Topic: Understanding the middle row

So I am a new user trying to come to terms with Totalmix and in particular understanding the middle row.

With the top row everything is ok, when I raise and lower volume etc

Same with the bottom row - When raising or lowering volume for monitors it is reflected as one would expect

Now when it comes to the middle row I have windows and cubase both using AN1/2 if I mute the channel it does as expected and mutes anything coming from SW but if I raise or lower the fader it has no effect ! Why ?

I read this very good post, but it was a little difficult for a beginner https://www.forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=28844

Also I would like to make the faders bigger but when I opt for a bigger 135% some of the faders are off the screen and there is no scrolling option ?

Any help would be much appreciated

Re: Understanding the middle row

So on the bottom row of Total mix to the left I have HW outputs and on the right I have Control Room, this only has one fader named main, which seems to correspond to my headphones is this correct or should there be more in the control room ?

I notice that in some tutorials there are two faders in the control room ?

Re: Understanding the middle row

Could someone tell me a "Novice" how to set up separate faders in software playback for Windows and Cubase ?

4 (edited by ramses 2022-05-28 08:21:17)

Re: Understanding the middle row

Guess you wouldn't have TotalMix FX, then you would have to route everything in the daw/application.
This has a major drawback, because then you have the full RTL (round trip latency) in each audio flow.

BTW, this behaviour you would get when changing TM FX operational mode to "DAW mode", then the middle row disappears.
But I can not recommend this, you loose a lot of flexibility.

Instead of this use the power of TM FX. Its very easy once you know the basic priciple of operation and then all is clear.

In submix mode you can create an individual submix for each of the HW outputs in two easy steps:

1. select a HW output e.g. "AN1/2" (bottom row)
2. observe faders positions of HW inputs (top row) and/or SW playbacks (middle row) to check current routing
3. move faders of HW inputs (top row) and/or SW playbacks (middle row) to modify the routing to your demands

After selecting the HW output AN1/2 in submix mode, you will see "AN1/2" at the bottom of each fader in top/middle row.
This indicates which HW outputs submix you are working on.
The level meters support you to see, which channels carry audio.

When inspecting a submix (for a selected HW output) you can press/toggle the little button "sub" on the right side under "Layout Presets", then you will see only those HW input + SW playback channels which route audio into the selected HW output/submix "AN1/2".

So in submix mode all routing settings/changes are related to a particular HW output / submix, hence te name submix mode.
This you need to know/learn, to see routing from a submix perspective "what do I want to hear on this output".
And this can be something from HW inputs (with near-zero latency) or audio from PC through the SW playback channels.

This way you can create very flexible submixes consisting of
- audio from HW inputs (top row) with near-zero latency and
- audio from PW/applications (middle row) with the typical RTL (round trip latency)

For a quick start in terms of routing you can use this combination of reset mix then you achive the same routing as if you would use DAW mode

1. TM FX -> Options -> Reset Mix -> Total Reset - 1st of all a total reset
2. TM FX -> Options -> Reset Mix -> Straight Playback (this is like DAW mode, route all in on PC with DAW/application)
    Then Audio from PC (middle row) is being routed to the corresponding HW output (bottom row), e.g.:
    SW playback AN1/2 -> HW output AN1/2
    SW playback AN3/4 -> HW output AN3/4

Should you prefer that everything is being routed to Main Out, then use:
2. TM FX -> Options -> Reset Mix -> Straight Playback with all to Main Out

Fuirther information here, this leads you to other valuable sources of information
- step by step setup primer which I wrote to achive a nice 1st time setup
- excellent RME TM FX tutorial videos that do not waste any time, simply good information
==> https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=34394

BR Ramses
UFX+, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1650v4, Win10Pro21H2, Cub12Pro

Re: Understanding the middle row

Thanks so much for taking the time to respond to my question, however I can't quite understand everything. Is there a simpler way to explain, I am so sorry I can't quite follow

Re: Understanding the middle row

Assumed your main monitors are connected to HW output AN1/2
Configure a WDM device in RME driver settings for AN1/2 and select it as speaker device.
In windows sound settings you will see now this speaker device, make this to your Windows standard sound device.
Now all audio will be send to AN1/2 and in TotalMix FX you will see audio in SW playback AN1/2.

