• 21ar
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Topic: Fireface UC vs UCX

I would like to know what the differences are besides the obvious firewire connection between the UC and the UCX please?

I am also looking at the UFX. Are the converters on it the same as the UC and UCX? The USB storage option looks interesting, does this mean I need not worry about hard drive performance on my PC, even when recording 16+ tracks? Is it entirely glitch free? Is this something that the DAW must support? I use FL Studio.

I will at some point be interested in a preamp unit connected via ADAT but I have no experience with ADAT. Can I plug any preamp unit into the UFX and control the gains on it through the UFX mixer? And would I be able to use all 8 channels on the preamp plus let's say 8 channels on the UFX at the same time? Will the USB option on the UFX handle this? And does the UFX require both a USB and a Firewire connection or is it either or?

I have heard that some preamp units lower the bitrate when more channels are used at higher sampe rates over ADAT. Would the Octamic series do 8 channels at 96khz 24bit? What's the difference between Octamic II and Octamic D?

Sorry for all the questions but I need them all answered!

  • Knut
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

I would like to know what the differences are besides the obvious firewire connection between the UC and the UCX please?

Please see the last page of the PDF product sheet.

I am also looking at the UFX. Are the converters on it the same as the UC and UCX?

No.

The USB storage option looks interesting, does this mean I need not worry about hard drive performance on my PC, even when recording 16+ tracks? Is it entirely glitch free? Is this something that the DAW must support?

Yes. Yes (if you use the right USB stick or USB harddisc). No, it's complete independent. It works, even when the PC crashes.

And would I be able to use all 8 channels on the preamp plus let's say 8 channels on the UFX at the same time? Will the USB option on the UFX handle this?

Yes. DURec can record all 60 channels if you use the right USB drive - see above.

And does the UFX require both a USB and a Firewire connection or is it either or?

USB or FireWire.

I have heard that some preamp units lower the bitrate when more channels are used at higher sampe rates over ADAT.

No. It reduces the samplerate. Search for SMUX.

Would the Octamic series do 8 channels at 96khz 24bit? What's the difference between Octamic II and Octamic D?

Please see the manuals for both devices.

best regards
Knut

  • 21ar
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

Thanks for that Admin Knut.

The UFX looks OK. I'm confused about AES, if I wanted to connect the Octamic II to the UFX what cable would I use? And after doing that, would I simply see 8 AES channels (and the rest) in my DAW?

I just read the Octamic II manual, the section about word clock sounds really confusing - what's all that stuff about 75ohm resistors about?

What do you mean by the right USB hard drive. What kind of USB hard drives do you recommend for 16 tracks?

  • Knut
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

The UFX provides only 2-channels with the AES/EBU I/O - via XLR cable. Every USB2.0 harddisc should handle 16 tracks without problems. Buy one and test it.

I just read the Octamic II manual, the section about word clock sounds really confusing - what's all that stuff about 75ohm resistors about?

It's about proper termination of the word clock connection.

best regards
Knut

  • 21ar
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

So if I plug the Octamic II into the UFX, an AES connection will only give me channels 1 and 2 from the Ocatmic II?

  • Knut
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

Yes. You need ADAT for 8 channels.

best regards
Knut

7 Reply by 21ar (edited by 21ar 2012-06-21 13:32:28)

  • 21ar
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

Thanks, is it possible to daisy chain two Octamic II preamps into a UCX (the half rack unit)?

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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

No, there is only one ADAT input. You could connect one to analog inputs, though.

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

RME Support's Website

9 Reply by 21ar (edited by 21ar 2012-06-21 15:21:45)

  • 21ar
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

Yes but then I have no control over it in the DAW once it's recorded. I guess daisy chaining is just using the ADAT. I'm leaning more towards the UCX now because I figured the advantages with the UFX are the USB storage and I thought AES could do 8 channels, the extra channels are nice and 2 ADATs is nice (by the way, do 2 ADATs mean I could plug an Octamic II into each ADAT and record 16 channels at the same time?).

You know, what I'm really after is a box with a USB connection, AES with 16 channels and top notch converters. I'd pay £1k for that and spend another couple on a 16 channel preamp.

  • From: Germany
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

21ar wrote:

Yes but then I have no control over it in the DAW once it's recorded.

HeadScratch Why not?


(by the way, do 2 ADATs mean I could plug an Octamic II into each ADAT and record 16 channels at the same time?).

Yes.

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

RME Support's Website

  • Knut
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

(by the way, do 2 ADATs mean I could plug an Octamic II into each ADAT and record 16 channels at the same time?).

... with 44.1 or 48 kHz. Not 96 kHz.

You know, what I'm really after is a box with a USB connection, AES with 16 channels and top notch converters. I'd pay £1k for that ...

RME HDSPe AES with Thunderbolt expansion chassis from Sonnet.

best regards
Knut

  • 21ar
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

RME Support wrote:
21ar wrote:

Yes but then I have no control over it in the DAW once it's recorded.

HeadScratch Why not?

Because I use a software DAW and I'm sticking to a software DAW.

  • From: Germany
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

Sorry, that does not seem to make sense... I was only referring to the digital ADAT I/O port, not to a physical Alesis ADAT tape recorder....


Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

RME Support's Website

14 Reply by 21ar (edited by 21ar 2012-06-22 01:00:19)

  • 21ar
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

Forget that! smile

I'm looking into PCIe cards now. Can I plug the AES output of this card http://www.rme-audio.de/en_products_hdspe_aes.php into the AES input of this card http://www.rme-audio.de/en_products_hdspe_aio.php - if I can, where can I find the correct cable?

