1 (edited by orange 2020-12-01 17:54:00)

Topic: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

Been working with TotalMix whilst I wait for my new ARC controller and found a couple of issues:

First TotalMix doesn't seem to save it's settings on a reboot.

Looking at the XML files in /users/username/appdata/local/totalmixfx - the files DO get updated if you manually exit totalmix (right click on taskbar icon)  but DO NOT on a reboot.  I assume that TotalMix doesn't exit cleanly if you reboot ? Can this be fixed ?

It potentially means your volume may come back on FULL VOLUME yikes or randomly from whatever the last save was.

Searching through these forums I see people reporting similar things in the past - but no real conclusion.

To confirm - not a permission issue as it does write on manual close - but not on reboot

Another very minor issue - if you resize the window so that not all the channels are shown you get a small red < 1 2 > under the right hand side of the HARDWARE INPUTS.  Both 1 and 2 buttons do the same thing = 2. Arrow buttons are fine, so are HARDWARE OUTPUT buttons

Windows 10 20H2
Totalmix 1.67

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

orange wrote:

Another very minor issue - if you resize the window so that not all the channels are shown you get a small red < 1 2 > under the right hand side of the HARDWARE INPUTS.  Both 1 and 2 buttons do the same thing = 2. Arrow buttons are fine, so are HARDWARE OUTPUT buttons

^^^ignore this one - user error smile  should have read the manual

3 (edited by ramses 2020-12-01 17:27:18)

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

Store the desired volume settings to a TM FX Snapshot.

Then change two TM FX settings in Preferences (F2):

1. Snapshots -> Do not load "--"
2. Devices Handling -> [x] Always init DSP devices with TotalMix FX settings

Problem should be solved then.

Maybe my step by step guide for a 1st setup will help additionally: https://www.tonstudio-forum.de/blog/ind … rnal-equi/

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

4 (edited by orange 2020-12-01 17:50:24)

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

ramses wrote:

Store the desired volume settings to a TM FX Snapshot.

Then change two TM FX settings in Preferences (F2):

1. Snapshots -> Do not load "--"
2. Devices Handling -> [x] Always init DSP devices with TotalMix FX settings

Problem should be solved then.

Appreciate the thought but that doesn't fix the problem and it's not a Snapshot issue ?  I'm running this on a Raydat so the DSP devices setting will have no effect.

I know I can save levels by hand and restore 'preset' levels but the settings are supposed to be saved on exit.  There are a few ways to minimise the problem but I want the level on boot to be the same as the level on exit.  Which is what is supposed to happen.   There as several post from Matthias explaining that.

If I am going to have to write snapshots or workspaces everytime I change levels then it would be way quicker to just exit total mix with the right click "exit totalmix fx" option....if I remember !

The problem is actually bigger than this - none of the settings are saved on a basic reboot - that includes preferences.  The only way to guarantee a save is to exit cleanly NOT reboot.

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

> but the settings are supposed to be saved on exit

AFAIR the settings are saved on the device and after a reboot TM FX usually recognizes a difference
that the settings on the device are more recent compared to what has been stored in the snapshot.

The settings that I proposed to you take care, that your device always starts with the stored TM FX settings,
so that you get a defined volume level and routing.

I understood you, that you want to have a defined volume level after reboot of your system.
This is the way it goes and works for me...

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

Hi Ramses

the settings are stored on exit - there are various xml files in the /user/appdata/  directory.  These contain a 'last state' setting.

On a Raydata NO settings are stored on the device - I suspect on the DSP versions only the DSP settings are saved but I don't know about that.

What is supposed to happen is that Totalmix writes these settings to the file on a quit - and reloads them on a restart.  This doesn't happen when you (I?) reboot.  This includes other settings such as preferences.


I know how to set a 'default' (safe?) startup volume level - but that's not the issue.

7 (edited by orange 2020-12-01 18:16:53)

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

just tried 1.70 b5 same issue - as expected

The question is how do you force a file write during the chaos of a Windows shutdown request...  Hopefully M.C. can answer that.

smile


edit - thinking aloud.

Maybe TotalMix should be run as a windows service rather than an application ?  Or maybe there should be a 'shutdown script' that exit Totalmix

MC - are there any command line arguments  for totalmix ?

8 (edited by ramses 2020-12-01 18:36:45)

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

Why do you not simply store the lastest status, that you want to have stored ?

It works for me very well to start the PC and start with a TM FX standard / initial routing.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

ramses wrote:

Why do you not simply store the lastest status, that you want to have stored ?

It works for me very well to start the PC and start with a TM FX standard / initial routing.

As I keep saying.  I know various ways to workaround it (just exit it gracefully!) and I know how to set some low volume initial defaults....  but with the very greatest of respect you're not understanding the full nature of the issue.