In cubase audio connections (F4), TAB "outputs", add a stereo channel and select AN3/4 as output.
You should save it as a preset as you most likely will need this also for any further project.
Best is to create a template with this settings.
In Cubase you need to use this output in your output routing, usually for your main stereo output.
I don't know your usual project organization, you might have channels which you send to different subgroups for drums, vocals, etc, which will have their output to another subgroup called maybe "mixbus".
There you can use mixing/mastering tools and the output of this mixbux might be finally "stereo out" which has finally an output routing to the defined output channel (-> F4 ...).
This audio you will see in TM FX under SW playback channel AN 3/4.

The rest is the standard TM FX routing, that every hw output has its individual submix/monitoring mix.
Select an output (bottom row) and the move e.g. faders of
- SW playback 1/2
- SW playback 3/4
to create the individual submix as you want/need to have, as I explained to you here:
https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.ph … 03#p188003

Please avoid to start different threads for the same thematic, thanks. Makes handling more easier, as everybody can see what has been told already to this topic to avoid redundancy as much as possible, as all explaining takes time.

BR Ramses
UFX+, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1650v4, Win10Pro21H2, Cub12Pro

Re: Understanding the middle row

The purpose of TM FX control room is simply, that you can use TM FX control room functions as dim, mono, etc.
Otherwise it makes no difference.

Use the "assign" button to define the channels for "Main Out", "Phones1".
As it makes sense that these outputs move to the TM control room.

But all this is explained already in other guides that have been written with the intention not having to explain this again and again wink

Please look here and start from ground up: https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=34394

I mentioned already that I wrote e.g. a primer for a good 1st setup and that there are also good RME tutorial videos.
Also the manual is very good, maybe look at it after the primer and the videos, then you understand it maybe better.

BR Ramses
UFX+, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1650v4, Win10Pro21H2, Cub12Pro

Re: Understanding the middle row

There is no option for Phones 1 only Phones 3/4 ?

Re: Understanding the middle row

Phones 3\4 is probably the output for phones 1

Babyface Pro Fs, Behringer ADA8200, win 10/11 PCs, Cubase/Wavelab, Adam A7X monitors.

10 (edited by ramses 2022-05-27 14:09:06)

Re: Understanding the middle row

Gents .. if you klick to the ASSIGN button in the control room, then you see clearly predefined functions as
- Main Out
- Main Out B
- Phones 1
- Phones 2
..
- Phones 4
..
If you move the mouse to any of these predefined channels, you get another menue where you can select, which of the HW ouputs should be e.g. Main Out or Phones 1.

BR Ramses
UFX+, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1650v4, Win10Pro21H2, Cub12Pro

Re: Understanding the middle row

Please add an information to your signature, what RME product you own.
I am pretty much sure that this is the same for each products supporting/having TotalMix FX.

BR Ramses
UFX+, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1650v4, Win10Pro21H2, Cub12Pro

Re: Understanding the middle row

I find all this very confusing.

As you say if I click on the assign I get options but not exactly as you describe !

It would be helpful to have some guidance on what typical setups might look like.

For example, I have never had a control room setting before so I have no knowledge of what it should look like or contain

13 (edited by ramses 2022-05-27 17:23:49)

Re: Understanding the middle row

> I find all this very confusing.

BTW .. you still didn't write, which product you own although I proposed this for e.g. this reason:

> As you say if I click on the assign I get options but not exactly as you describe !

Then pls post a screenshot of what you see.

> It would be helpful to have some guidance on what typical setups might look like.

I gave you information about a step by step primer for a 1st time setup, see post #4. Did you have a look at it ?

> For example, I have never had a control room setting before so I have no knowledge of what it should look like or contain

It doesn't matter for the routing part of a setup, whether channels are in the control room or not. The only difference is, that for HW outputs - that you assign to the control room as Main Out, Phones 1, etc. - you can use control room features.
I told you this already in post #7.

BR Ramses
UFX+, 12Mic, XTC, ADI-2 Pro FS R BE, RayDAT, X10SRi-F, E5-1650v4, Win10Pro21H2, Cub12Pro

Re: Understanding the middle row

The middle faders are what you see in your DAW. Clicking on a bottom fader you then have to alter the middle faders for each bottom fader (physical out). So to be clear depending on which bottom fader you click on it will be a totally different middle fader mix.

Babyface Pro Fs, Behringer ADA8200, win 10/11 PCs, Cubase/Wavelab, Adam A7X monitors.