Hi Fables,

Welcome to the RME user forum.

I try to split the answers into a few postings.

First to your more generic questions

> So from my understanding this is what Totalmix allows me to do.
> However, it seams not all RME devises have TotalMix, and that is where it gets confusing.
> It seems only/mainly the interfaces have TotalMIx, but not the converters.

Devices are simply divided into recording interfaces, preamps and AD/DA converters. Recording interfaces establish the connection to the computer / DAW via USB or PCIe and require a digital mixer for control tasks (routing, loopback, integration of controllers, etc.).

The other devices are used to expand the number of channels and are connected to the recording interface via other digital interfaces such as ADAT, AES, MADI, AVB and Dante. This is a classic division of devices that every manufacturer follows in principle.

This is also a sensible approach because you have the lowest latency for monitoring within such a device network (e.g. via MADI). If all devices were connected to the computer via USB, then you would have to route via the DAW and would always have the full RTL (round trip latency) in audio flows between the devices.

Next important question is whether you want to be able to operate the recording interface in standalone mode.

An UFX III has DURec as feature so it would be possible to use it like a field recorder without having to use the DAW and to record to an USB stick. One would have to check, whether the stand-alone capabilities of this device would be sufficient for you. Theoretically you could save routing profiles into 6 user configurable slots. One would need to check whether this covers all your routing needs for standalone operation. Maybe also the configuration of channels will be stored that will be recorded by DURec. For sure you could basically store routings for your different use cases to monitor to different active monitors.

If I remember right there is an iPAD application of TM FX so that you can easier operate the unit in stand-alone mode.
You could also consider using ARC USB connected to the UFX III in stand-alone mode, to easier select one of the 8 snapshots which can have different routings for your monitoring.

The UFX III would be a fantastic device and is feature rich, but has only one MADI bus.

The big question is, how many analog I/O channels you need and whether you record in single or double speed.

If one UFX III with 8x analog I/O and two M-1620 Pro with 2x 16 analog I/O would be sufficient, then you could work up to double speed (88.2 / 96 kHz). If you work at single speed, then you can even connect up to 4x M-1620 Pro.

Max # of Ports, depending on sample rate and number of converters:
UFX III + 2x M-1620 Pro at single speed: 8 + 16 + 16 = 40 ports
UFX III + 4x M-1620 Pro at single speed: 8 + 16 + 16 + 16 +16 = 72 ports
UFX III + 2x M-1620 Pro at double speed: 8 + 16 + 16 = 40 ports

Then you could place the two M-1620 to the left and right to keep analog cables short and the UFX III where it fits best, to the left, right or in the middle.

Additionally you can think about connecting an ADI-2 Pro FS R BE for your main monitoring and headphones to make use of its unique features.

PC----USB2--------------+ for remote control with ADI-2 Remote and for firmware updates
| USB3                        | otherwise ADI-2 Pro being used in ADDA mode standalone in this setup
|     +---ARC USB         |
|   /  +--DURec            |
| /  /                            |
UFX III---ADAT1---ADI-2 Pro FS R BE---Main monitors and headphones
|      |
|      +M-1620 Pro
|      |
|      +M-1620 Pro
|       |
|       + ....
|       |
+----+   

optional: iPAD with TM FX application for operating UFX III in stand-alone mode

Thanks Ramses for your info, I know you are extremely knowledgable about these things from reading some of the replies you wrote on the forum, and also from trying to get through your spreadsheet. I much appreciate your help!

I don't necessarily need DUREC in the studio (we are using that in our live setup however, but that is a different story) as the way I work ATM is using the PUSH standalone to record. But it would not harm to have a backup & options etc. Still, not a requirement at this stage.

Also I typically record at 48KHz, although again, options & future compatibility are a bonus. I don't need a lot of channels per se, and generally not a lot at the same time (I only have two hands ;-)) but being able to route & record around the studio is useful to me. For instance, when using my SQ6 Mixer, I would route everything to the mixer and be able to quickly adjust volumes, add gates, compression etc such that I could play any instrument I want and not need any additional setup. Also easy if I have musicians come over for a jam – just plug in the mixer, go.

My current interface sends 64 channels to the DAW, and that is sufficient. But again, routing in/out etc is useful.

MADI always sends 64 channels per wire. If I would use three interfaces (contrary to your suggestion) I believe I could simply configure e.g. the synthesiser station to have two snapshots – one for standalone, one for "to the DAW" (as examples). Same for the keyboards station. Then, each of these could be connected with one MADI cable to the "main" interface (the desk station). Basically, once setup, I don't need to touch the TotalMix/interface part of the stations anymore, the setup runs local, and output via MADI should be the same for these as for a converter. Hence I don't see why there would be additional RTL or the computer's need to be running. Am I missing something there?

The core of my endeavour is to have the three "stations" independently, but also connected to each other/the DAW if needed.

If I use a converter (no TotalMix on the converter), it will not allow me to define a standalone routing on the converter, or will it?

If so, how could I instead achieve independent operation?

The disadvantage of AVB and Dante is that you have not the usual clock synch mechanism.
If you change sample rates, then you have to reconfigure every flow.

If you work with MADIface XT II (use the II here to get also RoomEQ), then each XT has three MADI busses.
And this is a lot of ports, why you might have issues with your PC if you need to connect both at the same time.

