Topic: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

My ISP has provided a new hybrid router/nmodem. This connects ethernet and wifi signals to the internet by means of both DSL and the cellular.network.

Total Mix Remote on my iPad no longer works with Total Mix on my desktop. When I awake the iPad it says connected, but after 5 secs this changes to offline. I have examined all the options in the router menu and can find nothing that (to me) obviously controls this.

It is frustrating not to be able to use TM remote! It worked fine with previous router/modems.

Any help greatly appreciated.

David

Classical ambisonic surround recording: UFX, FF400, Alesis HD24, Edirol R-44/88, Samplitude ProX 3.

2

Re: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

TM FX Remote uses UDP for communication. Check if there is a setting in the router where this can be enabled. Or it is much simpler - new router means new network address - check the settings on the iPad and the host.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

3 (edited by ramses 2020-05-30 12:29:18)

Re: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

> When I awake the iPad it says connected, but after 5 secs this changes to offline.

What "says connected" ? Do you mean the iPADs WLAN connectivity ?
Or do you mean the TotalMix FX remote application ?

If you changed the DSL router it could be the case, that you get another DHCP pool and also other IPs.
Maybe the IP adress and port number of TotalMix on the Desktop PC does not fit anymore with the
IP address and port number, that you initially configured in the TotalMix Remote application on your iPAD.

First we need to ensure/check
- whether there is communication between the devices and
- that IP addresses do not change just in case you are using DHCP services which is much likely

For that I need to ask you a couple of question in regards to your network:

1. Whats the IP address, Netmask, default GW of Desktop PC, iPAD and new router ?

2. Are both, PC and iPAD, using Wireless LAN (WLAN) ? Or only the iPAD ?
    If both devices use WLAN, then you need to check whether WLAN devices are allowed to "see" /
    "communicate with" each other.

    This you can e.g. check by trying a ping the IP address of the iPAD from the Desktop PC.
    Alternatively check this on the DSL router itself.
    My Fritzbox has such an option under WLAN -> Security
    [x] Die unten angezeigten aktiven WLAN-Geräte dürfen untereinander kommunizieren
         translated: The active WLAN devices shown below may communicate with each other
    For other devices you might find this under a different place and using a different wording....

3. Which devices use DHCP or which use static configuration of IP address, netmask, default GW, DNS server ?

Can you successfully ping from Desktop PC to iPAD ?

From theory .. how it should work .. what you need to perform on the application:

a) Desktop PC - where the recording device is connected to
    If you enable Network Remote settings in TM FX, then it takes the IP address of the network adapter
    and - if you need - you can change the port number for this application, default: 7009
    On this side you can not do much wrong.
    You only need to ensure, that this PC always gets this IP address, either by static configuration
    or by configuring DHCP services in your DSL router, to give the DHCP clients always the same IP.
    This is usually not enabled by default, check this in the DHCP services of your DSL router.

b) On the TotalMix Remote client / iPAD:
    Ensure that this device is in the same LAN as your Desktop PC (or you need to set a proper default GW entry).
    Ensure that from iPAD you can ping the Desktop PC's IP address.
    If iPAD has no ping utility or if you do not find: then try it vice versa to ping the IP of iPAD from the PC.
    If ping does not work, then this indicates already a problem.
    Otherwise ... if the devices are in the same LAN and can ping each other, then there should be no issue.
    On iPAD in TotalMix FX Remote you only need to enter the proper IP address and port number of the Desktop PC.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14

Re: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

The IP numbers on the network did not change when I installed the new router/modem. I just had to change the SSID. Everything works as with the old router, except controlling TotalMIx on the desktop from the iPad. I can successfully ping the iPad from the desktop. I have no means of doing the reverse. The iPad connects to the router by WIFI and thereby successfully to the Internet. The computer connects to the router by Ethernet: it has no WIFI.

Matthias: There is a Port Mapping page which mentions UDP. It asks for a range of internal and external ports and can be configured for TCP, UDP or TCP/UDP. I chose TCP/UDP and put 7009 in all the port boxes. Does this make sense to you? It is not clear to me what answers I should give, or whether other customization is required.

Router Model is Huawei HA35-22

David

Classical ambisonic surround recording: UFX, FF400, Alesis HD24, Edirol R-44/88, Samplitude ProX 3.

5 (edited by ramses 2020-05-30 17:26:34)

Re: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

From your description its still not clear to me whether TM Remote on the iPAD connects to the TM FX counterpart on the PC.
Maybe even works for a little while and then after a few seconds of operation fails or something like this.

You said:
> When I awake the iPad it says connected, but after 5 secs this changes to offline.