So I assume I'd be able to plug my monitors straight into the HDSPE AIO and my headphones too? How do the converters compare to the UFX and UCX? Do I control both cards through TotalMix? Will both cards work OK on Windows 7, I have had problems running two sound devices at the same time on windows. Is the AIO compatible with other AES type soundcards?

Am sorry for so many questions but finally, can I plug 2x Octamic II into the AES input and record 16 channels at the same time? That would need an AES to 16 1/2" jack cable right, does such a thing exist? Or maybe there is such a thing as an AES splitter cable?

EDIT: I'm struggling to understand how to get 16 mic inputs from only 8x AES inputs.

  • Knut
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

I'm looking into PCIe cards now. Can I plug the AES output of this card http://www.rme-audio.de/en_products_hdspe_aes.php into the AES input of this card http://www.rme-audio.de/en_products_hdspe_aio.php - if I can, where can I find the correct cable?

In this setup it's possible to use two OctaMics II and 16 channels with the HDSPe AES via two D-sub15 cables, but there is no free connection left for the AIO. It could be possible to get a free AES output for the AIO with two D-Sub to XLR cables (e. g. this ALVA cable).

I'm struggling to understand how to get 16 mic inputs from only 8x AES inputs.

AES/EBU is a stereo format. 1 x AES/EBU input = 2 channels.

best regards
Knut

16 Reply by 21ar (edited by 21ar 2012-06-22 12:21:11)

  • 21ar
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

OK thanks, but 1 mic is a mono channel. So it's not possible to send 16 mic channels through 1 8x AES connection? And how is it possible to get a stereo signal from a single XLR connection?

  • Knut
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

OK thanks, but 1 mic is a mono channel. So it's not possible to send 16 mic channels through 1 8x AES connection?

8 x AES = 16 channels.

And how is it possible to get a stereo signal from a single XLR connection?

With a digital AES connection it is. With an analog signal it is not.

best regards
Knut

18 Reply by 21ar (edited by 21ar 2012-06-22 14:02:26)

  • 21ar
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

How would I get 16 mic channels into a single 8x AES connection and would I be able to control each of the 16 channels separately in TotalMix?

  • Knut
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

How would I get 16 mic channels into a single 8x AES connection

You don't get 16 mic channels into a single connection. OctaMic and HDSPe AES provide 8 channels in a single connection. For 16 mic channels you need 2 x OctaMics or 2 x Micstasy and two D-sub cables.

and would I be able to control each of the 16 channels separately in TotalMix?

I'am not sure what you want to do. You control the analog gain of the mic pres on the OctaMic. After the conversion to the digital world you can record each channel in your audio software. TotalMix is a monitoring mixer and has nothing to do with the recording level of these channels. But you can control the monitoring volume of every channel in TotalMix.

best regards
Knut

20 Reply by 21ar (edited by 21ar 2012-06-22 16:59:31)

  • 21ar
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

Agh that image helps, thought one slot was for input and the other for output. I don't think that card is going to be suitable for me.

I'm now considering the RayDat but not sure if it needs the word clock card too? Here is how I imagine it ..

Input = Octamic II ADAT out -> RayDat ADAT in
Output = RayDat AES out using breakout cable -> ADI-2 AES in -> XLR out to monitors and 1/4" to headphone amp (manual says it's OK to use both at the same time)

So my main concern is word clock. Will this setup allow me to record 16+ channels at 44.1khz 24bit, are you sure the bit depth doesn't change as more channels are added?

And I would like to know how the Octamic II converters compare to the UFX converters?

  • Knut
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

Agh that image helps, thought one slot was for input and the other for output. I don't think that card is going to be suitable for me.

This is the common AES/EBU format. It works in 8 channels (4 x XLR Input + 4 x XLR output). The D-sub connector of the HDSPe AES port fits the connectors of the OctaMics or Micstasy.

So my main concern is word clock. Will this setup allow me to record 16+ channels at 44.1khz 24bit, are you sure the bit depth doesn't change as more channels are added?

The bit depth (24 bit) will not change. With 96 kHz you need two ADAT inputs of the RayDAT for the recording of all eight OctaMic channels (S/MUX).
Keep in mind, one OctaMic does not provide 16 channels - only eight. See above. 

In your setup the RayDAT should be clock slave for the OctaMic II. Both devices get the clock via a digital connection from the OctaMic. If you want to run the RayDAT as master you need the WCM option board with a word clock output. Or a D-Sub25 to XLR cable for the OctaMic. It gets the clock from the XLR output of the RayDAT.

And I would like to know how the Octamic II converters compare to the UFX converters?

Both are very good.

best regards
Knut

22 Reply by 21ar (edited by 21ar 2012-06-23 16:34:00)

  • 21ar
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Re: Fireface UC vs UCX

That all makes perfect sense thanks.

For 96khz, I would use the Main AND the Aux output from the Octamic and send them into seperate RayDAT ADAT inputs? So in theory I can run 16 channels at 96/24 into the RayDAT?

What happens if I put 2 Octamic II into the RayDAT, what needs to be master then? Why would I want the RayDAT to be master, are there any advantages/disadvantages? And I assume you mean the XLR out from the DSub AES ouput on the RayDAT, so is S/PDIF OK for monitoring? Doesn't that termination thing become an issue with S/PDIF? I have a really excellent pair of monitors so need the best possible monitor signal.