If you are using a separate remote - then you may not ever have Totalmix actually open.  So before you quit it's an extra thing to remember when it should work as it's supposed to.

If your workaround solution works for you then that's great but that's missing the point I feel - This problem applies to all your preferences NOT JUST levels and routings.  So 'snapshots' or 'initial levels' are not going to fix that.  There is a problem that needs resolving IMO

10

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

It's quite easy: TM FX stores settings on shutdown for about 100,000 users, but not for you. So what is different on your machine?

I do not see how we can fix something that works. To me it looks like you don't have a standard Windows installation or use a standard Windows shutdown or use special tools that interfere or have a special computer (hardware) that makes such things fail. 'Such things' here means that Windows notifies all currently running programs of shutdown and waits until these have written their data before switching the computer off.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

MC wrote:

It's quite easy: TM FX stores settings on shutdown for about 100,000 users, but not for you. So what is different on your machine?

well every windows PC is different - it's the nature of the beast.  I don't believe there is anything specifically different about my PC

you say 100,000 users - but I see many other posts saying people are having the same problem - any many other probably have the same problem but never actually notice.  I had never noticed until I decided to use the RME ARC

MC wrote:

I do not see how we can fix something that works.

It's not working for me and for at least some others that have bothered to post.  And maybe you can't 'fix' it but you could investigate making it more reliable - or take an interest in finding why it fails for some users. IIRC The release notes for v1.5 even mention that you made writing settings on exit more reliable.

MC wrote:

To me it looks like you don't have a standard Windows installation or use a standard Windows shutdown or use special tools that interfere or have a special computer (hardware) that makes such things fail. 'Such things' here means that Windows notifies all currently running programs of shutdown and waits until these have written their data before switching the computer off.

As I said - this is a standard windows PC - the only thing 'special' about is is the RME PCIe card.  I initiate a shutdown using the standard 'start menu' shortcut.  Event log is 100% clean.

I can see this is a non-issue for you which is disappointing - I always buy RME, not for the audio quality but for the quality of the software and drivers so I was expecting better.

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

See manual ch 26.7.1
https://www.rme-audio.de/download/fface_ufxplus_d.pdf
https://www.rme-audio.de/download/fface_ufxplus_e.pdf

I crosschecked on my new installation of windows 10 pro 20H2.
TotalMix FX writes/updates it's config file if you exit the program.

I see here no relationship to ARC USB (which I also use). Whether you use it or not it's TM FX alone who writes this file.

Could you kindly tell the exact steps (narrowed down to the minimum) for reproducing the issue?
and exactly telling what you expect to see and what the issue is.
And please a Screenshot of preferences -> Snapshot / Device handling

I am not sure whether it helps, but I could try to cross check those "easy to reproduceable" steps
with an UFX+, ARC USB and TM FX 1.66.

And tbh .. I currently do not see any relationship to ARC USB, as this is only the remote controller.

Maybe try what I did here.
Look at C:\Users\<username>\AppData\Local\TotalMixFX
Look at the timestamp of the file, in my case "last.FirefaceUFX+1.xml"
Quit TM FX (really quit, not close).
Check that the timestamp changed.
Repeat this with ARC USB and without ARC USB ...

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

13 (edited by orange 2020-12-02 10:27:12)

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

ramses wrote:

See manual ch 26.7.1
https://www.rme-audio.de/download/fface_ufxplus_d.pdf
https://www.rme-audio.de/download/fface_ufxplus_e.pdf

I crosschecked on my new installation of windows 10 pro 20H2.
TotalMix FX writes/updates it's config file if you exit the program.

I see here no relationship to ARC USB (which I also use). Whether you use it or not it's TM FX alone who writes this file.

Could you kindly tell the exact steps (narrowed down to the minimum) for reproducing the issue?
and exactly telling what you expect to see and what the issue is.
And please a Screenshot of preferences -> Snapshot / Device handling

I am not sure whether it helps, but I could try to cross check those "easy to reproduceable" steps
with an UFX+, ARC USB and TM FX 1.66.

And tbh .. I currently do not see any relationship to ARC USB, as this is only the remote controller.

Maybe try what I did here.
Look at C:\Users\<username>\AppData\Local\TotalMixFX
Look at the timestamp of the file, in my case "last.FirefaceUFX+1.xml"
Quit TM FX (really quit, not close).
Check that the timestamp changed.
Repeat this with ARC USB and without ARC USB ...


Ramses

I'm not sure what you are pointing towards in the manual ?

YES - we agree - TotalMix writes/updates it's config files when you exit the program  - 100% - I stated that in the first post (read it again!)

what it DOES NOT do is write it's files when you reboot...which is what is supposed to do.  According to MC it does for everybody else but me (not true obviously)

Can you try a reboot WITHOUT exiting TotalMix and see if it writes it's files ?