What means "this changes to offline" .. ? What do you mean with "this" and "offline"?

Could you perhaps post a picture or a short video what happens ?

To your question of port forwarding
and another idea for troubleshooting other potential issues that can happen and can lead to instability problems.

The configuration of port forwarding is only required if you want to access a device from your internal network from external (from internet). From your description the communication between Desktop PC and iPAD happens on the internal LAN. From internal LAN to (also internal) WLAN and vice versa. If both devices can ping each other, then you should theoretically have no issue with the IP communication between both devices (be it using tcp or udp).

But even if both devices can ping each other you might have other issues:

Did you check already for
- a bad network cable or
- speed/duplex Problems on the LAN connection between router and Desktop PC ?

Speed / Duplex problems are tricky. Traffic with only a few packets like ping goes through, but as soon as you have more traffic then you run into issues. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duplex_mismatch

And you are sure that in TM FX remote on the iPAD you configured the proper IP address and port number of Desktop PC and proper port where the application is listening to ? Could you kindly provide a screenshot of TM FX Remote configuration on PC side and iPAD side ?

And any impact of Firewall configured on the PC, that might block UDP, can be excluded ?

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14

6

Re: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

So does TM FX not work in both ways (when moving faders) or only in one?

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

>You said:
> When I awake the iPad it says connected, but after 5 secs this changes to offline.

>What means "this changes to offline" .. ? What do you mean with "this" and "offline"?

The iPad app says Connected" at the top RH corner. 5 secs awakening the app  it says "offline".

>And you are sure that in TM FX remote on the iPAD you configured the proper IP address and port number of Desktop PC and proper port where the application is listening to ?

Yes

> And any impact of Firewall configured on the PC, that might block UDP, can be excluded ?

In the Properties of the Windows 10 Firewall, UDP Protocol is listed for TotalMix FX.

Classical ambisonic surround recording: UFX, FF400, Alesis HD24, Edirol R-44/88, Samplitude ProX 3.

8 (edited by david-p 2020-05-30 17:59:53)

Re: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

MC wrote:

So does TM FX not work in both ways (when moving faders) or only in one?

Moving faders on the iPad does nothing in TM on the computer. Similarly the iPad app never shows the state of TM, either control states or signal levels.

When I turn the Windows Defender firewall off, there is no improvement.

The impression is that there is no connection between the iPad app and the desktop in either dfirection.

Classical ambisonic surround recording: UFX, FF400, Alesis HD24, Edirol R-44/88, Samplitude ProX 3.

9 (edited by ramses 2020-05-30 18:08:37)

Re: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

EDITED, sry pls read again.

According your assumption, correct, I have such a suspicion as well, the question is, by what this is caused.

If you could kindly check for speed duplex or cable problems on the network adapter of the PC, this would be still somethnig that you could / should check to exclude problems in this area.

The next thing would be a sniffer trace on the Desktop PC using "Wireshark" to check whether application traffic from the iPAD arrives on the Desktop PC. This is theoretically not too hard and could eventually be done by yourself.
At least you could try.

If there is no communcation this would be bad, then somewhere the traffic is blocked (-> Firewall, Windows / iPAD ?) or you are using bad IP addresses (configuration mistake).

If there is communication, then somebody would need to analyse whether the communication looks fine between those two devices.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14

Re: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

ramses wrote:

Many thanks David, if you could kindly check for speed duplex problems on the network adapter of the PC, this would be the last thing that you could / should check. Otherwise I have currently no idea at the moment, sorry.

#

I have no idea how to check this, but I get no other problems with sending and receiving, which often happens simultaneously.

The TotalMix connection never missed a beat with the previous router. Basically all I did was to change the router (which is provided by my ISP) and replaced the default SSID and password with what I was using with the previous modem.

Classical ambisonic surround recording: UFX, FF400, Alesis HD24, Edirol R-44/88, Samplitude ProX 3.

11 (edited by ramses 2020-05-30 18:30:09)

Re: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

BTW, I re-edited my post #9 ...
But as you repeat telling, you simply exchanged the router, etc etc ...

It could still be the case that you use DHCP and that both devices got different IP addresses now.

Now as you looked at the IP address of both devices and performed ping .. you did it now with proper IPs, as you just looked them up.

I have still the suspicion, that you have still an old / invalid IP address configured in TM Remote on the iPAD.
If your devices got other IP addresses by DHCP now, then you need to change the configuration on the iPAD and configure the new proper IP addresses of your PC .... has this been checked by you ?
I assume the iPAD still tries to connect to the old IP of the Desktop PC but this IP changed now (most likely) ! Pls Check.

