1 Topic by Manuel (edited by Manuel 2024-04-08 10:14:09)

  • Manuel
  • Manuel
  • S/Mux specialist
  • Offline
  • From: Madrid, Spain
  • Registered: 2007-10-03
  • Posts: 241

Topic: [SOLVED] UCX II crashes when using multiple playback channels

[SOLVED] The problem was a bad USB connection, all working good after switching USB cables and ports.

I had never noticed this before because normally I only use one or two playback channels in TMFX simultaneously but, basically, the UCX II driver consistently crashes whenever I try to use several TMFX playback channels simultaneously. I have uploaded a short video here to show the problem  and the exact steps to reproduce it.

The problem seems to occur when either one or both of the following conditions are met:

  • The sample rate increases

  • The number of playback channels simultaneously receiving and audio signal increases

So, for example, at 44.1 kHz I can use 5 playback channels simultaneously no problem, but if I increase the sample rate to 192 kHz, the driver crashes almost immediately as soon as I try to use more than two playback channel simultaneously. I have tested various combinations of playback channel count and sample rate to confirm my assumptions, results as follows:

https://i.vgy.me/0KdX0p.png

Once errors occur, I can still use the hardware inputs and outputs (for example I can route my microphone signal to my headphones and that works), and it's only the playback channels that stop working. The only way I have found to get things back to working order is to power-cycle the UCX II. Any help appreciated!

My system details:

  • Windows 11 21H2 (OS Build 22000.2538)

  • TotalMix FX version: 1.93

  • Driver version: 1.249

  • Firmware version: USB43, DSP 31, USB (Clacc Compliant) 21

  • Kubrak
  • DAW Mastermind
  • Offline
  • Registered: 2023-08-03
  • Posts: 549

Re: [SOLVED] UCX II crashes when using multiple playback channels

I would not call it 'crashing driver', it just stops working.

Looks like problem with USB. Do you have your interface connected directly to computer, or you use USB hub? And have you tried different USB port?

The problem might be that capacity of your USB connection is rather limited.....

3 Reply by MC

  • MC
  • MC
  • Administrator
  • Offline
  • From: Germany/Thailand
  • Registered: 2007-04-06
  • Posts: 25,599

Re: [SOLVED] UCX II crashes when using multiple playback channels

The error counter says it all - USB with bad performance.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

MC's Website

4 Reply by Manuel (edited by Manuel 2024-04-08 10:07:02)

  • Manuel
  • Manuel
  • S/Mux specialist
  • Offline
  • From: Madrid, Spain
  • Registered: 2007-10-03
  • Posts: 241

Re: [SOLVED] UCX II crashes when using multiple playback channels

Kubrak wrote:

I would not call it 'crashing driver', it just stops working.

Looks like problem with USB. Do you have your interface connected directly to computer, or you use USB hub? And have you tried different USB port?

The problem might be that capacity of your USB connection is rather limited.....

MC wrote:

The error counter says it all - USB with bad performance.

You absolute saints!!! I was using the original supplied Type-C cable connected directly to my laptop's one Type-C port. I've just switched to a regular USB Type-A cable, and necessarily a different USB port, and now it's working as expected. It just didn't occur to me the problem could be the a flaky USB connection, since technically it was working. Had I been using a very long cable or a USB hub I would immediately have thought that might be the problem.

I've just tested the UCX II using a 10 m Type-A USB cable through a cheap unpowered USB hub and I am streaming audio on all playback channels at 192 kHz without a glitch–nice!

@MC Does the error counter in the Settings dialog report other errors besides USB connection errors? What does the error code format mean? For example, "1/17" like I was getting.

  • ramses
  • DAW Mastermind
  • Offline
  • From: UTC+1
  • Registered: 2012-10-14
  • Posts: 13,197

Re: [SOLVED] UCX II crashes when using multiple playback channels

> I've just tested the UCX II using a 10 m Type-A USB cable

USB2 usually max 5m supported length according to standards.
I would check for CRC errors in driver settings.
You need to keep the settings window open so that the CRC checks are activated.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14
  • Manuel
  • Manuel
  • S/Mux specialist
  • Offline
  • From: Madrid, Spain
  • Registered: 2007-10-03
  • Posts: 241

Re: [SOLVED] UCX II crashes when using multiple playback channels

ramses wrote:

> I've just tested the UCX II using a 10 m Type-A USB cable

USB2 usually max 5m supported length according to standards.
I would check for CRC errors in driver settings.
You need to keep the settings window open so that the CRC checks are activated.

Thanks. Do you mean the Fireface USB Settings dialog? TBH I've never run into any problems with a 10 m cable as long as the device on the end has its own active power supply. The USB standard says what it says but it seems USB controllers are implemented to tolerate slight deviations from the standard "just to be on the safe side", because there are probably many cables out there that wouldn't comply even at 3 metres.

  • ramses
  • DAW Mastermind
  • Offline
  • From: UTC+1
  • Registered: 2012-10-14
  • Posts: 13,197

Re: [SOLVED] UCX II crashes when using multiple playback channels

> Do you mean the Fireface USB Settings dialog?

Open it and you see there counters for CRC errors.

> but it seems USB controllers are implemented to tolerate slight deviations from the standard

For USB3 this is definitively strict, 5m cables do not work reliable.
I am not so sure, whether 10m works always so good with a 10 m USB2 cable, maybe you are only lucky in your setup using these components.

BR Ramses - UFX III, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1680v4, Win10Pro22H2, Cub14
  • Manuel
  • Manuel
  • S/Mux specialist
  • Offline
  • From: Madrid, Spain
  • Registered: 2007-10-03
  • Posts: 241

Re: [SOLVED] UCX II crashes when using multiple playback channels

ramses wrote:

> Do you mean the Fireface USB Settings dialog?

Open it and you see there counters for CRC errors.

> but it seems USB controllers are implemented to tolerate slight deviations from the standard

For USB3 this is definitively strict, 5m cables do not work reliable.
I am not so sure, whether 10m works always so good with a 10 m USB2 cable, maybe you are only lucky in your setup using these components.

It could be luck. Mabye I'm not pushing the connection hard enough. So far my UCX II has been running for over 8 hours non-stop over the cheap USB 2.0 hub and the 10 metre cable, literally 0/0 errors. Maybe if I try to use all available channels at 192 kHz I might get errors. Once I get my UFX back I will be able to test my 10 m cable with even more I/O, but that won't be until September (my UFX is in China at my wife's parent's place since before the pandemic... long story).