certainly don't specifically prevent the Cardbus from working with such adapters, we do not and will not collect data on which ones work and which ones don't. An adapter that works in one PC may not work well in another. The RME PCI or PCIe card is the official solution to run the MF/DF/RPM on a desktop, which we will fully support technically. Not a matter of "forcing" you to buy anything - rather the wish to provide customers with a working solution, without depending on (unknown combinations of) third-party hardware.


Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

RME Support's Website