(happy to explain the ARC issue separately but not relevant for this test)

REPRO:

1 - boot your PC and login if necessary
2 - open the folder C:\Users\<username>\AppData\Local\TotalMixFX and look at the timestamps
3 - DO NOT open the TotalMix GUI
4 - DO NOT "Exit TotalMix FX"
5 - DO not actually do anything (have a coffee:) )
6 - reboot (not shutdown as 'fast startup setting may be having an effect here)
7 - open the folder C:\Users\<username>\AppData\Local\TotalMixFX and look at the timestamps

were these files updated when you rebooted (step 2 different from step 7) ?

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

I can confirm that during a normal reboot of Win 10
TM FX doesn't update the file "last.FirefaceUFX+1.xml" even if I perform changes in TM FX.

The timestamp of this file only becomes updated when I quit TM FX
by rightclicking the icon in the Windows info field and selecting "Exit TotalMix FX".

Windows 10 Pro 20H2, fresh installation from 25.10.20
OS Build: 19042.630
RME UFX+
MADIface Driver: 0.9723, TotalMix FX: v1.66 (installed by driver)

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

ramses wrote:

I can confirm that during a normal reboot of Win 10
TM FX doesn't update the file "last.FirefaceUFX+1.xml" even if I perform changes in TM FX.

great - that's 2 of the 100,000 users that MC mentioned that have the problem

you PC must be 'special' too smile

happy to explain the potential issue with the ARC if you like (mine has just turned up)

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

I just checked that it makes no difference whether you have the ARC USB connected or not.

Sometimes I see on reboot a Windows message that TotalMix FX hinders the newstart of the PC,
but after a few seconds the restart is being performed...

Could this be an indication that TM FX is maybe still active, trying to update the config, but somehow fails ?

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

the issue isn't if the ARC is connected or not.

the issue is that your preferences are not saved unless you right click "exit totalmix FX"

It's not just levels or mute states but all your button assignments on the ARC - in fact ANY of your preferences.

There are some settings that are saved in the registry (basically window locations) but everything else is in the xml files.

You have the same 'bug' but you never knew - According to MC that is not what is supposed to happen.    I've tried various methods of slowing the but - but the way that windows sends the 'quit' signal to TotalMix means it doesn't save

The workaround is to ALWAYS exit Totalmix with the right-click then everything works properly

I bet most have the same issue but have never actually checked -there are plenty of reports on this forum (and others) of the same issue.

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

I just see, that I do not have the latest TotalMix FX version which is 0.9734.
I will re-try with this version.
In the readmy I found two things
1. with the new driver you get TM FX 1.67
2. in the forum there is a download version of TM FX 1.70.

In the README I found this note: for driver version 0.9728.
- Optimized shut down procedure. This is another attempt to reduce the harmless but annoying crash message of TM FX that some users experience when shutting down the computer.

Maybe this is related to the issue or introduced the issue.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

Please read the thread again

I've been using v1.67 and tried the new 1.7b5 beta

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

I checked this now with
0.9734 + TMFX 1.67   -> no update of that file
0.9734 + TMFX 1.7b5 -> no update of that file
I gave my user Administrator rights, same issue

Now I see on reboot only the message that outlook is being closed.
But no change on the filestamp during a reboot.

Another issue with TM FX 1.7b5 I posted here:
https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.ph … 18#p162118

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

ramses

(replied to your other thread)

thanks for confirming the issue

remember this means that NONE of your setting are saved (including ARC key assignments) unless you actually EXIT gracefully

22 (edited by michele.picaro 2020-12-09 18:08:02)

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

3 of 100.000 here smile
Exactly the same issue. I've posted it in October.
https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=31657


Last official drivers (0.9734): problem persist
I'm a c#/c++ developer so I think that I know how this things works.
It's not excluded that win10 can be the cause but it can be investigated with TotalMix source files only.

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

michele.picaro wrote:

3 of 100.000 here smile
Exactly the same issue. I've posted it in October.
https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=31657


Last official drivers (0.9734): problem persist
I'm a c#/c++ developer so I think that I know how this thinks works.
It's not excluded that win10 can be the cause but it can be investigated with TotalMix source files only.

yes I saw your post - there are loads of posts with the same problem smile

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

orange wrote:

yes I saw your post - there are loads of posts with the same problem smile

I think that most of users doesn't know that TM should save settings on close...so it's all ok for them.

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

michele.picaro wrote:
orange wrote:

yes I saw your post - there are loads of posts with the same problem smile

I think that most of users doesn't know that TM should save settings on close...so it's all ok for them.

yes, even people with nearly 7,000 posts on here didn't even know smile

It wouldn't be quite so bad if it was just the mix that you lost - but it's EVERY setting.

