Hi Johan,
Even though the Tascam D4800 is a nice sounding mixer it's Firewire performance was so so. The UFX or any other of the RME devices will higher performance lower latency drivers across the board.
How many analog channels do you need for these dedicated hardware analog synths?
The UFX only has 12 analog inputs and outputs. The rest are ADAT and AES. You would need AD/DA added to the UFX or hook up the Tascam into the ADAT channels for more than 12.

If you are using Cubase SX 4 or higher then I'm assuming your using "External Instruments" for you hardware synths?
If you add a 2nd AD/DA converter or your Tascam to the ADAT/AES I/O then you do have potential for a slight timing difference the UFX AD/DA and the external AD/DA. This is not a issue unless you are sending the same source to both AD/DA at the same time.
If the sound source are independent then the slight time difference will not make a difference.

If for some reason your computer is too slow or your project is too large to deal with very low latency settings then you can easily configure RME's Total Mix to monitor your hardware synths instead of monitoring though Cubase.

The Tascam is a nice sounding so even though the UFX does sound better over all to the ears as well as on paper it will not be a night and day difference. The biggest things you will notice will be the more reliable drivers and if your getting ride of the Tascam the huge amount of studio space you have now.

The UFX stand alone routing and recording features will be great when you just want to jam when you don't have the computer up or if you want to record something on location or just jamming.

Thanks Chris

Hi Johan,

Your live MIDI should not be noticeably out of Sync with VSTi even at higher buffer settings.
MIDI is not effected by the ASIO buffer size.
The latency would only be effecting the Monitoring of the External Keyboards signal though Cubase.
If your system is too slow to operate at lower buffer settings i.e., 256 (6ms) or lower then you can setup Total Mix FX to monitor your external Keyboards and avoid the added latency of passing though both the ASIO driver and Cubase.
This of course would mean not being able to use VST effects on your HW Keyboards until you have recorded them in as audio into Cubase.
The RME driver is a very efficient even on slower systems so you may be able to keep the buffer setting lower on bigger projects with out clicks. The faster your system the lower you can keep your buffer settings. Some drivers seem to have a brick wall no matter how fast your system is and juts won't work well at the lowest settings.

I've only noticed MIDI built in delay when trying to trigger the same sound in both a VSTi and an external keyboard. Snare drums or high hats can be very noticeable with 16 beats or higher. This was an issue even back in the non computer days between different brand keyboards all having slight difference in the MIDI delay and timing.

If you want to use VST FX on your HW Keyboards then the most effective way to do this is with Cubase's External Instrument feature.

Thanks Chris

Hi Chris,

Thank again however I still do not really get it.

Here is a very simple example:

- I have one VSTI (for example Waldorf attack). I control this VSTI via a midi channel. Cubase automatically also creates an audio channel. I can of course add FX (for example CSR hall) to this audio channel. Very basic I think.

- Now I want to add the sound of a Hardware synth. For this I also create an audio channel. This channel is setup for monitoring the hardware synth. For this audio channel I also want to use VST FX. This makes direct monitoring not an option.
Now because I can not play anything in real time I also create a midi channel to play the notes. So via my midi interface Cubase controles the hardware synth.

The problem is both channels are not in synch. To get this in synch the only way I figured out is to use the track delay in Cubase. The problem is that I have to use my ears to get it in synch. When I enter the total of the input and output latency of my Tascam soundcard it is still out of synch. And it is also not very stable.

Maybe this way of working sounds stupid but this gives me the great advantage that I can control everything without have to record anything (except the end-mix of course).

Will this be stable and can the latency be calculated with the UFX. Another trick or option is of course very welcome.

Regards,

Hi,

Yesterday I tried the external instrument option in Cubase. I got the exact same latency problem as with “normal” monitoring. Although I release it is a handy option for synths with multiple outs.

I also tried different sample buffer settings. The results are all the same. I always have to total the amount of input and output latency of my soundcard and then there is still a latency gap around 12 ms.

I don’t think it has anything to do with my midi interface. I also have a moog LP which has its own USB midi driver. This Moog runs perfectly in synch with my other hardware synths that go via the midi interface. I also don’t think my hardware synths have midi latency’s in the 10 till 20 ms range since they are in synch with each other.

I still think it has something to do with the Tascam. If I route a signal directly to the stereo outs of my Tascam board (so the signal does not come in cubase at all) there is also a 12 MS latency difference with the cubase metronome. My system should be gas enough (I7 quadcore)

I think I go the shop and try to create a similar setup with the UFX and hopefully I become a new happy RME user.

One question to Vinark: how do you know how much ms you must compensate in the external instrument set-up?