uhm how can you measure output loudness in a headphone?

Sorry didn't mean to be raw in my reply, I have DBFS faders also on my DAW and meters like Digicheck etc., so I'm not so sure about what the mentioned output level refers to.

I try to rephrase my question: is there any cons in using Hi-Gain output level in RME configuration panel versus +4dBu for 300 ohm headphones (distortion, potential risk of damaging something and so) or is it ok?

I am thinking Hi-gain on a high impedance headphone is similar to using an headphone amplifier, that for this kind of situation usually brings to better overall audio quality...

Thanks,
    Mario

https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.ph … 05#p166005
https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.ph … 11#p166011

The reason for my reply was in return to post #6, not to listen too loud...

In terms of your original question my proposal:
- Save the the two different reference level settings to two different snapshots.
- Ensure, that the resulting volume is exactly the same.
- Loop audio for ~15-20 seconds where you think that you can detect audio deviations best

Perform blind tests to compare A/B with the help of a friend, so that you never know whether A or B is being used.
Do you hear an audible difference with the two different reference level settings at the same final volume level ?
Repeat tests multiple times. Can you exactly say whether its A or B ?
Pls check and keep what suits best to you.

I would guess, that you might have higher SNR when choosing the Reflevel settings which make it possible to use TM FX output level settings closer to 0dB, but that this little difference in SNR is not audible.

See post #2 and #4 vinark .. but he doesn't seem to believe that it is simple like that.

Therefore I proposed to use his best measurement devices .. his ears.
But maybe he needs an official "amen" from designer level (->MC) perspective.

Yes maybe I misunderstood your posting.
It sounded to me (possibly understood wrongly) as if you would suggest to use the highest volume to reach highest dynamic.

> The OP is asking for advice on the best output setting, which is obviously the one that’s at the most powerful setting.

Sorry, I doubt this is correctly written / proposed.
As a starting point .. can we agree that everybody has a certain target volume which is comfortably for ones ears ?
On my UFX+ phones outputs this is
- output volume in TM FX set to -14 dB at reference level "Low" (Analog 9/10 OUT)
- output volume in TM FX set to -28 dB at reference level "High" (Analog 11/12 OUT)
I plugged my phones between 1st and 2nd phones output back and forth to ensure the same volume level.
With these settings I reached the maximum volume, more I do not want, to not stress my ears.

Well and now sound wise I hear no difference.
The only difference is, that SNR will be
- higher with output fader set to -14dB at ref level "low"
- compared to -28dB at ref level High

Similar logic like explained here, chapter 21.3
https://www.rme-audio.de/download/adi2profsr_d.pdf
https://www.rme-audio.de/download/adi2profsr_e.pdf

It makes no sens IMHO to say "Use the setting which gives you the loudest cans at max volume - best dynamics."
Max volume would be too loud .. you need to compare with equal / tolerable volume levels.
And then the lower ref level wins, as you can use it with the output fader closer to 0dB (to maximize SNR).

Does this make sense to everybody or did I misunderstand something ?

Hi Ramses, that's why I said it again and hopefully even simpler, cause you are right!
And someone else said the opposite

, which is true if you could listen at that max level, but you won't, way toooooo loud.

Sorrry ramses I think you’re right somehow we’re talking past each other. This is from the manual, and further emphasizes my point (especially with 300ohm cans):

“But isn’t +22 dBu, or Hi-Power as it is called in the menu, much too loud for modern phones? That depends. There are still phones that need higher levels. Music can be low in volume but consume a lot of power, especially with lots of sub-bass. And lots of headroom is always nice to have. Typically with Hi-Power off, which equals +7 dBu maximum output level, modern music and modern headphones, Hi-Power is mostly not needed. But you will notice that even with Hi- Power active, which requires to use a volume setting 15 dB lower as usual, the sound stays the same, and there is no audible noise or hum at the phones output (provided the source is clean, of course). So even at a Volume setting of -40 dB the ADI-2 DAC delivers perfect sound quality, being a no-brainer in daily use as how to set it.