As you have so many different speakers for monitoring, you can't connect them to one XT alone, so you have to connect them partially to XT and other via MADI connected devices.

If you would work with two XT's then you would get audio in on e.g. device B, but the speaker might be at device A.

And then you always would have to route via DAW and .. need to keep everything on.

As I mentioned, best would be one recording interface, I would start with UFX III and under the assumption, that single speed is enough for the time being even for double speed there is headroom. UFX III and two M-1620 offer you 40 analog inputs and outputs as I listed already above.

The UFX III and the two M-1620 you would connect in a serial chain on the one MADI bus of the UFX III.

With this setup you have the freedom to work stand-alone or with the PC/DAW.
And you can route any input and sw playback channel to any output, no matter whether on UFX III or on any connected output on via MADI connected converter.

> I still can't see how a standalone setup would work

Without the UFX III being connected to the PC or the PC turned off. Then you can use the UFX III like a tape deck.
Audio is being written to external disk or stick, see separate thread on forum about pen devices for this purpose.
I am using a 256 GB Sandisk USB3 stick which is capable to transport audio without any break in between,
this is needed because the UFX III has no memory buffers, so it needs to be ensured that the external disk or pen device
can transmit instantly. Some devices can do, some not, depends on the controller.

I used this often for quick recordings of guitar through two tube amps (stereo setup) with external FX (Lexicon PCM 81 and 91). PC was on for the backing track but I was too lazy to fire up DAW. If there was a brilliant recording then I could plug the USB3 stick with the DURec file to the PC and import into the DAW which needs to support such a multitrack wave file or you need to use the tool from DAW to extract the audio tracks to single wave format files.

You can of course re-use your existing devices which are capable for MADI.
Even if the Pulse 16 does not support MADI out of the box you can upgrade it to MADI for a little upgrade fee so that it is a Pulse 16M.

Then you can base everything to a much better RME based solution with TM FX which will definitively be much better and more flexible compared to Focusrite digital mixer. I had Mixcontrol with a Liquid Saffire 56 in the past and it was a pain.
TotalMix FX is for me the complete opposite, flexible, logic, structured, powerful, user-friendly if you understand submix mode which is easy to understand (if you know that you have to understand a little and to not mix it with a normal analog mixing desk, as every HW output has an individual submix, only this you have to know and operation is easy and logic once you know how to operate it).

You also are getting rid of any complexity based on Dante regarding clock synch and which additionally requires configuration of QoS on L2 and L3 switches / routers.

You only need a few fiber patch cables, nothing tricky, no patch bays for fiber, you are no datacenter.
Simply get a few OM3 or better OM4 cables (multimode). Only do not bend too much but otherwise this is a simple "isi pisi" task. I have "multimode fiber" not only in my rig, but also in the living room for 10GBit LAN between two PCs for backup purposes.

Simply get plastic cable ducts, e.g. 1x1cm and stick them over plaster, e.g. on tile end strips, you can simply sink the multimode cables into them and at a corner with a 90° angle you simply don't bend them too tightly.

Congrats.

I will give you a few well-intentioned recommendations from my experience:

1. take a look at the RME online tutorials, which are refreshingly short and to the point and therefore don't waste any time. I would even recommend them before reading the manual to get a good overview.

2. leaf through the UFX III manual. Take a closer look at the things that interest you, and you will have learned something straight away. It is helpful to have seen how it is structured and what it says where.

3) I would also order the ARC USB directly because it simplifies the operation of TotalMix and is not that expensive. It fits perfectly to the right of the mouse so that it can be operated quickly with the right hand.

4) I would consider buying the ADI-2 Pro FS R BE for your main monitors. I am using two in my setup as I have everything in the living room and am using the PC also as music player, so one ADI for for recording corner, the other for the HiFi corner.

The following blog article describes the special features of these devices:
https://www.tonstudio-forum.de/blog/Ent … ses-EN-DE/
and the other the integration into your setup:
https://www.tonstudio-forum.de/blog/Ent … our-Setup/
Also look at the manual, it gives a nice overview of all features.

This allows you to enjoy the device-specific features and has the positive side effect that you can leave the output fader in TM FX at 0 dB. This also avoids accidental volume jumps if you accidentally load a snapshot or workspace with the output fader set to 0 dB instead of -30. This may happen if you have too high level-mismatches in your setup.
Please also read this useful posting from Mr. Carstens regarding this topic:
https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=25399

The ADI-2 Pro FS remembers the last volume and features such as auto ref level or slow ramp-up of volume if you insert headphones or switch between active monitors and headphones are very useful.

5. the following sticky posting gives a nice intro about TotalMix FX, some points I mentioned already above:
https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=34394

Last but not lest I would get a few multimode fiber cables.

The UFX III needs the bigger SC plugs, the other devices are using SFPs with the smaller plugs, so you will need OM4 multimode patchcables of around 1-3m in length with the suitable plug standards.
Assumed one device left, UFX III maybe at the center and the other Ferro right or whatever you prefer:

      Ferro#1(left)---LC----->-----SC---UFX III(center)---SC----->-------LC---Ferro#2(right)
          |                                                                                                          |
          +--------------LC----------------------<---------------------------------LC-------+

So you need 1x OM4  LC to LC and 2x OM4 SC to LC (which also covers the case vice versa).

The duplex cables have a clip you can make single cables out of it or keep the 2nd one unused.

I would directly order some spares for backup/safety reasons.

Have fun!