EDITED:

You never mentioned explicitely the IPs and netmasks that are configured on both devices, so it was not possible to tell explicitely whether there is a configuration problem . I simply have to assume this now.

A screenshot of the IP/netmasks of both devices (PC, iPAD) would be helpful and
a screenshot of the IP configuration in TM Remote on the iPAD.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14

12 (edited by david-p 2020-05-31 09:39:10)

Re: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

ramses wrote:

EDITED, sry pls read again.

According your assumption, correct, I have such a suspicion as well, the question is, by what this is caused.

If you could kindly check for speed duplex or cable problems on the network adapter of the PC, this would be still somethnig that you could / should check to exclude problems in this area.

Nothing has changed in the desktop. It worked fine with the last two routers. Since the problem arose when the router was changed, it must be configuration of the router.

RME instructions are to set the IP of the host machine, which hasnt changed, and port 7009. These settings are on the iPad as they have been since the remote app was introduced. They are also set the same in the desktop Toitalmix. UDP was apparently set automatically by the first installation on the desktop, because I never had to do that by hand.

All other functions requiring the iPad to connect to the router, including Skype, etc, work normally.. The desktop also works fine with Skype and other simultaneous down and uploads iwth its Ethernet connection to the router. Apart from TotalMix, I have no programs that need to communicate from the desktop to the iPad directly. In Command Window, I can ping the iPad successfully (no packets lost). Fing on the iPad sees the desktop and pings to it successfully. Fing on the iPhone pings the desktop and iPad successfully. They are all on the same WIFI network..

There must be something else that is set incorrectly in the router for communication between the iPAsd and the desktop.

What?

Classical ambisonic surround recording: UFX, FF400, Alesis HD24, Edirol R-44/88, Samplitude ProX 3.

13 (edited by ramses 2020-05-31 10:53:24)

Re: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

You need to check whether the applications on iPAD and PC communicate over network.

I would install Wireshark on the PC and take a sniffertrace to check that: https://www.wireshark.org/

You know source and destination ip address and the protocol number 7009.
By this you can filter in Wireshark for this network communication.

Tip: do not use "promiscuous mode" to see only the interesting traffic from/to your machine.

Good luck with that.

P.S.: I am not sure whether you feel comforatbly with such things and support only via forum has its limitations.
The best might be to contact official RME support to work on that and to align on further actions.

P.S.: you should also ensure, that you revert any NAT / port forwarding settings in the router in regards to port 7009 !!
NAT / port worwarding is not required in your setup and maybe this is causing issues.
This one could also see in a sniffer trace with wireshark (if there is no communication between iPAD and PC...
Traffic between iPAD and PC will definitively go via Router, because the router bridges LAN and WLAN.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14

14 (edited by david-p 2020-06-12 10:01:26)

Re: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

After several sessions, I finally fixed this problem, which was that in the two weeks between me installing a new router/modem, the settings of my Windows 10 firewalls were radically reconfigured wihtout my knowledge. As I am the only one who has access to the system, I can only conjecture that it had something to do with a Windows 10 upgrade.

Thanks to Matthias and Ramses for their support!

David

Classical ambisonic surround recording: UFX, FF400, Alesis HD24, Edirol R-44/88, Samplitude ProX 3.

Re: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

Nice that you found it finally and many thanks for your verbose feedback how to solve it.
Surely also very helpful for others with similar issues.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14

16

Re: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

david-p wrote:

After several sessions, I finally fixed this problem, which was that in the two weeks between me installing a new router/modem, the settings of my Windows 10 firewalls were radically reconfigured wihtout my knowledge. As I am the only one who has access to the system, I can only conjecture that it had something to do with a Windows 10 upgrade.

How does this match this statement:

david-p wrote:

When I turn the Windows Defender firewall off, there is no improvement.

Also we added a detection that usually throws a firewall warning dialog when TM FX and TM Remote are blocked by a firewall. This dialog is quite reliable. So even with your explanation and a now working system (good!) this stays quite mysterious.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: Total Mix Remote not working with new modem/router

The only conclusion I can reach is that the firewall settings were changed by a Windows 10 update.

I discovered that there are two ways to interact with the firewalls in Win 10. The first of these, which I knew from Windows 7, allows turning off the public network firewall without the user knowing that the private network one is still active. The second method shows both settings and it took me some time before I discovered this second method by accident.

Having acquired a Raspberry Pi 4 LInux machine for less than €100, I am tempted to use it exclusively for all internet interactions, and revert to Windows 7 on my audio machines.

David

Classical ambisonic surround recording: UFX, FF400, Alesis HD24, Edirol R-44/88, Samplitude ProX 3.