• cvor
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  • Registered: 2010-07-18
  • Posts: 6

Topic: No clue what to get

Hi everyone.  I need some suggestions and hopefully I have come to the right place.  I have been using the M-Audio Delta 1010LT for many years and am looking to upgrade.  My application is pretty basic.  I am a guitar player and use my PC in my tube amp's effects loop in conjunction with a TC Electronic G-System effects unit.  I am using Ableton Live 8 which allows me to route my guitar signal so I only hear it through my amp and the guitar synth so I only hear it through my stereo receiver.  Obviously, I use soft synths (really just sometimes though) and maybe one VST effect as well as the Ableton looper.  Midi Ins are important as I need them for the guitar synth interface and my g-system.

My PC info:

EVGA 758 mobo
i7 920 cpu
GEforce 8800 GTS 512 graphics card
6 gigs of ram
Windows 7 64bit

My current latency in Ableton is under 5ms at 48000 sample rate and 64 sample buffer.  The CPU is at about 2% or 3% when just running my guitar and I recall well under 10% with a soft synth running.


I have been reading about the Multiface 2 and the Fireface UC and now about just a PCIe with a breakout cable.  I have read the UC has good latency but would I expect something like what I have with the same CPU utilization?  I don't plan on doing alot of recording but live performance is important as is the quality of the connections as I don't want audio interference and ground loops given my tube amp (often using fairly high gain for hard rock sounds) and guitar effects.


Any suggestions and info about what performance (latency and CPU utilization) I would expect in my system given what the 1010lt currently provides?

  • From: Houston, TX
  • Registered: 2007-05-11
  • Posts: 1,191

Re: No clue what to get

IIRC - Performance Benchmarks have shown M-Audio is right behind RME's low-latency performance - so you should see a slight improvement under ideal conditions (assuming no incompatibilities or conflicts, etc).

I'm a PCI/PCIe fan (so Multiface/Digiface or one of the HDSP PCIe cards with analog I/O), but the FF400 and FF400UC seem to do well on compatible hardware if not a tiny bit behind the PCI/PCIe models.  PCI/PCIe seems to be more compatible overall. 

Don't forget about eBay wink  It's saved me thousands on RME gear fryingpan

cool

MADIface-XT+ARC / 3x HDSP MADI / ADI648
2x SSL Alphalink MADI AX
2x Multiface / 2x Digiface /2x ADI8

3 Reply by cvor (edited by cvor 2010-07-18 22:08:54)

  • cvor
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Re: No clue what to get

Thanks Randyman....

So the Fireface UC should have a little better latency and about the same CPU load as the 1010LT at the same settings?  The FF UC is supposed to have lower buffer sizes so I presume I should be able to go noticeably lower if using these settings (of course the CPU load will be greater)??  The 1010LT doesn't go below 64 samples.

So once this is certain -- what does anyone think about the cable connections given my high gain amplifier and the opportunity for audio interference and ground loops?  Is it better to have a breakout box that accepts balanced guitar cables or does it really make a difference if I just use the break out cables and use an xlr or RCA adapter?

I like the idea of a simple USB connection and having the balanced 1/4" connections for my guitar -- I just don't want my CPU being taxed more and want below 5 or even 4 or 3 ms latency.  I also want to retain my stable system since it is my only PC and I do everything on it.


Also, the Multiface does utilize firewire (which I read is a proprietary RME thing) when going to the breakout box to the card.  I don't know how much better this would be than usb.  If it is comparable, what PCIe card would someone recommend that just has breakout cables (the type that I need for guitar and midi)?



Thanks again

  • From: Houston, TX
  • Registered: 2007-05-11
  • Posts: 1,191

Re: No clue what to get

The Multiface/Digiface do not use Firewire - They use a Firewire cable, but are not using the Firewire protocol.  For all practical purposes, it is a PCI/PCIe interface with associated PCI/PCIe reliability and compatibility, and allows 32 sample buffers (plus the 32 sample safety buffer).  I'm more of a fan of the breakout box (Multiface) type interfaces as they allow a single connection to the PCI/PCIe card, and then you can keep your analog connections very short (put the Multiface in your Rack).  The Multiface is, however, a LINE LEVEL box (no preamps).  The FF400 and FF400UC will have preamps on board IIRC.

I'm not sure your guitar has balanced connections on it (very unlikely) - you'll likely need a direct box to balance it and convert it to Low-Z or use an interface that has sufficient High-Z inputs.

Since you are only running 10% CPU or so - you should be able to use practically any interface under the sun as long as it is compatible with your hardware.  USB and Firewire have a long track record of incompatibilities andcan be finniky where PCI/PCIe is generally more straight forward IMO.

USB will likely use slightly more CPU as that's the nature of USB.  PCI/PCIe doesn't have much overhead to speak of.  I run 5 RME PCI HDSP setups and I love all of them - never had a headache due to an incompatible FW or USB chipset across literally a dozen or more PC's now wink

cool

MADIface-XT+ARC / 3x HDSP MADI / ADI648
2x SSL Alphalink MADI AX
2x Multiface / 2x Digiface /2x ADI8
  • cvor
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Re: No clue what to get

thx for the info...  I think I am leaning towards the Multiface at this point.  I currently use some balanced cables for my gear (I am utilizing the effects send and return on the processor as well as the amp) -- except the cable from my processor input that goes directly into my guitar and the 2 cables (from my effects processor output and amp serial effects return) going into my Delta1010 (for those I use 1/4" to RCA).  I'm thinking that once I have a breakout box, I can go ahead and use balanced cables for the connections from my amp effects loop and my effect's processor output.  On the TC Electronics forum, they recommend using all balanced cables -- with the exception of the one going into the guitar as that would not work unless you have one of those fancy stereo guitars..


Now the question is-- is there a Multiface III in the works????  :-)