The could improve this so easily by making the 'OK' button on preferences actually write the file - although I'd prefer a proper fix

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

orange wrote:

although I'd prefer a proper fix

Me too. It's annoying. It's a pity because RME cards are excellent!

27

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

Please try this version:

http://www.rme-audio.de/downloads/total … n_1702.zip

As usual exit TM FX first, then copy the file into Windows\System32, then start it by a double-click or reboot.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

MC wrote:

Please try this version:

http://www.rme-audio.de/downloads/total … n_1702.zip

As usual exit TM FX first, then copy the file into Windows\System32, then start it by a double-click or reboot.


that seems to have worked - tested with a couple of PCs and a few reboots smile

thanks again - much appreciated.

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

Many thanks. this solves the issue for me, changes to TM FX settings are now properly remembered after reboot.

Another problem remains for me. The workspace is not being restored in terms of
- size and location of the TotalMix FX window
- channel size (normal, narrow)

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub13

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

the window size is a registry entry I think - so a different issue ?

narrow/wide should be part of the snapshot ? is that data in the last.device.xml file ?

take a look and you might be able to tell

31

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

Final version will be available most probably on Monday, including information about the various fixes.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

MC wrote:

Please try this version:

http://www.rme-audio.de/downloads/total … n_1702.zip

As usual exit TM FX first, then copy the file into Windows\System32, then start it by a double-click or reboot.

Great! I've read this now. I'll update later and I'll try it but if to orange user works I think that it solve my issue too.
Can I know what was the cause? Is it linked to windows features/updates?

I enable subscription to this topic now.

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

michele.picaro wrote:
MC wrote:

Please try this version:

http://www.rme-audio.de/downloads/total … n_1702.zip

As usual exit TM FX first, then copy the file into Windows\System32, then start it by a double-click or reboot.

Great! I've read this now..

yes, seems to be still fine here smile

34 (edited by michele.picaro 2020-12-21 12:04:54)

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

Ok found log notes:
- Windows only: Fixed an internal messaging error that could cause the current state not to be saved on shutdown in certain setting configurations (for example Host server active or MIDI in use)

I use midi device to control master volume. Maybe midi loop or some lock on it causes crash on windows closing.
Orange, do you use any of that (Host server or midi)?

35

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

But you didn't find the thread?

https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=32074

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

MC wrote:

But you didn't find the thread?

https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=32074

Yes found. Log notes reported by me has been taken from there.
But can I know which was the cause of save issue? Technically. Just for curiosity...

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

michele.picaro wrote:

Orange, do you use any of that (Host server or midi)?

Neither of those apply to me as far as I can tell - host server is switched off and nothing midi active.  ARC was connected so maybe that counts as midi.

Those were only given as examples of the 'internal messaging error' - maybe it's not worth the time worrying about it ?

38 (edited by OakBloodThree 2023-08-04 14:39:32)

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

I was having a similar problem and found a solution that may help.

If you check the "Store Setting for ✅ All Users" while logged in as User1, then User2 will not be able to uncheck it, since Windows does not grant access to the C:\Users\User1 folder.  User1's settings will keep loading after reboot regardless of changes made by User2.  TM FX would generate user data xml files for User2, but would ignore them.

This is on a non-networked home system running Windows 10 Pro with two local users.

What I did:
Make sure each user has a workspace backup saved to a file.

Log in as each user.
Exit TM FX (right-click tray icon).

Delete the last.Interface.xml and all the rme.totalmix.* files in the user folder.

Delete the corresponding files from the All Users folder.  The manual (at least for UFX II) doesn't give this location for Windows 10.  It is: C:\Program Data\TotalMixFX

Log out and back in to make sure "All Users" is unchecked.

I'm sure there is a simpler fix (maybe not all steps are strictly necessay), but this seems to have worked.

39

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

We are on TM FX v 1.84 right now. Which version did you use to come to these results?

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

40 (edited by waedi 2023-08-04 04:24:02)

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

MC wrote:

We are on TM FX v 1.84 right now. Which version did you use to come to these results?

Having 1.83, is 1.84 available ?
May be you are working on 1.84 and it's coming soon ?

M1-Sonoma, Madiface Pro, Digiface USB, Babyface silver and blue

41

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

1.84 fixed a first-time installation bug under Windows, but Mac 1.84 only a small bug in the Channel Layout dialog that no one ever noticed, so Mac drivers have not been updated from 1.83. Download from the usual links:

https://www.rme-audio.de/downloads/tmfx_win_184.zip

https://www.rme-audio.de/downloads/tmfx_mac_184.zip

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: Totalmix FX not saving settings on reboot

MC wrote:

We are on TM FX v 1.84 right now. Which version did you use to come to these results?

This was on 1.84.

Maybe worth noting: I think TM FX was originally installed by User1, but the most recent update was performed while logged in as User2.